Where does "allah" say...

[Gremlins]

جاهل​

كان ابت من طاب السؤال . هل لا فكرة معك ؟

(yay, I figured out how to get a backwards question mark!)

 

[ApplePie7]

Hi Bookofknowledge,

I'm sure everyone wants to show the greatest respect to Islam. It's the right thing to do. Hence, that teacher was careful not to name the teddy bear "Allah" because that would be blasphemous to Muslims. But the fact is to any Westerner, "Muhammad" is a common name used on many Muslim boys. I did a google and I found that the world's legendary boxer was called Muhammad Ali. He was a boxer, not even a Muslim cleric. Nobody accused him or any of those millions of Muslim males named Muhammad of blasphemy. Why then was the European teacher who called a teddy bear "Muhammad" thrown into jail and threatened with lashes of the whip and the people wanted her dead? If she had called the teddy bear Theodore, the Middle Eastern kids she was teaching wouldn't be able to relate to her. She picked a common Muslim name that would be more familiar to them and this is what they did to her. She was a good teacher whose goal was to help Middle Eastern kids have a good standard of education in a Middle Eastern cultural context. Of course, when she was finally released to her home country (nobility from my country also helped the negotiations), she said she never wanted to see another Arab nation again.

The question in a typical Western mind is: What on earth is the agenda of Muslims in general towards even people who are minded to help Middle Eastern children in the field of education? If they don't want outside help at all, they should make it clear. But the Middle Eastern countries do want teachers from Europe, particularly from my country very much. Their kings even send their kids to my school and other similar schools in my country. What then is their agenda? Why do they send conflicting signals?

I ask this question of you because you immediately assumed that applepie7 meant your prophet. But he didn't say Prophet Muhammad. The name Muhammad alone is a common Muslim name. Even a famous boxer in google was called that. So it appears that in that case, the people must have felt that naming the teddy bear "Muhammad" immediately referred to the prophet when the teacher had no such meaning. If the name alone is sacred, it should not be used so freely on almost all boys. Imagine if another boxer who's fighting Muhammad Ali tells the Press, "I'm going to smash Muhammad. I'm going to grind his bones to powder with my fist. I'll kill Muhammad!!! Muhammad is gone!!!" Won't thousands of Muslims cry for his blood even though he was evidently talking about Muhammad Ali? What if a father who has named his son "Muhammad" gets angry with the son and tells his wife, "Give Muhammad a slap!" Will the father be punished for this?

Really, what is the agenda?

You have great insight Beamishboy...

 

[beamishboy]

You have great insight Beamishboy...

Thanks, ApplePie7! I hope to get a suitable response soon.

 

[Gremlins]

جاهل​

هل تكلم انت العربية ؟ لا ؟

 

[ApplePie7]

Thanks, ApplePie7! I hope to get a suitable response soon.

Let's not hold our breath...

 

[ApplePie7]

هل تكلم انت العربية ؟ لا ؟

Appears that you are still hung-up on Modern colloquial Arabic – as if this somehow has any bearing whatsoever on classic written Arabic.

It doesn’t.

Further, classic Arabic does not contain backwards question marks either.

Please tell us the classic Arabic construct used to ask questions in classic Arabic…

 

[Gremlins]

Appears that you are still hung-up on Modern colloquial Arabic – as if this somehow has any bearing whatsoever on classic written Arabic.

It doesn’t.

Can you please point out the parts of what I wrote which are modern colloquial Arabic?

Further, classic Arabic does not contain backwards question marks either.

Well forgive me for using punctuation

Please tell us the classic Arabic construct used to ask questions in classic Arabic…

Well if you think I've done it wrong why don't you just correct me rather than being just difficult?

 

[Bookofknowledge]

Really, what is the agenda?

If I may request you, just let me speak to the person who I am addressing questions...

I will come back to you later.

 

[Bookofknowledge]

You have great insight Beamishboy...

Let me ask you again...

Can you confirm you have used common sense when replying to my question?

 

[Gremlins]

d
I'm sure everyone wants to show the greatest respect to Islam. It's the right thing to do. Hence, that teacher was careful not to name the teddy bear "Allah" because that would be blasphemous to Muslims. But the fact is to any Westerner, "Muhammad" is a common name used on many Muslim boys. I did a google and I found that the world's legendary boxer was called Muhammad Ali. He was a boxer, not even a Muslim cleric. Nobody accused him or any of those millions of Muslim males named Muhammad of blasphemy. Why then was the European teacher who called a teddy bear "Muhammad" thrown into jail and threatened with lashes of the whip and the people wanted her dead? If she had called the teddy bear Theodore, the Middle Eastern kids she was teaching wouldn't be able to relate to her. She picked a common Muslim name that would be more familiar to them and this is what they did to her. She was a good teacher whose goal was to help Middle Eastern kids have a good standard of education in a Middle Eastern cultural context.

There's a difference between a person and a teddy bear. You expect Muslims living here to live by our rules, right? Westerners are expected to do the same in Sudan (although the amount of anti-western feeling in places like Sudan does outstrip the silly xenophobia you see in places like Britain).

Of course, when she was finally released to her home country (nobility from my country also helped the negotiations), she said she never wanted to see another Arab nation again.

They weren't nobility, they were Muslim peers. Big difference.

The question in a typical Western mind is: What on earth is the agenda of Muslims in general towards even people who are minded to help Middle Eastern children in the field of education? If they don't want outside help at all, they should make it clear. But the Middle Eastern countries do want teachers from Europe, particularly from my country very much. Their kings even send their kids to my school and other similar schools in my country. What then is their agenda? Why do they send conflicting signals?

I'd guess that Middle Eastern countries want western educators, just not western educators who insult their religion Not hard to understand right?

Also: Oh God, a privately educated Tory. Beamishboy represents all that is irritating about Britain, and I would like to prefusely apologise on behalf of my country for his behaviour.

I ask this question of you because you immediately assumed that applepie7 meant your prophet. But he didn't say Prophet Muhammad.

What other Muhammad do you think he was referring to, in a discussion about the Qur'an?

 

[ApplePie7]

Let me ask you again...

Can you confirm you have used common sense when replying to my question?

You already asked this question....and you were answered...

 

[beamishboy]

There's a difference between a person and a teddy bear. You expect Muslims living here to live by our rules, right? Westerners are expected to do the same in Sudan (although the amount of anti-western feeling in places like Sudan does outstrip the silly xenophobia you see in places like Britain).

Your comparison of the two shows your injustice. In Sudan, there is widespread genocide of the Christian minorities. In Britain, apart from a few silly kids, there is no xenophobia at all. Immigrants are given better treatment than they get in their countries of origin even though they stick to their native culture, language and religion. They wouldn't be here, would they if they had been treated badly?

They weren't nobility, they were Muslim peers. Big difference.

If I need a lesson on what "nobility" means, I wouldn't ask you. The fact that we make peers of Muslims shows our lack of xenophobia. Any non-Muslim foreigner who's a citizen in the Middle East? Oh, I'm not even talking about making them peers.

I'd guess that Middle Eastern countries want western educators, just not western educators who insult their religion Not hard to understand right?

How has the teacher insulted the religion? You totally misunderstood my post. You missed the point about the universality of the use of the name Muhammad.

Also: Oh God, a privately educated Tory. Beamishboy represents all that is irritating about Britain, and I would like to prefusely apologise on behalf of my country for his behaviour.

You are in no position to apologise on behalf of Britain. I am quintessentially what an Englishman should be. A CoE altar boy studying in THE TOP public school, heir apparent to a most desirable coronet (though I pray the day will never come and my Dad will live for ever) and one whom you will be compelled to address in glorious terms should our paths cross. You do not speak on behalf of Britain. I do. My ancestors have spoken for our realm since the time of the Conqueror. You don't apologise for me. You are only permitted to apologise to me. Treat me the way your ancestors would've treated mine. That's all I ask for - simple protocol. I'm naturally assuming that you are a native but if, as is likely, you're an immigrant, it's a different story.

 

[Gremlins]

Your comparison of the two shows your injustice. In Sudan, there is widespread genocide of the Christian minorities. In Britain, apart from a few silly kids, there is no xenophobia at all. Immigrants are given better treatment than they get in their countries of origin even though they stick to their native culture, language and religion. They wouldn't be here, would they if they had been treated badly?

As far as I'm concerned Sudan is just a tragic african backwater. I'm not trying to condone what they did, but I can quite easily understand why the Sudanese were annoyed with this woman. It's called empathy.

If I need a lesson on what "nobility" means, I wouldn't ask you. The fact that we make peers of Muslims shows our lack of xenophobia.

Oh yes, a few token brown people, and one of the leading Conservatives in the Lords talks about <staff edit>in the woodpile'.

How has the teacher insulted the religion? You totally misunderstood my post. You missed the point about the universality of the use of the name Muhammad

.

Comparing the founder of a religion to a teddy bear could quite easily be seen as insulting.

You are in no position to apologise on behalf of Britain. I am quintessentially what an Englishman should be. A CoE altar boy studying in THE TOP public school, heir apparent to a most desirable coronet (though I pray the day will never come and my Dad will live for ever) and one whom you will be compelled to address in glorious terms should our paths cross. You do not speak on behalf of Britain. I do. My ancestors have spoken for our realm since the time of the Conqueror. You don't apologise for me. You are only permitted to apologise to me. Treat me the way your ancestors would've treated mine. That's all I ask for - simple protocol. I'm naturally assuming that you are a native but if, as is likely, you're an immigrant, it's a different story.

Deeply uncool:

1. Less than 3 million people attend Anglican churches in Britain.
2. How many people go to Eton? I assume you're talking Eton? (If not, Westminster? Harrow?). How many go to state schools? Who is more likely to have an objective view of British life?
3. 'Glorious Terms' ? What have you done to earn my respect, other than being born into the right family?
4. Your ancestors ran the country as their personal fiefdom with absolutely no regard for the wellbeing or freedoms of the vast majority of the population. They weren't there by merit, they were there by birth. Why should birth qualify someone for something like running the country?
5. My ancestors probably would have lynched you.
6. I am getting so <staff edit> tired of this bizzare sense of entitlement people like you. I've had to work to be successful, and work hard. What have you actually done than have a rich dad?

 

[Bookofknowledge]

You already asked this question....and you were answered...

I don't remember you answering my questions. Would you care to reply to my question one more time...

Can you confirm you used common sense when replying to my question?

It's a simple question you can simply reply to my question by saying "YES or NO"

 

[ApplePie7]

I don't remember you answering my questions. Would you care to reply to my question one more time...

Can you confirm you used common sense when replying to my question?

It's a simple question you can simply reply to my question by saying "YES or NO"

"Muhammad" used more than common sense, yes...

 

[Montalban]

Is this the end of debate as we know it?

 

[Bookofknowledge]

yes...

By your response, I accept your asnwer as "YES" to my question.

Why does it always have to be such a rush?
Why don't you ponder on how many teachings of Isa Ibn Maryam (AS) you have voilated?

Now going back to answering your question... Do you think one has to always address you by your real name when interacting/communication?

If your answer is "NO" then Qur'aan addresses my beloved Prophet with different names/titles and sometime it's given it's addressed to Prophet Muhammad (SAW).

 

[Montalban]

This is even less than merely uncool. What is our State religion? CoE What services do we attend in school? CoE. What prayers are said at school? CoE prayers. What hymns are sung at school? Hymns Ancient and Modern (ie CoE). What chaplains do we get? CoE. What is the religion of our beloved Queen? CoE. What is the religion of the majority of people in the UK? CoE although it's true - not many may attend church these days but that's not the point. Are numbers that important to you? There are four times as many sheep as there are people in Wales and do you advocate that the Welsh should bleat instead of talk? The number game is an American ideology.

You have a nasty habit of undermining your own point.

In this case you, personally have done this by showing on discussions about Mary that you don't even follow traditional CoE teaching.

The 'religion of the majority of people in the UK' is not CoE, which only accounts for 22% of the population - which is not a 'majority'. Perhaps you don't know what 'majority' means.

If you were to look at the largest single group, it's still not CoE, either, it's 'non-religious'. See:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom#Denominations_in_Great_Britain

 

[Philothei]

You have a nasty habit of undermining your own point.

and yet we are all are....."a voice crying out in the wilderness....."

 

[ApplePie7]

If your answer is &quot;NO&quot; then Qur'aan addresses my beloved Prophet with different names/titles and sometime it's given it's addressed to Prophet Muhammad (SAW).

Here are some Koranic epithets by which Jesus Christ is described...

&#8226; Preacher&#8230;.46.31, 46.32
&#8226; The Bright Morning Star&#8230;86.1, 86.2, 53.49
&#8226; The Truth&#8230;4.171, 47.2, 103.3, etc..
&#8226; Praised One (i.e. &#8220;Muhammad&#8221&#8230;3.144, 33.40, 47.2, 48.29
&#8226; One worthy of Praise (i.e. &#8220;Ahmad&#8221&#8230;61.6
&#8226; Messenger&#8230;48.29, etc&#8230;
&#8226; Lord&#8230;100.6, 108.2, etc&#8230;
&#8226; The Sacrifice&#8230;48.28, 108.2
&#8226; The Guardian of Paradise&#8230;48.29
&#8226; Asterism&#8230;53.1
&#8226; The Messiah&#8230;4.171, etc&#8230;
&#8226; The Word&#8230;4.171, etc&#8230;
&#8226; The Light&#8230;.sura 24
&#8226; The Most Gracious&#8230;sura 55
&#8226; The Sharp Sword&#8230;sura 57
&#8226; The Most High&#8230;.sura 87
&#8226; The Revealer&#8230;sura 94
&#8226; The Blood&#8230;sura 96
&#8226; Guardian&#8230;.86.4
&#8226; The Divine Decree&#8230;.97.1 - 3