WHEN WAS ISRAEL SET ASIDE ?

[readywriter]

Hi and today 2 Cor 3:16 explains how a Jew is saved today !

dan p

'Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord,
the vail shall be taken away.'
(2 Corinthians 3:16)

Hello @Dan Perez,

Interesting verse, thank you for sharing it.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[readywriter]

Hi and will not say anyone can be saved under the Grace of God !

Born again is not used by Paul !

In 1 Tim 1:16 Paul says that bhe mis the PATTERN of the ONES coming to believe on Him to everlasting life !!

Will you explain what the PATTERN , THEN IS ??

Do you want me to explain the PATTERN TO YOU , just ask and I will will be bibical !!

dan p

'Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.'
(1 Timothy 1:16)

Hello again, Dan,

Praise God!

I would appreciate hearing what you have to say on this subject, please.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

'Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.'
(1 Timothy 1:16)

Hello again, Dan,

Praise God!

I would appreciate hearing what you have to say on this subject, please.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi and since Paul is the PATTERN , here is what I see !!

#1 First Christ opens the HEART , Acts 16:14 !!

#2 In Acts 9:6 Paul trembling and terrified , he says , Lord , what do you wish me to do !!

#3 How important is the word LORD , and it reads in Rom 10:9 That if you should confess with your mouth the LORD JESUS , and should believe in your HEART that God RAISED you will bw saved !!

#4 Verse 10 reads , For with the HEART he believes to RIGHTEOUSNESS and with the mouth confesses to salvation !!

#5 Notice then 1 Cor 12:3 and what it says , Therefore , I make known to you that NO ONE speaking by God's Spirit says JESUS is Accursed , and NO ONE is Able to say LORD JESUS except by HOLY SPIRIT !!

#6 This means when in Acts 9:6 when Paul says to Jesus WHAT DO YOU WISH ME TO DO , Paul called Jesus Lord by the HOLY SPIRIT !!

#7 This is when Paul was saved and given his commission in Acts 9:15 !!

Another example of Paul's salvation , is found in 1 Cor 15:8 !!

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and since Paul is the PATTERN , here is what I see !!

#1 First Christ opens the HEART , Acts 16:14 !!

#2 In Acts 9:6 Paul trembling and terrified , he says , Lord , what do you wish me to do !!

#3 How important is the word LORD , and it reads in Rom 10:9 That if you should confess with your mouth the LORD JESUS , and should believe in your HEART that God RAISED you will bw saved !!

#4 Verse 10 reads , For with the HEART he believes to RIGHTEOUSNESS and with the mouth confesses to salvation !!

#5 Notice then 1 Cor 12:3 and what it says , Therefore , I make known to you that NO ONE speaking by God's Spirit says JESUS is Accursed , and NO ONE is Able to say LORD JESUS except by HOLY SPIRIT !!

#6 This means when in Acts 9:6 when Paul says to Jesus WHAT DO YOU WISH ME TO DO , Paul called Jesus Lord by the HOLY SPIRIT !!

#7 This is when Paul was saved and given his commission in Acts 9:15 !!

Another example of Paul's salvation , is found in 1 Cor 15:8 !!

dan p

'And he trembling and astonished said,
Lord, what wilt thou have me to do?
And the Lord said unto him,
Arise, and go into the city,
and it shall be told thee what thou must do.'
(Acts 9:6)

Hello Dan,

I can see that you have enjoyed making this study, and I appreciate your thoughts concerning the word, 'Lord', as it is uttered by Paul. My mind goes to Acts 26, where Paul tells Agrippa of his conversion on the road to Damascus:-

'Whereupon as I went to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests,
At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven,
.. above the brightness of the sun,
.... shining round about me and them which journeyed with me.
And when we were all fallen to the earth,
.. I heard a voice speaking unto me,
.... and saying in the Hebrew tongue,

"Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
.. it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks."
And I said, "Who art thou, Lord?"
And He said, "I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
.. But rise, and stand upon thy feet:
.... for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose,
...... to make thee a minister and a witness
........ both of these things which thou hast seen,
.......... and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;
............ Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles,
.............. unto whom now I send thee,
.. To open their eyes,
.... and to turn them from darkness to light,
...... and from the power of Satan unto God,
........ that they may receive forgiveness of sins,
.......... and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in Me."​

Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
.. But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem,
.... and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles,
...... that they should repent and turn to God,
........ and do works meet for repentance.'
(Act 26:12-20)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[readywriter]

'This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners;
of whom I am chief.
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'
(1Timothy 1:15-17)

Hello again, Dan,

The shewing forth of all long-suffering, by God, towards Paul, was the pattern, and what it wished to convey: that if God could save one, whom, by his own admission, was considered to be 'the chief' of sinners, having persecuted the church of God, then He could save anyone. That Divine long-suffering shown towards Paul, is what God, in His mercy and grace, shows to all men.

* Paul also uses the word, 'pattern,' again, to Titus in (Titus 2:7-8):-

'In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works:
in doctrine shewing :-
.. un-corruptness,
.... gravity,
...... sincerity,
........ sound speech,
.......... that cannot be condemned;
that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed,
having no evil thing to say of you.'

* God's long-suffering and grace, shown towards Paul, and towards ourselves, should be reflected in the manner of life that we live, as those who have been raised from the dead, and now walk before the Father in newness of life, in Christ Jesus.

* However the good works highlighted in the verse above is regarding doctrine particularly, isn't it? Those qualities listed are to be reflected in the doctrine we hold and seek to make known. Why? - see 1 Timothy 1:17:-

Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

'This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners;
of whom I am chief.
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'
(1Timothy 1:15-17)

Hello again, Dan,

The shewing forth of all long-suffering, by God, towards Paul, was the pattern, and what it wished to convey: that if God could save one, whom, by his own admission, was considered to be 'the chief' of sinners, having persecuted the church of God, then He could save anyone. That Divine long-suffering shown towards Paul, is what God, in His mercy and grace, shows to all men.

* Paul also uses the word, 'pattern,' again, to Titus in (Titus 2:7-8):-

'In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works:
in doctrine shewing :-
.. un-corruptness,
.... gravity,
...... sincerity,
........ sound speech,
.......... that cannot be condemned;
that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed,
having no evil thing to say of you.'

* God's long-suffering and grace, shown towards Paul, and towards ourselves, should be reflected in the manner of life that we live, as those who have been raised from the dead, and now walk before the Father in newness of life, in Christ Jesus.

* However the good works highlighted in the verse above is regarding doctrine particularly, isn't it? Those qualities listed are to be reflected in the doctrine we hold and seek to make known. Why? - see 1 Timothy 1:17:-

Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi and many say that Paul was the CHIEF OF SINNERS ?

I have 3 comments , here !!

# 1 The Greek text reads of whom I am ( the ) PROTOS / FIRST , not the chief of sinners !!

#2 Most counselor's like to say , see Paul was the Chief of Sinners , so there is HOPE for you !!

#3 , In Phil 3:6 Concerning righteousness which is in the LAW , having become FAULTLESS !!

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and many say that Paul was the CHIEF OF SINNERS ?

I have 3 comments , here !!

# 1 The Greek text reads of whom I am ( the ) PROTOS / FIRST , not the chief of sinners !!

#2 Most counselor's like to say , see Paul was the Chief of Sinners , so there is HOPE for you !!

#3 , In Phil 3:6 Concerning righteousness which is in the LAW , having become FAULTLESS !!

dan p

'This is a faithful saying,
and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners;
of whom I am chief. (first or'foremost)
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all long-suffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.'
(1Timothy 1:15-16)

It alters nothing, Dan. This is Paul's estimation of himself, A sinner saved by grace.

 

[Dan Perez]

'This is a faithful saying,
and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners;
of whom I am chief. (first or'foremost)
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all long-suffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.'
(1Timothy 1:15-16)

It alters nothing, Dan. This is Paul's estimation of himself, A sinner saved by grace.

Hi and I see that CHIEF stands ot and all will have to see the Greek text and see the the Greek word PROTOS means FIRST and not chief and the question points that Paul was the FIRST ONE saved by GRACE !!

And Phil 3:6 , under the Law , having become FAULTLESS !!

The B O C had to begin with someone and that someone was Paul Acts 9:6 and Rom 10:9 and 1 Cor 12:3 and to me IRREFUTABLE !!

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and I see that CHIEF stands ot and all will have to see the Greek text and see the the Greek word PROTOS means FIRST and not chief and the question points that Paul was the FIRST ONE saved by GRACE !!

And Phil 3:6 , under the Law , having become FAULTLESS !!

The B O C had to begin with someone and that someone was Paul Acts 9:6 and Rom 10:9 and 1 Cor 12:3 and to me IRREFUTABLE !!

dan p

Hello Dan,

We could argue about this, but it is pointless, for your mind is obviously set upon this explanation. However, I believe that the context refutes what you say.

I will leave it there,
May the Word of God be the arbiter,
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

'This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners;
of whom I am chief.
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'
(1Timothy 1:15-17)

Hello again, Dan,

The shewing forth of all long-suffering, by God, towards Paul, was the pattern, and what it wished to convey: that if God could save one, whom, by his own admission, was considered to be 'the chief' of sinners, having persecuted the church of God, then He could save anyone. That Divine long-suffering shown towards Paul, is what God, in His mercy and grace, shows to all men.

* Paul also uses the word, 'pattern,' again, to Titus in (Titus 2:7-8):-

'In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works:
in doctrine shewing :-
.. un-corruptness,
.... gravity,
...... sincerity,
........ sound speech,
.......... that cannot be condemned;
that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed,
having no evil thing to say of you.'

* God's long-suffering and grace, shown towards Paul, and towards ourselves, should be reflected in the manner of life that we live, as those who have been raised from the dead, and now walk before the Father in newness of life, in Christ Jesus.

* However the good works highlighted in the verse above is regarding doctrine particularly, isn't it? Those qualities listed are to be reflected in the doctrine we hold and seek to make known. Why? - see 1 Timothy 1:17:-

Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible,
the only wise God,
be honour and glory for ever and ever.
Amen.'

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi and it really began in 1 Cor 15:8 as Paul was one born out of due time /EKTROMA !!

So if Paul was born OUT of due time , WHO was born IN due time and when ??

This is why the B O C began with Paul , Acts 9:6 !!

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and it really began in 1 Cor 15:8 as Paul was one born out of due time /EKTROMA !!

So if Paul was born OUT of due time , WHO was born IN due time and when ??

This is why the B O C began with Paul , Acts 9:6 !!

dan p

Hello Dan,

No, for the approximate forty year period of the Acts of the Apostles, was a probationary period for Israel, in which opportunity was given for them to respond to the call made by Paul in Acts 3:20-21.

'Repent ye therefore, and be converted,
that your sins may be blotted out,
when the times of refreshing shall come
from the presence of the Lord;
And H shall send Jesus Christ,
which before was preached unto you: ... ... '
(Acts 3:19-20)

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

Hello Dan,

No, for the approximate forty year period of the Acts of the Apostles, was a probationary period for Israel, in which opportunity was given for them to respond to the call made by Paul in Acts 3:20-21.

'Repent ye therefore, and be converted,
that your sins may be blotted out,
when the times of refreshing shall come
from the presence of the Lord;
And H shall send Jesus Christ,
which before was preached unto you: ... ... '
(Acts 3:19-20)

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi and Acts 13:46 and Acts 18:6 and Acts 28:28 are all sign posts that there rejection of Jesus will be there destruction !!

But also predicted in Isa 6:1-13 and in Luke 13:6-9 are just a few !!

There is no PROBATION that I see is the above verses , do you ?

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and Acts 13:46 and Acts 18:6 and Acts 28:28 are all sign posts that there rejection of Jesus will be there destruction !!

But also predicted in Isa 6:1-13 and in Luke 13:6-9 are just a few !!

There is no PROBATION that I see is the above verses , do you ?

dan p

'And the next sabbath day
.. came almost the whole city together
.... to hear the word of God.
But when the Jews saw the multitudes,
.. they were filled with envy,
.... and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul,
...... contradicting and blaspheming.
Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said,
"It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you:
but seeing ye put it from you,
and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life,
lo, we turn to the Gentiles.'
(Acts 13:44-46)

Yes, @Dan Perez,

This happened in Antioch, and the warning and subsequent action was localised, for Paul in the next city he entered (Iconium) went, once again, to the synagogue and spoke to the Jew first.

'And when Silas and Timotheus were come from Macedonia,
Paul was pressed in the spirit,
and testified to the Jews that Jesus was Christ.
And when they opposed themselves, and blasphemed,
he shook his raiment, and said unto them,
"Your blood be upon your own heads; I am clean:
from henceforth I will go unto the Gentiles."
(Acts 18:5-6)

* Again, this was localised to within Corinth itself, for in Acts 18:19, in Ephesus, he once again first enters into the Synagogue and addresses the Jews.

* Whereas, in Acts 28:28, we witness the departure of the Jewish elders of the dispersion, after Paul quoted Isaiah 6:10 to them, in the face of their continued rejection of the Word of God concerning the Lord Jesus Christ. This was no localised warning, but the moment when Israel finally went away into blindness and unbelief. For Isaiah 6:10 is quoted on two occasions by the Lord, Himself, at a time of crises and rejection by the people of the land: so here also, Paul quotes it at a time of dispensational crises and rejection to the Jew outside of the land, in the dispersion.

* Forty is the number of probation: examples of which being in the days of Noah (Genesis 7:4, 17); and the wilderness wanderings (Numbers 40:33,34; Deuteronomy 8:2; Joshua 5:6); to mention but two.

* The Word of God spoken by Peter in Acts 3:19-20 is key to understanding this. Opportunity was given to Israel to obey God and repent, for forty years.

* The very number of years that the book of the Acts of the Apostles occupy is testimony in itself. For shortly after that, Jerusalem was destroyed in AD60, along with the temple, and the Jew was scattered among the nations.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

'And the next sabbath day
.. came almost the whole city together
.... to hear the word of God.
But when the Jews saw the multitudes,
.. they were filled with envy,
.... and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul,
...... contradicting and blaspheming.
Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said,
"It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you:
but seeing ye put it from you,
and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life,
lo, we turn to the Gentiles.'
(Acts 13:44-46)

Yes, @Dan Perez,

This happened in Antioch, and the warning and subsequent action was localised, for Paul in the next city he entered (Iconium) went, once again, to the synagogue and spoke to the Jew first.

'And when Silas and Timotheus were come from Macedonia,
Paul was pressed in the spirit,
and testified to the Jews that Jesus was Christ.
And when they opposed themselves, and blasphemed,
he shook his raiment, and said unto them,
"Your blood be upon your own heads; I am clean:
from henceforth I will go unto the Gentiles."
(Acts 18:5-6)

* Again, this was localised to within Corinth itself, for in Acts 18:19, in Ephesus, he once again first enters into the Synagogue and addresses the Jews.

* Whereas, in Acts 28:28, we witness the departure of the Jewish elders of the dispersion, after Paul quoted Isaiah 6:10 to them, in the face of their continued rejection of the Word of God concerning the Lord Jesus Christ. This was no localised warning, but the moment when Israel finally went away into blindness and unbelief. For Isaiah 6:10 is quoted on two occasions by the Lord, Himself, at a time of crises and rejection by the people of the land: so here also, Paul quotes it at a time of dispensational crises and rejection to the Jew outside of the land, in the dispersion.

* Forty is the number of probation: examples of which being in the days of Noah (Genesis 7:4, 17); and the wilderness wanderings (Numbers 40:33,34; Deuteronomy 8:2; Joshua 5:6); to mention but two.

* The Word of God spoken by Peter in Acts 3:19-20 is key to understanding this. Opportunity was given to Israel to obey God and repent, for forty years.

* The very number of years that the book of the Acts of the Apostles occupy is testimony in itself. For shortly after that, Jerusalem was destroyed in AD60, along with the temple, and the Jew was scattered among the nations.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi and read Isa 6:1-13 and 2 Cor 3:13-16 and see what you think of them ?

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi and read Isa 6:1-13 and 2 Cor 3:13-16 and see what you think of them ?

dan p

'In the year that king Uzziah died
.. I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne,
.... high and lifted up,
......and His train filled the temple.
Above it stood the seraphims:
.. each one had six wings;
.... with twain he covered his face,
...... and with twain he covered his feet,
........ and with twain he did fly.
And one cried unto another, and said,

"Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts:
the whole earth is full of His glory."​

And the posts of the door moved at the voice of Him that cried,
.. and the house was filled with smoke.
Then said I, "Woe is me! for I am undone;

because I am a man of unclean lips,
and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips:
for mine eyes have seen the King,
the LORD of hosts."​

Then flew one of the seraphims unto me,
having a live coal in his hand,
which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:
And he laid it upon my mouth, and said,

"Lo, this hath touched thy lips;
and thine iniquity is taken away,
and thy sin purged."​

Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying,

"Whom shall I send,
and who will go for us?'​

Then said I, "Here am I; send me."
And he said, "Go, and tell this people,

Hear ye indeed, but understand not;
.. and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
Make the heart of this people fat,
.. and make their ears heavy,
.... and shut their eyes;
...... lest they see with their eyes,
........ and hear with their ears,
.......... and understand with their heart,
............ and convert,
.............. and be healed."​

Then said I," Lord, how long?"
And He answered,

"Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant,
.. and the houses without man,
.... and the land be utterly desolate,
...... And the LORD have removed men far away,
........ and there be a great forsaking in the midst of the land.
But yet in it shall be a tenth,
.. and it shall return,
.... and shall be eaten:
...... as a teil tree, and as an oak,
........ whose substance is in them,
.......... when they cast their leaves:
............ so the holy seed shall be the substance thereof."'​

(Isaiah 6:1-13)

'But even unto this day,
.. when Moses is read,
.... the vail is upon their heart.
Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord,
.. the vail shall be taken away.
Now the Lord is that Spirit:
.. and where the Spirit of the Lord is,
.... there is liberty.
But we all,
.. with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord,
.... are changed into the same image from glory to glory,
...... even as by the Spirit of the Lord.'
(2 Corinthians 3:15-18)

Hello @Dan Perez,

When Israel shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Perhaps you would give me your thoughts on these two passages that you have brought to my notice.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dan Perez]

'In the year that king Uzziah died
.. I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne,
.... high and lifted up,
......and His train filled the temple.
Above it stood the seraphims:
.. each one had six wings;
.... with twain he covered his face,
...... and with twain he covered his feet,
........ and with twain he did fly.
And one cried unto another, and said,

"Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts:
the whole earth is full of His glory."​

And the posts of the door moved at the voice of Him that cried,
.. and the house was filled with smoke.
Then said I, "Woe is me! for I am undone;

because I am a man of unclean lips,
and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips:
for mine eyes have seen the King,
the LORD of hosts."​

Then flew one of the seraphims unto me,
having a live coal in his hand,
which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:
And he laid it upon my mouth, and said,

"Lo, this hath touched thy lips;
and thine iniquity is taken away,
and thy sin purged."​

Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying,

"Whom shall I send,
and who will go for us?'​

Then said I, "Here am I; send me."
And he said, "Go, and tell this people,

Hear ye indeed, but understand not;
.. and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
Make the heart of this people fat,
.. and make their ears heavy,
.... and shut their eyes;
...... lest they see with their eyes,
........ and hear with their ears,
.......... and understand with their heart,
............ and convert,
.............. and be healed."​

Then said I," Lord, how long?"
And He answered,

"Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant,
.. and the houses without man,
.... and the land be utterly desolate,
...... And the LORD have removed men far away,
........ and there be a great forsaking in the midst of the land.
But yet in it shall be a tenth,
.. and it shall return,
.... and shall be eaten:
...... as a teil tree, and as an oak,
........ whose substance is in them,
.......... when they cast their leaves:
............ so the holy seed shall be the substance thereof."'​

(Isaiah 6:1-13)

'But even unto this day,
.. when Moses is read,
.... the vail is upon their heart.
Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord,
.. the vail shall be taken away.
Now the Lord is that Spirit:
.. and where the Spirit of the Lord is,
.... there is liberty.
But we all,
.. with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord,
.... are changed into the same image from glory to glory,
...... even as by the Spirit of the Lord.'
(2 Corinthians 3:15-18)

Hello @Dan Perez,

When Israel shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Perhaps you would give me your thoughts on these two passages that you have brought to my notice.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi Chris , and I see where Israel was set maside in 2 Cor 3:13-16 !!

Today there is ONLY one program running to day , called the MYSTERY , in Rom 16:25 , is just one verse as proof !!

But if a JEW turns to the LORD ( Rom 10:9 and 10 ) Christ will saved him as the VAIL is taken away from the heart for that person to believe and be saved as no one can called Jesus LORD , except by the HOLY SPIRIT , as written in 1 Cor 12:3 !!

dan p

 

[readywriter]

Hi Chris , and I see where Israel was set aside in 2 Cor 3:13-16 !!

Today there is ONLY one program running to day , called the MYSTERY , in Rom 16:25 , is just one verse as proof !!

But if a JEW turns to the LORD ( Rom 10:9 and 10 ) Christ will saved him as the VAIL is taken away from the heart for that person to believe and be saved as no one can called Jesus LORD , except by the HOLY SPIRIT , as written in 1 Cor 12:3 !!

dan p

Thank you for responding, @Dan Perez,

With respect, the mystery concerning the Church which is His Body, the fulness of Him that filleth all in all, was still 'hid in God' (Eph. 3:9 & 1 Col. 1:26) when Romans and 1 & 2 Corinthians were written. So, the mystery referred to in Romans 16:25-27, is not that mystery written about in Ephesians 3; which Paul alone was given Divine revelation concerning. Though it could possibly have been the Mystery of Christ, also referred to by Paul in Ephesians 3, which had been revealed to all the apostles and prophets of the New Testament including Paul, and fits the description of Romans 16:25-26.

At the time when Romans was written the door was still open for Israel as a nation to repent, as preached by Peter in Acts 3:18-26. Individual Jews did indeed turn to the Lord, and the vail for them was taken away (2 Cor. 3:15-16), they consequently believed in the Lord Jesus Christ as their Messiah and King.

I don't wish to argue this with you, Dan, I acknowledge where you stand on this, and have now stated where we differ. God's Word must be the Arbiter.

May the Lord's will be done.
Thank you,
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Hi and when did I miss that verse , and you will provide it I hope ?

I have never read where Gentiles are under the NEW COVENANT ?

dan p

Well nowhere in the bible explicitly says that but that is where reasoning comes in. In the old testament, weren't there instances of non-jews being "grafted" into Israel? In fact, Jesus came through the lineage of Ruth who was not an Israelite.There was also a woman Rahab who was of the land of Jericho I believe. So the idea that outside people could be "grafted in" is an idea from the beginning because God's grace is for all people. So having said all that, the New Covenant is available to any member of the house of Israel which consists of all who believe.

 

[Guojing]

'Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy,
that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering,
for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on Him to life everlasting.'
(1 Timothy 1:16)

Hello again, Dan,

Praise God!

I would appreciate hearing what you have to say on this subject, please.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Paul was the first person to be saved under the grace dispensation. Here is my argument

Mark 3:28-29 (NLT) 28 “I tell you the truth, all sin and blasphemy can be forgiven, 29 but anyone who blasphemes the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven. This is a sin with eternal consequences.”

One might be curious, at least I was, on how exactly Saul was saved. If the Jews that stoned Stephen, blasphemed against the Holy Spirit, which Jesus said was an unforgivable sin, how in the world can God justify Saul? Remember, Paul was consenting to the stoning of Stephen. The latter was full of the Holy Spirit. By rejecting and stoning him, Paul was actually also committing blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

I believed the dispensation of grace began during Stephen’s stoning. Under the grace dispensation, there is no longer any unforgivable sin. Jesus’s proclamation of the unforgiveable sin was under the law dispensation, and when God decided to save Saul, he could do that righteously because of the change in dispensation.

The key verse is what Paul reflected in his letter to Timothy,

1 Timothy 1:15-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
15 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief. 16 However, for this reason I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might show all longsuffering, as a pattern to those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life.

A pattern is the first of more to come. Paul is the “pattern” for us members of the Church, the Body of Christ; the Apostle Paul being the “pattern” means he was the first member of the Church, the Body of Christ. He was the first to be saved under the dispensation of grace. Even though he blasphemed against the Holy Spirit, he was forgiven because the dispensation has changed into grace.

Thus, the Gospel of Grace by which we were and are saved now, is the same Gospel message that saved the Apostle Paul. In short, after the stoning of Stephen, the gospel of the kingdom was put on hold, and the gospel of grace became the gospel of which everyone is to be saved under.

This was confirmed by Peter's proclamation at the Jerusalem council in Act 15
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

This proclamation, by Peter, is very significant to me. The Council was first discussing that the Gentiles must be saved "as the Jews are", which is thru Mosaic Law.

But now, Peter is saying, the Jews must now be saved "as the Gentiles are".

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Paul was the first person to be saved under the grace dispensation. Here is my argument

Mark 3:28-29 (NLT) 28 “I tell you the truth, all sin and blasphemy can be forgiven, 29 but anyone who blasphemes the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven. This is a sin with eternal consequences.”

One might be curious, at least I was, on how exactly Saul was saved. If the Jews that stoned Stephen, blasphemed against the Holy Spirit, which Jesus said was an unforgivable sin, how in the world can God justify Saul? Remember, Paul was consenting to the stoning of Stephen. The latter was full of the Holy Spirit. By rejecting and stoning him, Paul was actually also committing blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

I believed the dispensation of grace began during Stephen’s stoning. Under the grace dispensation, there is no longer any unforgivable sin. Jesus’s proclamation of the unforgiveable sin was under the law dispensation, and when God decided to save Saul, he could do that righteously because of the change in dispensation.

The key verse is what Paul reflected in his letter to Timothy,

1 Timothy 1:15-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
15 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief. 16 However, for this reason I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might show all longsuffering, as a pattern to those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life.

A pattern is the first of more to come. Paul is the “pattern” for us members of the Church, the Body of Christ; the Apostle Paul being the “pattern” means he was the first member of the Church, the Body of Christ. He was the first to be saved under the dispensation of grace. Even though he blasphemed against the Holy Spirit, he was forgiven because the dispensation has changed into grace.

Thus, the Gospel of Grace by which we were and are saved now, is the same Gospel message that saved the Apostle Paul. In short, after the stoning of Stephen, the gospel of the kingdom was put on hold, and the gospel of grace became the gospel of which everyone is to be saved under.

This was confirmed by Peter's proclamation at the Jerusalem council in Act 15
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

This proclamation, by Peter, is very significant to me. The Council was first discussing that the Gentiles must be saved "as the Jews are", which is thru Mosaic Law.

But now, Peter is saying, the Jews must now be saved "as the Gentiles are".

So how were people saved before Paul?