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When nothing seems enough... do I give up?

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ArcticFox

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The issue I'm going to ask you about is neither simple nor easy. It's not short, either.

Let me start at the beginning. I came into a knowledge of the Lord at around age 18. I do not believe in particular "salvation" dates, but just know approximately the time when the Lord began his saving work on me. I see salvation as a movement of the Holy Spirit, bringing me into a knowledge of his Son and drawing me into a relationship with Him. I believe in the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, three but one, an eternally existing god who created all things and is in all things, and through which all things have their substance. I believe he is all-powerful, all-knowing, and all-sovereign.

After coming to this faith, I attended a variety of churches. I had experience with what I would call a very legalistic "fundamentalist Baptist" church. Forgive me if that offends. They demanded a great deal of control over congregants, banning things such as shorts on women, music with a beat, and going to the movie theater. I then attended a church that was highly charismatic, then a more mainstream Baptist church, then an Evangelical Presbyterian church. I became a member first at this church.

I attended college and met numerous Christian friends. I read through the Bible numerous times, became quite an amateur "Bible scholar," and participated in numerous debates, prayer groups, college Christian groups, and praise groups. I had a pretty well-rounded experience of a variety of different ways to worship God and to commune with him. Years passed. I got married, graduated college, and started working full-time as a teacher.

I struggled with a variety of issues, nothing overly serious. I often debated and tried to sway people back to the faith if they left, and I tried to learn when debate wasn't in order and simply cared for a friend. A leader of a church group once said to me, "You read and study the Bible more than anyone else I know."

Despite all of that, I have to admit that I was never content with my life. I always felt like I was screwing up. I beat myself up over even the smallest mistakes, though by far I'm not a perfectionist. I can't seem to let go of any big mistakes I've made. I never feel like I pray enough, I never feel that I'm pure enough, I never feel that I'm living to the standard I could and should be. I always feel judged by the people around me and by myself, and by God, no matter what I read to try to convince me otherwise. Sometimes, I feel like a fake living a phony lifestyle, pretending to be something I'm not.

Countless times I've "come to the cross," countless times I've gone through the "year to put guilt away." I've done a variety of things, gone to retreats, talked to pastors and elders, prayed, begged for forgiveness for a variety of things, yet I can't shake the feeling that I'm a fake, a failure, a bad person. I feel like everyone in my life is better than me, and that I don't deserve to happy, and that's why I never can be. I try to not think about it, I try to just focus on other things, but the feelings and the sensations remain.

I have so many desires that I can't shake, things the Bible would call carnal. I seem to live only for myself, and can't understand why I can't be different. Years of trying hard, years of letting go and letting God, years of trying to find a balance between the two, years of prayer, years of fellowship, and through it all nothing seems to change.

I feel like I can't play the part anymore, and pretend to be something I'm not. The Bible seems so completely empty to me, prayer couldn't be more worthless in my eyes. I've never really felt that God had done anything miraculously or even special or caring for me, that my life is just the product of my circumstances.

I came to a new church over two years ago. I live in Japan and became a member at a nearly all-Japanese church. I felt like I finally found a bit of a home... there were a lot of things that bothered me about the church, but I felt the fellowship was awesome and that this place could finally be a place where I could start to feel like I belong somewhere and to something. We had cell groups that we were very active with.

In time, it became obvious... the church was all about activities and not relationships, and that no one really ever talked to me. Despite my extensive ability to use Japanese in a variety of circumstances and to make jokes and to have fun using the language, people just weren't interested in me and didn't seem to care. After time, the church leaders decided to isolate all the non-Japanese into a separate cell group, composed of about 3-5 regular people, less if one person didn't show up. We had few activities, and did very little compared to our previous cell groups (all Japanese now). It seemed like we were being shoved aside. Sometimes, even when we only had one activity a week (versus the 4-5, or even 6 for the other groups), they would cancel it or cut it short. The only guy I thought that might have cared about me, I realized that he felt sorry for me and thought I needed a friend and pretended to be my friend, but he couldn't maintain the facade for long.

I'm married and had numerous friends in the US, I made a few friends here in Japan. I don't feel like I'm a needy or overly sad person. I kept my feelings of inferiority and discontent to myself, smiled a lot, joked a lot, and tried to be real and let people know about me little-by-little, as long as I felt the relationship was deep enough for it. I feel like I have a lot to offer people relationship wise, and that I can be a great friend.

So, I told the church that our situation was bad, it wasn't appropriate, and that we should be put back into regular cell groups. After asking me to wait for a month, they still said they hadn't decided. I waited another month, still, they said, "We don't know yet." I learned that they didn't really take any time to discuss, that they were "busy" with other things for those two months. Finally I was told, "OK, you can join a regular cell group." Next week, no, that's not true anymore. I said they have one week to make a decision... After a week, they said, "we feel your current place is best." Basically, "goodbye." I left.

This was sort of my last real attempt to feel real, to feel "good" about living and serving in God's grace. I tried to justify and say that this was God's way of helping me be sympathetic to people in this situation in the future, but in reality, I didn't feel that way. It seemed that I could just never feel at home, never feel like part of the family. I could never feel happy about who I am, not even in the blood of Christ's sacrifice.

I read and read the Bible, but it didn't give me any comfort. Praying seemed empty and pointless. Months have turned into years, nothing seems to "fix" this. I wait for God to make a move, I try to make my own move, I try to see a purpose or meaning in the people around me... Nothing.

So I attend church less now, I occupy myself with other hobbies and interests. I don't think much about God, or the Bible. I don't pray anymore, I don't read the Bible, and when I do attend church, I apathetically mouth the words to a few songs, and listen attentively to the sermon hoping that it ends a little early today. I don't give anything to the church because I just don't feel like it.

I haven't posted here in months, but long-timers here on these boards will know me. They'll know how fervently I fought the good fight of faith, how I tried to encourage and help others, how I crafted careful arguments defending key elements of the faith, and how I enjoyed good conversation about God and his truths.

So what now? I wait eagerly, hoping God will make good on his promise to go after the lost sheep. Many people wrongly believe that the story of the 1 sheep and the 99 is a story about bringing in new believers, but they fail to see that the sheep are already in God's fold, and the the wandering sheep is not an unbeliever but a believer who has strayed away from the shepherd. They also fail to see how God goes out and GETS the sheep, and brings it back... The sheep doesn't eventually wander back to the fold with a little encouraging words... The Shepherd goes after the sheep, uses his staff to drag the sheep by his neck back into the fold. If small enough, he'd lift the sheep up and carry it back. If necessary, he'd break the legs of a sheep that wandered too many times.

So here I am... I feel like I've been broken, but it doesn't seem to have helped at all. I don't feel like I've been brought back, I tried to get myself brought back, with no success.

So what now? When nothing seems enough, do I give up? Do I continue pretending to be something I am not? Do I endlessly wait more years for something I've never had, and have no current hope to have? Do I continue to believe on faith the things that have never seemingly been true for me? Where is the peace of God that surpasses all understanding? Where is the voice of my Shepherd? Where is the mother hen to wrap me in her wings? Where is the Father to love me and care for me, to guide me and lift me up? Where is the Holy Spirit inside me to empower me?

Now I'm just living my life, unable to tell my wife about the extent of my feelings. I'm living honestly, and when I stumble, I don't feel so bad about myself. I don't judge my actions all the time, and the surrounding judgment from others seems to fade slowly and surely. I feel free, and I start to feel like I can be happy. Am I being seduced by the cares of this world? Or am I being freed from the chains that I brought upon myself?

Once upon a time I felt freed by God's truths. But that is the very thing that came to feel like my prison. And now escaping is the only thing that seems to bring me light and grant me peace. Why do I feel so peaceful doing something that should be so wrong?

When nothing seems enough, what do I do? What else is there to do now but to give up? The years of trying have left me worse off, the years of praying for an answer have left me without a hope. If this God that we profess exists as he says he does, shouldn't he be here by now? Is he leaving me to wallow in my own self-loathing and emptiness? Why would he do such a thing, and for what purpose?

I'm so open and willing to be carried back to the sheepfold, but I'm still lost out in the rocks somewhere, and I feel all the happier for it.
 
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ephraimanesti

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When nothing seems enough, what do I do? What else is there to do now but to give up?
MY DEAR BROTHER--Was i you, i would recommend that you do what i did--read HE LOVES ME! by Wayne Jacobsen, the 1st edition of which is available as a free download load at:
http://lifestream.org/helovesme/index.html
Just click on "Download 1st Edition as a PDF file" button.

i think all your questions and concerns will be addressed by the time you get to the end of this short read.

I'm so open and willing to be carried back to the sheepfold, but I'm still lost out in the rocks somewhere, and I feel all the happier for it.
Funny, you don't strike me as being very "happier for it," but perhaps i am just mistaking your happiness, peace, and joy for something else i have suffered through myself and, by the glorious Grace of God, been delivered from forever.

ephraim
 
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ArcticFox

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MY DEAR BROTHER--Was i you, i would recommend that you do what i did--read HE LOVES ME! by Wayne Jacobsen, the 1st edition of which is available as a free download load at:
http://lifestream.org/helovesme/index.html
Just click on "Download 1st Edition as a PDF file" button.

i think all your questions and concerns will be addressed by the time you get to the end of this short read.


Funny, you don't strike me as being very "happier for it," but perhaps i am just mistaking your happiness, peace, and joy for something else i have suffered through myself and, by the glorious Grace of God, been delivered from forever.

ephraim

Hi Ephraim, thanks for the reply.

I briefly skimmed some parts of that online book, but to be honest, it seems like another of a set of books I've already read. It reads very similar to a number of other books I've read from various authors.

As for me not sounding happier, that's because this particular message is focusing on what I feel I've lost or what I feel was wrong with my past. I do truly feel more at peace and happier now than I did before, and that scares me in some ways.
 
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wayseer

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Once upon a time I felt freed by God's truths. But that is the very thing that came to feel like my prison. And now escaping is the only thing that seems to bring me light and grant me peace. Why do I feel so peaceful doing something that should be so wrong?

Have you thought that what you are doing is NOT wrong - and that it may be the very best thing for you to have done?

There is a difference between following God and following a Church.

I have attended a number of churches. One of the things I have realised is that people populate churches - and people get in wrong at times.

You are on a journey.
 
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Johnnz

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That was a really honest statement. Well done.

Out of your love for God and your study you have recognised that many things you were taught or exposed to at various churches fell short in some way. Throughout the Western world many sincere Christians have come to the same conclusion. Many are recognising legalism, programming, performance orientation, and irrelevance to much of life in our churches.

There is no simple solution. There are innovative churches who are working through those issues. There are Christian authors writing challenging material.

Feel free to PM me if you want to get some further information.

Bless you
John
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ephraimanesti

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Hi Ephraim, thanks for the reply.

I briefly skimmed some parts of that online book, but to be honest, it seems like another of a set of books I've already read. It reads very similar to a number of other books I've read from various authors.

MY DEAR BROTHER,

Yes, if you just skim it the book may seem similar to many others. However, i have found, (somewhat against my will being as i am of the Eastern Orthodox persuasion), that it contains the key and the power to make God's unconditional Love and Acceptance of us experiental rather than theoretical.

Reading back over your OP only reinforces my belief that this book will do for you exactly what it did for me--allowing myself to allow my God to enfold me in His gloriously unfathomable unconditional Love.

Regarding the rest of your OP, Wayne Jacobsen has also co-written with a friend--Dave Coleman--a book addressing your issues vis-a-vis the "church" and striving to follow THEIR "commandments" and meet THEIR expectations. This book, again a short fast read, is entitled SO YOU DON'T WANT TO GO TO CHURCH ANYMORE . It is also available on line as a free download at:
http://www.jakecolsen.com/contents.html
i downloaded the PDF version (1.9M) of the final printed page spreads of the book. There are several other formats available.

i fully realize, of course, that no book--with the exception of the Bible, of course--will change lives of provide you with ALL you need to get to where God wants you to be. However, from personal experience, i know HE LOVES ME and SO YOU DON'T WANT TO GO TO CHURCH ANYMORE will provide you with the tools necessary to deal effectively with your issues which are keeping you from being able to relax completely in the bosom of your Lord.

As for me not sounding happier, that's because this particular message is focusing on what I feel I've lost or what I feel was wrong with my past. I do truly feel more at peace and happier now than I did before, and that scares me in some ways.
If you will excuse me for saying so, your "focusing on what I feel I've lost or what I feel was wrong with my past" is roughly analogous to a person feeling bad regarding their incontinence at age 6 months or "deeply regretting" the loss of his baby teeth.

Get on with your life and don't look back--the welcoming arms of Abba await!

A BOND-SLAVE/FRIEND/BROTHER OF OUR LORD/GOD/SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST,
ephraim
 
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Zeena

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Dear ArticFox;

It is by faith through Grace that we stand, and it seems to me you have yet to apply your God given faith to believe in what you received when you received the Person of Jesus.

1 Corinthians 4:7
For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?

Are you aware that He is your Life, are you walking in the Light of that fact?

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

http://gracenotebook.biblemessages.com/pub/56
 
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Rich Baum

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HI BROTHER.

Surround yourself with fantastic Christian Music.
Music talks to us on 10-20-30 levels. You may be bored with just talk.
WORD sound waves tone harmony emotion good teach us.

Psalms 33 - JC was 33 - Record Albums were 33 1/3. :groupray::groupray: Make Music Bro !

w_w THEsecret tv Movie Trailer is worth a watch. 5-7 minutes.
JESUS tried to tell us, yet many don't see thses lessons. :confused:

THIS MAY "SPARK" YOU, Brother. :priest: Sing Too Bro
 
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Elijah2

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HI AF,

Well mate, are you telling my story and possibly the story of many other millions of Christians.

I am going to read right through your posting and will make comments.

Mate, you are no different to me, but I'm a grey-headed old coot.

There is nothing wrong with you, but you need to find your FIRST LOVE. Sounds like a good book to read, if there is a book called "FIRST LOVE!"

Mate, it's all about our Lord Jesus Christ, nothing more or nothing less.

The sad things about the church of today, they have lost our Lord Jesus Christ. They many talk the talk, but don't walk the walk.

I'll now go and have another read of your long letter.

Blessings.:)
 
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Elijah2

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Part 1 of 2:

Hi AF,

The issue I'm going to ask you about is neither simple nor easy. It's not short, either.
Anyone who says walking with our Lord Jesus Christ and running the race of endurance down the narrow path that has many “wide gates of destruction” is SIMPLE has rocks in their head, or are false.


Let me start at the beginning. I came into a knowledge of the Lord at around age 18.
I do not believe in particular "salvation" dates, but just know approximately the time when the Lord began his saving work on me.
I came to God in 1957 and came to our Lord Jesus Christ Sunday 15th September 1991.

I see salvation as a movement of the Holy Spirit, bringing me into a knowledge of his Son and drawing me into a relationship with Him. I believe in the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, three but one, an eternally existing god who created all things and is in all things, and through which all things have their substance. I believe he is all-powerful, all-knowing, and all-sovereign.
So far so good, and you began to know who you are and who are you in our Lord Jesus Christ?


After coming to this faith,

“This faith”, has a strange meaning to it?

I attended a variety of churches. I had experience with what I would call a very legalistic "fundamentalist Baptist" church. Forgive me if that offends. They demanded a great deal of control over congregants, banning things such as shorts on women, music with a beat, and going to the movie theater. I then attended a church that was highly charismatic, then a more mainstream Baptist church, then an Evangelical Presbyterian church. I became a member first at this church.
The word “member” jumps out at me, because in the CHURCH of our Lord Jesus Christ there is no such thing as “MEMBERSHIP”. From that comment about “the faith” and “member” I believe that you are suffering from “spiritual abuse”!


I attended college and met numerous Christian friends. I read through the Bible numerous times, became quite an amateur "Bible scholar," and participated in numerous debates, prayer groups, college Christian groups, and praise groups. I had a pretty well-rounded experience of a variety of different ways to worship God and to commune with him. Years passed. I got married, graduated college, and started working full-time as a teacher.
While doing all of that, did you really know who our Lord Jesus Christ is? Did you crucify your “SOUL”?

I struggled with a variety of issues, nothing overly serious.

Many Christians say that, but really the variety of issues may have many “spiritual issues” and were serious, because now you are crying out for help, and those nothing overly serious issues are ISSUES now!

I often debated and tried to sway people back to the faith if they left, and I tried to learn when debate wasn't in order and simply cared for a friend. A leader of a church group once said to me, "You read and study the Bible more than anyone else I know."
Ah, this is were the issue starts. You see mate, you have been running away from your issues that were serious and should have been dealt with at the cross.


Despite all of that, I have to admit that I was never content with my life.

There you are “Never Content”. We feel that way because there is a large open wound in our heart. Did you have a good, loving childhood with no issues whatsoever?

I always felt like I was screwing up. I beat myself up over even the smallest mistakes, though by far I'm not a perfectionist. I can't seem to let go of any big mistakes I've made.
Letting yourself go from BIG MISTAKES, is a good indication that you have problem with the three golden words, such as: I you please, I am wrong, You are right, Please forgive me, I forgive you, and I love you.

I you have trouble with speaking those words from your heart, then possibly you have much hurt and resentfulness down within the layers of your heart, and possible much “pride”, because you can’t forgive yourself.

I never feel like I pray enough, I never feel that I'm pure enough, I never feel that I'm living to the standard I could and should be.
Hey AF, get in line, I’m in the front!

I always feel judged by the people around me and by myself, and by God, no matter what I read to try to convince me otherwise. Sometimes, I feel like a fake living a phony lifestyle, pretending to be something I'm not.
So, you suffer from rejection, and possibly abandonment.


This is usually a sign of a double-minded man. Do you at times feel as though you are unstable, and you feel like blowing your stack, and kick the next door neighbours dog?

Countless times I've "come to the cross,"

Ah yes, but did you crucify yourself and go through the cross?

Have you read the “Crucified ONES”?

Read it, and you can get it off the Internet free at:
http://www.meatindueseason.net/newbold/or/crucified/crucifiedtoc.html

countless times I've gone through the "year to put guilt away." I've done a variety of things, gone to retreats, talked to pastors and elders, prayed, begged for forgiveness for a variety of things, yet I can't shake the feeling that I'm a fake, a failure, a bad person.
Mate, have you ever felt that a “dark shadow” has been following you? And everything that you do seems to slip through your fingers, like fine sand?

I feel like everyone in my life is better than me, and that I don't deserve to happy, and that's why I never can be. I try to not think about it, I try to just focus on other things, but the feelings and the sensations remain.
Mate, you need good and sound GOD-anointed Christian counselling by Healing ministry counsellors.


Have you read any books written by Neil Anderson, Derek Prince and Francis MacNutt?

I have so many desires that I can't shake, things the Bible would call carnal. I seem to live only for myself, and can't understand why I can't be different.

Yes, many of us live like that because we haven’t had our broken hearts healed, nor set free from captivity of bondage and strongholds.

There is another small book written called: “Christians Set Yourself Free” by Graham Powell. Read it!

Years of trying hard, years of letting go and letting God, years of trying to find a balance between the two, years of prayer, years of fellowship, and through it all nothing seems to change.
It doesn’t change mate, because you have been paddling your own canoe up the river, and watch all the other boats sail by.


I feel like I can't play the part anymore, and pretend to be something I'm not. The Bible seems so completely empty to me, prayer couldn't be more worthless in my eyes.

Yes, anyone who is carries hurts, offences, anger, and bitterness deep down within their soul and in the layers of their heart feels like this. Are you suffering from rejection?

I've never really felt that God had done anything miraculously or even special or caring for me, that my life is just the product of my circumstances.
Mate, Christian life is about relationship and fellowship with our Lord Jesus Christ and building that up is what they call “the race of endurance”. This race down that narrow path isn’t as easy as many try to make it out to be.


It’s all about HIM mate, and it’s all about how much can you give HIM when the time comes. HE uses me when HE wants me, and when I’m not being used, I just drift along in my way of life in the cesspool of the world being unequally yoked with unbelievers.

Mate, my life is no different to what it has always been, but I don’t do the things that I use to do. I still struggle with some things, but HE is bringing me to that position of overcoming and conquering those “nothing overly serious” issues!

I came to a new church over two years ago. I live in Japan and became a member at a nearly all-Japanese church. I felt like I finally found a bit of a home... there were a lot of things that bothered me about the church, but I felt the fellowship was awesome and that this place could finally be a place where I could start to feel like I belong somewhere and to something. We had cell groups that we were very active with.
And as I read this I can see that your heart is still empty, and possibly still carrying “empty deceit” from your previous experiences.
 
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Elijah2

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Part 2 of 2:

In time, it became obvious... the church was all about activities and not relationships, and that no one really ever talked to me. Despite my extensive ability to use Japanese in a variety of circumstances and to make jokes and to have fun using the language, people just weren't interested in me and didn't seem to care.
Did you feel that you were being ostracised and rejected?

After time, the church leaders decided to isolate all the non-Japanese into a separate cell group, composed of about 3-5 regular people, less if one person didn't show up. We had few activities, and did very little compared to our previous cell groups (all Japanese now). It seemed like we were being shoved aside. Sometimes, even when we only had one activity a week (versus the 4-5, or even 6 for the other groups), they would cancel it or cut it short. The only guy I thought that might have cared about me, I realized that he felt sorry for me and thought I needed a friend and pretended to be my friend, but he couldn't maintain the facade for long.
Mate, when falsehood comes in then it’s time to leave. He came to heal the broken-hearted, deliver them from evil, set the captives free, heal their sicknesses and cast out their demons.


Do you have a broken heart?

Do you feel that you are a captive?

Do you need healing?

I'm married and had numerous friends in the US, I made a few friends here in Japan. I don't feel like I'm a needy or overly sad person. I kept my feelings of inferiority and discontent to myself, smiled a lot, joked a lot, and tried to be real and let people know about me little-by-little, as long as I felt the relationship was deep enough for it. I feel like I have a lot to offer people relationship wise, and that I can be a great friend.
Mate, have you every been in a false religion or dabbled in anything that may have a from of darkness?

So, I told the church that our situation was bad, it wasn't appropriate, and that we should be put back into regular cell groups. After asking me to wait for a month, they still said they hadn't decided. I waited another month, still, they said, "We don't know yet." I learned that they didn't really take any time to discuss, that they were "busy" with other things for those two months. Finally I was told, "OK, you can join a regular cell group." Next week, no, that's not true anymore. I said they have one week to make a decision... After a week, they said, "we feel your current place is best." Basically, "goodbye." I left.
End of story mate, that is how most churches act when you put them on the spot.

This was sort of my last real attempt to feel real, to feel "good" about living and serving in God's grace. I tried to justify and say that this was God's way of helping me be sympathetic to people in this situation in the future, but in reality, I didn't feel that way. It seemed that I could just never feel at home, never feel like part of the family. I could never feel happy about who I am, not even in the blood of Christ's sacrifice.
Mate, do you really believe that the REAL Christian walk is simple?

Do you really believe that all that stuff is simple?

There is much that has been going on in the Body of Christ for decades, and there are many “out-of-church” Christians because of this stuff. Maybe, you can find some Christians who feel the same as you and you can start your own home group. Do you know that HIS CHURCH is where two or more are gathered in HIS NAME.

You past church was likely gathered in the name of the pastor?

I read and read the Bible, but it didn't give me any comfort. Praying seemed empty and pointless. Months have turned into years, nothing seems to "fix" this. I wait for God to make a move, I try to make my own move, I try to see a purpose or meaning in the people around me... Nothing.

Mate, our Lord Jesus Christ said to me one day when I was having a “pity party” with myself in church, and HE screamed at me: “CHRISTIAN Set Yourself Free!” Then I read that book I suggested to you earlier.

So I attend church less now, I occupy myself with other hobbies and interests.

I don’t attend church at all, and I have a couple of struggling Christian friends, and we gather together when we can. And I spend time writing, and posting on this forum and a number of other forums, and it give me great satisfaction to be talking to you, praying that I am making some sense in what I am writing to you.

I don't think much about God, or the Bible.
You feel this way because you never really had the “first love” experience with our Lord Jesus Christ. You belonged to a religion, and not “The Way” of life!

I don't pray anymore, I don't read the Bible, and when I do attend church, I apathetically mouth the words to a few songs, and listen attentively to the sermon hoping that it ends a little early today. I don't give anything to the church because I just don't feel like it.
Your heart is broken mate, and you need your “first love” back into your heart. It’s all about our Lord Jesus Christ, CHRIST-centredness, not about “head knowledge”.


I haven't posted here in months, but long-timers here on these boards will know me.

Welcome back AF!

They'll know how fervently I fought the good fight of faith, how I tried to encourage and help others, how I crafted careful arguments defending key elements of the faith, and how I enjoyed good conversation about God and his truths.
Well start fervently fighting a good fight of faith with me, and try to encourage me to help others, and to talk about our Lord Jesus Christ, our Almighty God.


So what now? I wait eagerly, hoping God will make good on his promise to go after the lost sheep.

Mate, HE has, you have posted this, and that is our Lord Jesus Christ tending and leading HIS SHEEP---you!

Many people wrongly believe that the story of the 1 sheep and the 99 is a story about bringing in new believers, but they fail to see that the sheep are already in God's fold, and the wandering sheep is not an unbeliever but a believer who has strayed away from the shepherd.
Mate, you hit the nail on the head. I see so many hurting Christians and I see most churches like an emergency ward at a hospital, blood and guts everywhere.

They also fail to see how God goes out and GETS the sheep, and brings it back... The sheep doesn't eventually wander back to the fold with a little encouraging words... The Shepherd goes after the sheep, uses his staff to drag the sheep by his neck back into the fold. If small enough, he'd lift the sheep up and carry it back. If necessary, he'd break the legs of a sheep that wandered too many times.
Well mate, my staff is pointed your way, so what are you going to do?


So here I am... I feel like I've been broken, but it doesn't seem to have helped at all. I don't feel like I've been brought back, I tried to get myself brought back, with no success.
Mate, your heart needs healing, and so does your soul. You have much buried deep down within your soul that needs to be healed layer by layer.

So what now?

Get help from a good GOD-anointed Christian counsellor, who is mature.

When nothing seems enough, do I give up?
You can give up what you never had!

Do I continue pretending to be something I am not?
So has your whole Christian life been a farce?

Do I endlessly wait more years for something I've never had, and have no current hope to have?
Mate, go a read 1 Corinthians 13, love never fails!

Do I continue to believe on faith the things that have never seemingly been true for me?
They were never true to you, because they were never true!

Where is the peace of God that surpasses all understanding?
Still sitting in the boot of the car, because it appears that HE didn’t sit in the passengers seat beside you. HE wasn’t driving the care, you were!

Where is the voice of my Shepherd?
It’s there, but you are not listening!

Where is the mother hen to wrap me in her wings? Where is the Father to love me and care for me, to guide me and lift me up? Where is the Holy Spirit inside me to empower me?
It’s all around you mate, mother hen is there, but the false church has blinded your sight, and buried the wrong stuff down inside of you, it’s eating up from the inside. You need healing mate, much healing.


Now I'm just living my life, unable to tell my wife about the extent of my feelings. I'm living honestly, and when I stumble, I don't feel so bad about myself. I don't judge my actions all the time, and the surrounding judgment from others seems to fade slowly and surely. I feel free, and I start to feel like I can be happy. Am I being seduced by the cares of this world? Or am I being freed from the chains that I brought upon myself?
Yes, those chains need to be broken through HEALING.

You are on your way back, if you will allow HIM to show you and to heal you. You have to get all that false garbage out of your life and be set free in HIS NAME.

Once upon a time I felt freed by God's truths. But that is the very thing that came to feel like my prison.

A prison is a stronghold that is run by strongmen!

And now escaping is the only thing that seems to bring me light and grant me peace. Why do I feel so peaceful doing something that should be so wrong?
Do you believe what you are doing is wrong?


If you believe this then the Holy Spirit is talking to you. It’s the enemy who makes you feel guilt and shame.

When nothing seems enough, what do I do? What else is there to do now but to give up? The years of trying have left me worse off, the years of praying for an answer have left me without a hope. If this God that we profess exists as he says he does, shouldn't he be here by now? Is he leaving me to wallow in my own self-loathing and emptiness? Why would he do such a thing, and for what purpose?
No mate, HE is not leaving you wallowing in your self-pity, but HE is showing you where you have been, and now you realise that it didn’t work.

Your not the first Christian to be there!

I'm so open and willing to be carried back to the sheepfold, but I'm still lost out in the rocks somewhere, and I feel all the happier for it.

No mate, you are not lost, but hurt and need lots of LOVE.

Blessings
 
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Zeena

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Hi Zeena,

I have tried in various ways to apply those, among many other, verses to my life. How is it that I am failing to apply them?
Because it's all you..

For you said "I have tried.."

Zeena said:
Are you aware that He is your Life, are you walking in the Light of that fact?
Isaiah 42:8
I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.

Have you read the link that was posted?

Our complicated explanations of the Christian Life have a major flaw. There is too much of me, my life and my effort in them.

Here's the link again;

http://gracenotebook.biblemessages.com/pub/56

It's not long winded, by no means..
 
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Zeena

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Mate, our Lord Jesus Christ said to me one day when I was having a “pity party” with myself in church, and HE screamed at me: “CHRISTIAN Set Yourself Free!” Then I read that book I suggested to you earlier.
John 8:36
If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Isaiah 42:8
I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.

Psalm 127:1
Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Zechariah 4:6
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.

Galatians 5:1
Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Romans 11:6
And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
 
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X=?

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Hi,

I've been in your shoes. So have many others, so have many in the Bible as well. Do you think any of them ever in the Bible were chosen for their perfectness?

I am a Christian, I also was a Christan, I also thought I was a Christian once. What I was though was a product of what I thought I should be and never took time out and listened. I busied my life so much I blocked all those quiet moments with anything and everything.

You may be thinking well this might be true for you but not me?
You may be saying well if only they knew what I know about myself?
You may say I have let God down on too many occasions?
I am a Failure …?
Do I call myself a Christian!
What kind of husband am I?
God is disappointed with me
God is angry with me
God doesn’t love me

I could go on and on and on but you know its all bull (excuse the french) that has the handywork of the Accuser all over it.

There is no condemnation in Christ Jesus, the very fact you are here, concerned and posting echoes sentiments of concern and in that love be it not the level you may think but its there.

How many of us here are aware of Satans lies, we all focus too much on the negative we forget the positive. I thank a close friend for the information compiled here today.

You are a saint (Eph.1:1; 1 Cor. 1:2; Phil.1:1; Col. 1:2)
You are adopted into his family (Eph 1:5
You are citizen of heaven, seated in heaven right now (Eph. 2:6; Phil. 3:20).
You are God’s workmanship – His handiwork –
(Eph.2:10)
You are a fellow citizen with the rest of God’s family (Eph.2:19)
You are righteous and holy (Eph. 4:24)

Be still and know that he is God, rediscover your friendship in him as you are for God loves you as you are and will not expect a midnight transformation. God wants a relationship as you are with him, not a religion of rules or nods or sit downs and amens. Just you as you are.
 
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ArcticFox

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I have to be honest in saying that I'm moved by the awesome responses, but this is all stuff I have heard many times, and tried to "let" happen. Even though I use the term "I" a lot, I'm not sure how else to phrase it.

I read the verses and I believe that I believed them and "let" them have their effect, but in the end, it didn't seem to "work out." It's hard to explain. I don't have the things that the Bible says I should, despite everything I did and didn't do.

Shouldn't God be doing what he said he would, and not waiting for me to fulfill some requirement? If I wasn't really saved and really believing those truths, I have no idea what to do to qualify as "really doing it."

Where do I go from here? What do I do, specifically? I can't think of something I haven't already done.
 
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X=?

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I have to be honest in saying that I'm moved by the awesome responses, but this is all stuff I have heard many times, and tried to "let" happen. Even though I use the term "I" a lot, I'm not sure how else to phrase it.

I read the verses and I believe that I believed them and "let" them have their effect, but in the end, it didn't seem to "work out." It's hard to explain. I don't have the things that the Bible says I should, despite everything I did and didn't do.

What does the Bible say you should have?

Shouldn't God be doing what he said he would, and not waiting for me to fulfill some requirement? If I wasn't really saved and really believing those truths, I have no idea what to do to qualify as "really doing it."

Be yourself, no more no less and come as you are to worship. God is no more distant than you are to him. I will never leave nor foresake you he told us all and its true God does not lie to think it is a lie to say it is a lie. He never left Job he just distanced himself and then Job on his own two legs without his spiritual baby walker still kept on going and all Job did was to praise God.

Where do I go from here? What do I do, specifically? I can't think of something I haven't already done.

How about praising no matter how you feel and crying out to God on your own and stop following the words of doubt and distrust put into your head by whatever/whoever. A life with God is not about what you've done and has been its about living and to be alive.
 
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Inklingchick

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Hi, ArcticFox,

This could be TOTALLY off base and obnoxious, but SOME of what you're describing (especially this bit:

I beat myself up over even the smallest mistakes, though by far I'm not a perfectionist. I can't seem to let go of any big mistakes I've made. I never feel like I pray enough, I never feel that I'm pure enough, I never feel that I'm living to the standard I could and should be. I always feel judged by the people around me and by myself, and by God, no matter what I read to try to convince me otherwise.)

...sounds like it could have something to do with a psychological disorder called scrupulosity. It's basically often something that happens when people with obsessive-compulsive disorder come to faith. MANY Christians have suffered from this over the years, and the Catholic church has recognized it for centuries. St. Therese of Lisieux had it, and John Bunyan, and St. Alphonsus Liguori. It has very distinctive characteristics, and one of them is an inability to come to a _feeling_ of certainty about what you _know_ to be true. Basically what it feels like subjectively is a busted conscience-- your conscience doesn't have the "no, that was not a sin," or "I've been forgiven so I don't need to think about it and feel guilty about it over and over" function operating properly.

Of course, with something like this, especially if it;s undiagnosed, it will kind of work itself right through your experience of faith, so that it seems like "just how Christianity is." But it is in fact something quite separate, having on a biochemical level to do with how one's brain uses the neurotransmitter serotonin. It's treatable, as other forms of OCD are, with SSRIs like Zoloft and Prozac.

Again, I could be totally wrong. But we are bodysouls, unified creatures, and how our brains function (or malfunction) obviously has a huge amount to do with how we experience our lives.

Google "scrupulosity," and a good book to read is called (cheesy title, but great stuff) "Can Christianity Cure OCD?" It's by somebody-or-other Osborn.

Let me know what you think. Obviously this would not be the whole solution-- but it might be a piece of it.

Susannah
 
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Ariel

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Arctic Fox, may I suggest a book? Joyce Meyer's Battlefield of the Mind may help you with some of the thoughts of not being good enough.

The mind is a battlefield. When I was ill with clinical depression, I found that if I could control the thoughts I could control the emotions. I think that may be true for you as well. Sometimes we are our own worst enemies, dwelling on the negative and thinking that nothing is good enough.
 
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