When does the resurrection of the dead take place?

[YSam44]

And he is...he also calls things though they are not as they are....because it is a sure thing...

So king David will rule over the house of Israel after he is resurrected from the grave her 30.9....
So tour correct...well done

 

[Noxot]

And he is...he also calls things though they are not as they are....because it is a sure thing...

So king David will rule over the house of Israel after he is resurrected from the grave her 30.9....
So tour correct...well done

and the jews believed in their days that the messiah was coming as a king that conquers. king david or any saint will never rule over me, i'm not an idolater.

 

[YSam44]

It is about the living never died people being caught up to meet them in the air.

There will be a rapture of the church/saints/belivers in Christ.

The ones left behind will have to endure the vials of God's wrath time.

You have jumped ahead with that last line...but those that are born again into gods kingdom at the time when the angels gather the elect from the 4 corners of the world...the dead first then those that remain...but as God plainly says... it is appointed unto man to die once... and thats amazing and Gods word does not contradict itself...so it is designated by God that we all must die a death... but we have a hope, the hope of the resurrection, that death may not hold us, that we will live again born again into the kingdom of god, or may live again that we may get to know the true God...Rev 20... 1 thess 4

 

[All4Christ]

Clearly stated the rapture should not be taught...it has no biblical truth to it

All I know is that Jesus will come back in glory and our bodies will be raised physically and our bodies will be glorified, after which we will experience the final judgment. What that is called doesn't really matter to me. We never call it the rapture in my tradition though. Whether we are caught up in the air or if we are just resurrected without that doesn't really matter honestly.

 

[Steve Petersen]

i've already posted a thread on the resurrection and now i think another element of the resurrection needs to be discussed.

when does the resurrection of the just and unjust take place?

On the twelfth of never.

 

[JohnRabbit]

On the twelfth of never.

thanks for your input?

 

[JohnRabbit]

and the jews believed in their days that the messiah was coming as a king that conquers. king david or any saint will never rule over me, i'm not an idolater.

then i hope you're ready for that "rod of iron" !

 

[Noxot]

then i hope you're ready for that "rod of iron" !

already been hit several times, eventually I found fire to be a better dwelling place.

 

[JohnRabbit]

already been hit several times, eventually I found fire to be a better dwelling place.

but seriously, why did you say what you did?

 

[YSam44]

and the jews believed in their days that the messiah was coming as a king that conquers. king david or any saint will never rule over me, i'm not an idolater.

Christ is coming to set up a kingdom on earth, a government... and yes, those whom Christ will put in charge under him will be in authority over those under them... parable of the talents... also

Isa 9.6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

also Rev 1.6 6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. Notice they will be kings and priest over someone....

john 14.2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

also In my Father's house there are many abodes; were it not so, I had told you: for I go to prepare you a place for you...

In context Christ is speaking about offices here... these will be offices for those in the first resurrection... remember christ was speaking to his disciples... not to the general multitude...

Also matt 19.28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Above we see the disciples will sit on 12 thrones judging the house of israel...guess who is over them... King David...

So see, you will be under authority as we will all be under authority when Christ sets up his government...

And those under those that are kings and priest will be worshipped by those under them..

 

[Steve Petersen]

Christ is coming to set up a kingdom on earth, a government... and yes, those whom Christ will put in charge under him will be in authority over those under them... parable of the talents... also

Isa 9.6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

also Rev 1.6 6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. Notice they will be kings and priest over someone....

john 14.2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

also In my Father's house there are many abodes; were it not so, I had told you: for I go to prepare you a place for you...

In context Christ is speaking about offices here... these will be offices for those in the first resurrection... remember christ was speaking to his disciples... not to the general multitude...

Also matt 19.28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Above we see the disciples will sit on 12 thrones judging the house of israel...guess who is over them... King David...

So see, you will be under authority as we will all be under authority when Christ sets up his government...

And those under those that are kings and priest will be worshipped by those under them..

I'll believe it when it happens. Been waiting 58 years. That is nothing though. The Christian world has been waiting for 2000 years.

 

[Noxot]

ah! humans have a problem with the kingdom of Caesar getting in the way of the kingdom that is Gods but I don't know Gods will for why he allows and orders all things as they are. so I rejoice with God for it is the surest reality, much greater is it than the concerns of this world!

it seems obvious to me that when I die I shall be set free from my flesh. but some people seem to think that the ultimate reality is this universe.

 

[JohnRabbit]

I'll believe it when it happens. Been waiting 58 years. That is nothing though. The Christian world has been waiting for 2000 years.

makes me think of these verses:

2 Peter 3:3-4(NKJV)
3knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts,
4and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”

the disciple asked Jesus about the time of the end and what will be happening and it's interesting that He said this:

Luke 21:24(NKJV)
24And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

the "times of the gentiles" was laid out in daniel 2!

when that prophecy is fulfilled the "Day of the Lord" will commence!

 

[expos4ever]

watching

OK, I believe I am now in a position to present an argument against the "rapture" interpretation of that famous text from 1 Thessalonians. I found something in my notes that is based on the thinking of respected theologian NT Wright. Not sure if I pirated his exact words or not. In any event, here is the argument:

Why, in 1 Thess 4, does Paul talk about "snatching the saints away"? I think that Paul is metaphorically alluding to three other stories – (1) the story of Moses coming down the mountain; (2) the story of Daniel 7, where the persecuted people of God are vindicated over their pagan enemy by being raised up on the clouds to sit with God in glory; and (3) the practice of that time of going out to meet the emperor at some distance from the city.

I suggest that when we look at these stories, it will become apparent that Paul never intended his readers to take the "snatching up in the air" reference literally. And this is not really surprising, Paul represents the final destination of resurrected man as being earth. If God really snatches people directly into heaven, He must then bring them back - a possible scenario perhaps, but it sounds a little odd. And as I think we can see, the 1 Thess 4 text is really metaphorical.

First, Paul echoes the story of Moses coming down the mountain (echoed in the 1 Thess text by “himself will come down from heaven”) with the Torah. The trumpet sounds in the Moses account, just as in the 1 Thess text, a loud voice is heard, echoed by the voice of the archangel in the 1 Thess text, and after a long wait, Moses comes to see what’s been going on in his absence, echoing, of course, Jesus’ return to Earth in 1 Thess 4 after a long absence.

Second, he echoes Daniel 7, in which “the people of the saints of the Most High” are vindicated over their pagan enemy by being raised up to sit with God in glory. Of course, in the New Testament version, this vindication is the resurrection of the dead and the transformation of the living.

Third, Paul conjures up images of an emperor visiting a colony or province. The citizens go out to meet him in open country and then escort him into the city – that is how you greeted an emperor in the culture in which Paul is writing. Paul’s image of the people “meeting the Lord in the air” should be read with the assumption that the people will immediately turn around and lead the Lord back to the newly remade world.

I am not making this stuff up. The allusions are clear and scriptural. Paul knows his Bible and is drawing on these images to construct an exceedingly rich metaphor for the transformation of the living at Jesus’ return.

Paul’s mixed metaphors of trumpets blowing and the living being snatched into heaven to meet the Lord are not to be understood as literal truth, but as a vivid and biblically allusive description of the great transformation of the present world of which he speaks elsewhere.

 

[mikpat]

The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are One—-the mystery of the Holy Trinity—-
All three in one—-omniscient, omnipotent, all knowing, perfection…..

 

[mikpat]

All the dead will rise again on the last day with their bodies and Christ on His second coming will judge all men. There the good shall finally be separated. When——only God knows,,,that includes Jesus Christ the 2nd Person of the Holy Trinity.

 

[John Davidson]

when does the resurrection of the just and unjust take place?

On the last day.

 

[ewq1938]

You see, the bible calls it a resurrection... or being born into the Kingdom of God...

No it doesn't. The resurrection is different than the living changing and then being raptured. The rapture only happens to those that are alive at the second coming who are changed into immortal bodies not resurrected. Only the dead in Christ resurrect and they do not get raptured because the dead in Christ are already with Christ. It is the living that are chang3ed that are on Earth and are raptured to meet Christ as he is making his second coming. You likely wonder why people need to meet Christ is he is already returning. They are scattered all over the Earth so the rapture gathers them together in one place to meet Christ also mentioned in Matthew 24.

 

[mmksparbud]

No it doesn't. The resurrection is different than the living changing and then being raptured. The rapture only happens to those that are alive at the second coming who are changed into immortal bodies not resurrected. Only the dead in Christ resurrect and they do not get raptured because the dead in Christ are already with Christ. It is the living that are chang3ed that are on Earth and are raptured to meet Christ as he is making his second coming. You likely wonder why people need to meet Christ is he is already returning. They are scattered all over the Earth so the rapture gathers them together in one place to meet Christ also mentioned in Matthew 24.

1Th_4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

 

[ewq1938]

1Th_4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

That's the resurrection of the dead not the living being changed and then raptured which is here:

The change of bodies for those who are alive at the second coming:

1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

The changing happens after the dead in Christ are resurrected. That's why Paul said the living cannot prevent the dead which means they aren't changed before the dead are resurrected.

The rapture of the living who were changed to immortality:

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.