What would falsify creationism?

DogmaHunter · Aug 12, 2015

bhayes said:
Believing in God is not the same as believing in something that it is made up, such as fairies.

I submit that you only see it that way because you actually believe in god.

The bible says that everyone has the propensity to believe that God does exist simply by observing creation and life.

All people (and probably animals too) have the propensity to believe that this isn't a still image, simply by looking at it:

Yet there are those who would suppress this truth

People having a tendency to be superstitious and believe in magic / supernatural things, is in no way supportive that these believes are actually justified and accurate.

People had a propensity to believe that time was a constant. That the earth was flat. That the sun went around the earth. Etc.

Believing X doesn't magically make X correct.

in favor of a life without knowing him and are choosing this because it lets them be accountable to nobody but themselves (I am speaking of atheists).

No. I'm an atheist because I am not convinced of the claims of theism.
Not because I want to "sin".
Be careful what you accuse me of, by the way.

Science does not disprove God

Because god is an unfalsifiable entity.
Just like fairies.

but if you can't simply observe creation and its majesty for what God created

Merely observing reality is not evidence of some random bronze-age claim.
Such bare assertions and declarations aren't going to convince me of anything.
You could replace "God" in that statement with anything and the merrit of the statement would remain identical.

then no matter how much you uncover scientifically you will never see the truth because you have believed a lie.

No, YOU are the one who is believing something.
I'm not believing the claims of theism.
YOU are believing the claims of theism.

You understand what "not" means, right?

Jan Volkes · Aug 12, 2015

bhayes said:
Believing in God is not the same as believing in something that it is made up, such as fairies.

Then would you please explain to me what the difference is?

paulm50 · Aug 12, 2015

KTS said:
Just as the title says. What evidence could show that creationism was wrong? And I am talking hypothetical here (I've seen that some people here have trouble grasping that concept).

The evidence is already here, the creationists have to know about it. Which is why in America they're so keen to not have evolution taught.

paulm50 · Aug 12, 2015

Oncedeceived said:
Which makes my point, even if they could get life to form, it would be from intelligent design. Intelligence is needed or it would happen in the real world. Even if conditions on the early earth were different, we don't know how they were and it would be from knowledge of how chemistry works to even succeed at the end goal.

Can you point us to evidence of this?

Whatever it is, it dismisses the bible story as fiction.

DogmaHunter · Aug 12, 2015

Oncedeceived said:
Which makes my point, even if they could get life to form, it would be from intelligent design. Intelligence is needed or it would happen in the real world. Even if conditions on the early earth were different, we don't know how they were and it would be from knowledge of how chemistry works to even succeed at the end goal.

You're making the same mistake again as in that evolution thread.

You are complaining about the fact that an experiment must be set up by a human before it can be conducted. And you pretend that somehow, that invalidates the outcome of the experiment.

Thereby, you are throwing all of experimental science out the window.

In other words, we are back to the "logic" from which follows that ice at the north pole is the result of "intelligent freezing", because it takes intelligence to "build a freezer".

AV1611VET · Aug 12, 2015

Dpierre said:
You are entitled AV. I don't care what the join date says with 3.4 million posts you were obviously here when God created the Earth.

DogmaHunter · Aug 12, 2015

SkyWriting said:
My dad had a lot of false teeth, so your odds are low.

Nice dodge.

Same question, try to answer this time.

Jan Volkes · Aug 12, 2015

Oncedeceived said:
Which makes my point, even if they could get life to form, it would be from intelligent design. Intelligence is needed or it would happen in the real world. Even if conditions on the early earth were different, we don't know how they were and it would be from knowledge of how chemistry works to even succeed at the end goal.

Have you never asked your Pastor or Preacher where the intelligent designer come from? who designed the designer?
Perhaps you can't ask in case it makes you look like an unbeliever, that would never do would it?

Jan Volkes · Aug 12, 2015

DogmaHunter said:
Nice dodge.

That wasn't a dodge because that's what he actually thinks happens, his ignorance of evolution is a testament to them all.

AV1611VET · Aug 12, 2015

Jan Volkes said:
Have you never asked your Pastor or Preacher where the intelligent designer come from?

I didn't have to.

I took a new converts class and was told "where He came from."

Jan Volkes said:
who designed the designer?

Probably the same one that named Him YAHWEH.

Jan Volkes said:
Perhaps you can't ask in case it makes you look like an unbeliever, that would never do would it?

QV my first sentence.

One of the first things a new convert should learn is that God is self-existent.

Jan Volkes · Aug 12, 2015

AV1611VET said:
One of the first things a new convert should learn is that God is self-existent.

Typical words used by con man so they don't need to explain anything, some others are, 'people will tell you I'm lying',
'only a fool would not believe', 'people will call you a fool for believing', 'God does things we can never understand'.
They are all good because every one of them is a tried and tested winner having stood the tests of time.

The con man doing the fooling knows that the very last person to know they are being fooled is the person being fooled,
even when the con man hears people telling the fool he is being fooled the con man knows that the fool will not believe them, why? because the fool doesn't want to believe he is being fooled, the person being fooled also will not allow themselves to believe that they would be fool enough to be fooled, everything acts against the fool, even the fool acts against the fool.

The fool doesn't stand a chance because the only one who can help the fool is the fool and they don't even know they need help.

AV1611VET · Aug 12, 2015

Jan Volkes said:
Typical words used by con man so they don't need to explain anything,

I take it you don't accept self-existence as a viable explanation for anything?

Where did the universe come from?

If you answer, "I don't know" and want me to accept that; can I say God is self-existent and want you to accept that?

Oncedeceived · Aug 12, 2015

paulm50 said:
Can you point us to evidence of this?

Evidence of what?

Whatever it is, it dismisses the bible story as fiction.

How?

Oncedeceived · Aug 12, 2015

DogmaHunter said:
You're making the same mistake again as in that evolution thread.

You are complaining about the fact that an experiment must be set up by a human before it can be conducted. And you pretend that somehow, that invalidates the outcome of the experiment.

Thereby, you are throwing all of experimental science out the window.

In other words, we are back to the "logic" from which follows that ice at the north pole is the result of "intelligent freezing", because it takes intelligence to "build a freezer".

No, it is not a mistake. In this situation, all the elements which need to be used are based on ad hoc knowledge that if not available would make it impossible to form life. No where on earth are we aware of life coming from non-living matter or chemicals. We do have ad hoc information that could aid us in producing life (theoretically) by using that information and knowledge on how chemicals react. However, chemicals do not react naturally in the way they would need to if they were to create life. So it takes intelligence to make it work if it ever works at all.

Once again it is your lack of knowledge in Biology that renders your argument inadequate.

Oncedeceived · Aug 12, 2015

Jan Volkes said:
Have you never asked your Pastor or Preacher where the intelligent designer come from? who designed the designer?
Perhaps you can't ask in case it makes you look like an unbeliever, that would never do would it?

I don't need to ask anyone. God has no creator. It is in the natural world alone that cause and effect are present.

Oncedeceived · Aug 12, 2015

Jan Volkes said:
Typical words used by con man so they don't need to explain anything, some others are, 'people will tell you I'm lying',
'only a fool would not believe', 'people will call you a fool for believing', 'God does things we can never understand'.
They are all good because every one of them is a tried and tested winner having stood the tests of time.

The con man doing the fooling knows that the very last person to know they are being fooled is the person being fooled,
even when the con man hears people telling the fool he is being fooled the con man knows that the fool will not believe them, why? because the fool doesn't want to believe he is being fooled, the person being fooled also will not allow themselves to believe that they would be fool enough to be fooled, everything acts against the fool, even the fool acts against the fool.

The fool doesn't stand a chance because the only one who can help the fool is the fool and they don't even know they need help.

21For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22Professing to be wise, they became fools,23and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.…

Jan Volkes · Aug 12, 2015

AV1611VET said:
I take it you don't accept self-existence as a viable explanation for anything?

Where did the universe come from?

If you answer, "I don't know" and want me to accept that; can I say God is self-existent and want you to accept that?

That is nothing short of moronic.

joshua 1 9 · Aug 12, 2015

bhsmte said:
Did people say it was falsified, or that there is no evidence to support it?

All of Creation is the evidence. God makes it evident so they that they are without excuse. Yet they did not Honor God or give thanks. Then Paul goes on to describe what pretty much looks like evolutionary theory to me. As we all know the theory goes back to the Greeks. As so much of science today goes back to the Greeks.

Rom 1:19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.21 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.…

22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.

In his letter to the Corinthian church Paul also talks about wisdom and foolishness. They claimed to be wise when they professed the foolishness of the Bible, but they were only professing their own foolishness. For this reason we need to instruct our young people to be wise and not to become foolish when they study science. As has happened to some.

paulm50 · Aug 12, 2015

Oncedeceived said:
Evidence of what?

How?

Evidence this is right.

"Which makes my point, even if they could get life to form, it would be from intelligent design. Intelligence is needed or it would happen in the real world. Even if conditions on the early earth were different, we don't know how they were and it would be from knowledge of how chemistry works to even succeed at the end goal."

It will have to be from the bible, or in a way that backs the bible story. Or the bible is wrong. That's the problem for creationists of any form. When they drop back to something like the bib bang or the firls cells being gods work. Because that's the only gaps science has to fill. They agree the bible starts with mistakes.

paulm50 · Aug 12, 2015

Oncedeceived said:
No, it is not a mistake. In this situation, all the elements which need to be used are based on ad hoc knowledge that if not available would make it impossible to form life. No where on earth are we aware of life coming from non-living matter or chemicals. We do have ad hoc information that could aid us in producing life (theoretically) by using that information and knowledge on how chemicals react. However, chemicals do not react naturally in the way they would need to if they were to create life. So it takes intelligence to make it work if it ever works at all.

Once again it is your lack of knowledge in Biology that renders your argument inadequate.

How did life start from nothing.

As I said, you have to start from the basis that Genesis is wrong to adopt that argument. Either god did it as the bible says, 6,000 years ago, or he didn't.

What would falsify creationism?

Code Monkey

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Code Monkey

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

Code Monkey

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

Well-Known Member

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

Senior Veteran

Senior Veteran

Senior Veteran

Senior Veteran

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency