What is Wrong with going to Church?

[New_Wineskin]

God provided the Bible as a way to grow in Him and to become more like His son Jesus...in order to walk His path. We are to be Christ-Like and in order to do that we need to read from scripture and learn and grow. Yes..talking to God is vital. But God provided THE WORD as a means of learning and growth in Christ His son and in God overall.

Jesus didn't give parables just for the heck of it. He did it to teach us...there are many important things God needs us to learn from His Word.

Well , if He gave you and those with you the "bible" for those things , great . He didn't give *me* the Scriptures for those things . The Scriptures certainly don't say those things about themselves ( at least not in referring to *me* ) . I am a Gentile and of the New Covenant - not the written code .

But , again , I am gald that He gave it to *you* .

 

[SteelDisciple]

Well , if He gave you and those with you the "bible" for those things , great . He didn't give *me* the Scriptures for those things . The Scriptures certainly don't say those things about themselves ( at least not in referring to *me* ) . I am a Gentile and of the New Covenant - not the written code .

But , again , I am gald that He gave it to *you* .

Then...you don't believe in Jesus our Saviour?

 

[New_Wineskin]

Then...you don't believe in Jesus our Saviour?

So , you are a liar and have decided to slander me ?

 

[SteelDisciple]

So , you are a liar and have decided to slander me ?

Ya didn't see the question mark? I just asked you a question. Do you believe in Jesus? The reason I ASK is because...how can you believe in someone you don't know anything about because you haven't read about him?

 

[New_Wineskin]

Ya didn't see the question mark?

If you saw *my* question mark , you would know that I *did* see *yours* .

I just asked you a question.

We both know what you did . *Nothing* that I wrote could be replied to starting with "then" followed by a question about my not believing Jesus when I clearly stated that I knew Him because I have a relationship with Him .

Do you believe in Jesus? The reason I ASK is because...how can you believe in someone you don't know anything about because you haven't read about him?

I know a lot of people who have not written me anything . You are claiming that those who cannot read cannot know the Lord .

Your doctrine does not hold water imo . It certainly isn't supported by the Scriptures which you claim are important . I even gave you evidence *from* the Scriptures that one does not need to read the Scriptures to know Him or about Him .

This topic can have its own thread .

 

[SteelDisciple]

If you saw *my* question mark , you would know that I *did* see *yours* .



We both know what you did . *Nothing* that I wrote could be replied to starting with "then" followed by a question about my not believing Jesus when I clearly stated that I knew Him because I have a relationship with Him .



I know a lot of people who have not written me anything . You are claiming that those who cannot read cannot know the Lord .

Your doctrine does not hold water imo . It certainly isn't supported by the Scriptures which you claim are important . I even gave you evidence *from* the Scriptures that one does not need to read the Scriptures to know Him or about Him .

This topic can have its own thread .

Doesn't hold water? All i'm saying is if you believe in Jesus, then reading about Him and reading his parables are extremely important to understanding and knowing him. They are letters from heaven basically.

If you don't believe in the bible then tell me...what about Revelation? How do you spot the signs to come if you've never read them? Or the life of Jesus..how do you know what Jesus went through in order to save us if you never read about it? Do THOSE hold up water? Those are more than minor details. And if someone never read the bible..they would never have known what Jesus went through...they would never LEARN all the lessons that came out of that situation.

 

[New_Wineskin]

Doesn't hold water? All i'm saying is if you believe in Jesus, then reading about Him and reading his parables are extremely important to understanding and knowing him. They are letters from heaven basically.

If you don't believe in the bible then tell me...what about Revelation? How do you spot the signs to come if you've never read them? Or the life of Jesus..how do you know what Jesus went through in order to save us if you never read about it? Do THOSE hold up water? Those are more than minor details. And if someone never read the bible..they would never have known what Jesus went through...they would never LEARN all the lessons that came out of that situation.

Since you have stuck your tongue at me at least 3 times and since you won't back up your own statements by what you yourself claim to be important before asking me whether I agree with them , I have decided for the sake of peace to no longer read your posts . take care .

 

[SteelDisciple]

Since you have stuck your tongue at me at least 3 times and since you won't back up your own statements by what you yourself claim to be important before asking me whether I agree with them , I have decided for the sake of peace to no longer read your posts . take care .

Yup. Thought so.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

Oooh! How nasty! What seminary?

Almost any of them. They teach their students the art of psychological/emotional manipulation, and mastery of the tools for accomplishing the "worshipful attitude" in their services.

BTW

 

[BeforeThereWas]

you know..i'm amazed at how many christians come up with so many stupid ideas. Like cussing being alright in the eyes of God...or living with your girlfriend and not marrying them...

Not trying to pick on you, but are you saying that a piece of paper from City Hall legitimizes a marriage in God's eyes? Where is that found in the Bible? Do you know the history of our so-called "marriage license"? Have you ever studied to find it? I can give it to you in a nutshell if you like.

The best way to stay right with God is to follow God's word...NOT get into other garbage that's written by OTHER people...

Yes, but those "other people" are making money on their writings. I mean, look at the tremendous things that have come about from the books on angels (as if there were anything to those screwy ideas). Billy Graham made quite a bit of money from his writing on that subject, although it may very well be utterly false when compared to the reality of the heavenlies and those who dwell therein. But he did make money, and lots of it. Angels just so happened to be a going fad at the moment. I'm sure someone will come up with another new fad bandwagon for famous writers to hop onto and make millions selling in their books.

BTW

 

[BeforeThereWas]

I also meant to ask if there is a way to get hold of that kind of material. Could you recommend a book or two where such tactics are described? If you have any notes or sheets saved up from seminary I wouldn't mind paying for a copy and postage.

I wish I still had that material, but it was cast out many years ago. One thing I can say is that by observing what's going on today, the academic content of seminaries has come a long way in their methodologies on emotional/psychological manipulation. I see similarities in what was taught way back when, but many advances have been made in the arena of "brainwashing" that was not so effective back then. We were taught, for example, manipulative tactics by use of vocal inflections, and pounding upon the pulpit, both of which pale by comparison to what I am hearing today. They are mastering an art best left alone. It appears that mass hypnotist specialists are now teaching in our seminaries, or are writing the material from which seminaries are teaching. Either way, the rudiments of psychology and psycho-manipulative tactics are being brought to bear upon a dumbed down, unsuspecting mass of people who don't realize what's going on.

Now, I'm not saying that most ministers are using this in a bad way that leads people to do strange things, like what we saw in "Toronto blessing" anomaly, for example. However, in the wrong hands, unsuspecting people have been falling prey to these operators for quite some time, and it will only get worse. There is a United Pentacostal organization down the street whose minister has mastered this dangerous art. He controls those people to an extent that is beyond remarkable.

I thank the Lord for His freedom that He offers to those who will simply accept it.

BTW

 

[BeforeThereWas]

I spend time with Him . Abraham hadn't a lick of the Scriptures and the Lord called him His friend . Any instructions that Abraham needed , He gave Himself - the very definition of the "New Covenant" . Abraham was referred to as "our father " in faith .

Genesis 26:5 is an interesting read about Abraham and the Law.

BTW

 

[New_Wineskin]

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Genesis 26:5 is an interesting read about Abraham and the Law.

BTW

Yep . Abraham only had what the Lord gave him . He had a personal relationship and , because of that , *we* receive the end product of the promises made to Abraham who had *no* Scriptures to obey .

 

[FLANDIDLYANDERS]

Then how do you get to know God? How do you know His wants for not just your life but the life around you?

Again..how can you follow God's instructions if you haven't read them?

Ever heard of common sense or discernment SD?

The Bible won't tell you which job to take, who to date or what Church to attend.

The Bible is useful, yes. But it is humans understanding of God, with some of God's inspiration chucked in... if God wanted to write to us directly, wouldn't Jesus have left an epistle or two? But God is more interested in hearing how we live God'svaluesand spirit, in seeing how we more humanly and naturally incorporate God into our world!

IMO

You may disagree,of course, yer welcome. But we who seek God in everything hear just as clearly from HolySpirit as a Bible worshipper would claim to.

Flan out.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

Yep . Abraham only had what the Lord gave him . He had a personal relationship and , because of that , *we* receive the end product of the promises made to Abraham who had *no* Scriptures to obey .

Um. That's not what that verse was talking about.

BTW

 

[New_Wineskin]

Um. That's not what that verse was talking about.

BTW

It wasn't talking about anything else .

 

[BeforeThereWas]

It wasn't talking about anything else .

What I meant was that the verse I mentioend is a direct quote of the Lord stating that Abraham had lived by God's commands, statutes and Law. It was an observation after Abraham had passed from this world.

BTW

 

[New_Wineskin]

What I meant was that the verse I mentioend is a direct quote of the Lord stating that Abraham had lived by God's commands, statutes and Law. It was an observation after Abraham had passed from this world.

BTW

Yes . That is what I was talking about . But , I was using the beginning of the sentence as well as the rest in what you referenced . Abraham lived by what the Lord told him personally and we are the recipients of the promises that the Lord gave to Abraham . The Scriptures record the concept at a later time . But , people think that *now* - at the present time - people are to obey the Scriptures while the Scriptures themselves say that Abraham didn't need them . So , why do *I* need to obey the Scriptures when I am a recipient of the promises made to Abraham before they came to be ? That is something I ask myself .

 

[strikerchris0411]

Some people don't believe in going to church because

1: They don't really want to hear the pastors interpretation of the scriptures.
2: They don't like church because, they believe that churchs are divided to much. Which they are considering Babtipts,CAtholics,Methodists, and many many more.
3:They just don't have the time because they work and they feel that they don't need to go to church because they already have a good relationship with god

 

[SNPete]

Some people don't believe in going to church because

1: They don't really want to hear the pastors interpretation of the scriptures.
2: They don't like church because, they believe that churchs are divided to much. Which they are considering Babtipts,CAtholics,Methodists, and many many more.
3:They just don't have the time because they work and they feel that they don't need to go to church because they already have a good relationship with god

Good point. May I add that some people don't want to "sacrifice" two hours a week to God. To be able to sleep in late or "go fishing" is more important to them. For some this is really the reason FOR NOT DOING CHURCH.