SPF
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- Feb 7, 2017
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But further in you neglect the point of existence. I'm not saying if the weather changes I have a separate reality. In your example my existence has not changed. I'm saying existence itself is no longer the same with respect to humankind. When we speak of God alone, He is the same, yesterday, today and forever and there is no shadow of turning. The same is not true for God's creation. If our existence is altered then the component of the equation has changed with respect to reality outcome. It is no longer the same reality.
If you think I neglected the point of existence, you may be correct because I'm not talking about the point of existence, I'm talking about the definition of the term reality and how we properly use it. That's the extent of my involvement in this discussion. I completely agree with you that God is immutable and that we are not. Our existence is "altered" every day, every hour, every minute. There are times in our life where our existence is altered dramatically, and times where our existence is altered imperceptibly. For example, in reality, I am now older than I was when I made my first contribution to this thread. My existence has changed.
I think the problem is that you keep using the term reality as if it is a thing. Reality is not a thing. It was not created by God, though certainly God has the power to control what is reality due to omnipotence.
Reality is only a description of what is. Whatever is, is reality.
We're not only speaking of experience we are speaking of existence and the quality of their state of existence.
What does this have to do with our understanding of the term "reality" and its proper usage? Nothing. Right now the reality I live in has me here at my office, living on earth, typing this reply. My belief is that after Christ returns, in reality I will be living here on earth with a redeemed body in the presence of Christ.
Best way I can think to respond is quote you in black, and my response in red:
Mankind has two destinies and they are separate destinies. I completely agree. Mankind does have two destinies, and they are separate.They are not judged by reality they are judged by Truth. I completely agree, "reality" does not judge anything because reality is not a thing. In reality, mankind will be judged by God. You are making postulates to me with no Biblical support. Again, theologically I haven't disagreed with anything you've said. There are many verses that indicate the Truth shall judge us but none that I know of that reality shall judge us. I agree, "reality" will not judge us because reality is not at thing. Jesus, whom I believe to be God, said I Am the Way, the Truth and the Life. Not "I Am the Way the Reality and the Life. Agreed. Stating there was never a time without a reality is superfluous to the argument since of course I believe reality has always existed in time, It's actually important to acknowledge that reality has always existed because it helps demonstrate that reality is not a thing to be created. and before time I might add. "What Is", with respect to existence however is not static or unchangeable with respect to creation.
Correct, because everything Jesus said and did was True.Again the Bible doesn't say "Truth is simply a description of what reality is or what reality will be." It does have God saying "I Am ... the Truth" as well as the Way and the Life.
It matches the definition perfectly fine. Reality does change. You've acknowledged this a number of times so I shouldn't have to rehash that. Reality is only a description of what is. What is, changes every day. Truth is that which corresponds to Reality. Honestly, that should be plainly obvious. It is true that I am sitting at my desk. Therefore, in reality, I am sitting at my desk. You cannot separate what is True from what is reality.Your statement also has a provision for a changing reality ("Truth is simply a description of what reality is, or what reality will be.") That does not match the definition for Reality either: the quality of state or being actual or true in objective existence." "What Reality will be", or will become, necessarily implies a state change, which would be a separate reality from the former.
Again, it's non-sensical to talk about multiple realities. Reality is not a thing, and it's not possible for there to be more than one reality. Reality is the totality of all that is. Right now the sun is shining bright and powerful out in space. That is reality. At some point in the future the sun could go supernova, at which point in reality the sun will have gone supernova.This misses the point. The state of the sun has not changed and I am not saying that makes for a reality. If, however, I said "the Sun is a star is a reality", it would only be so as long as it exists as long as that remains true. Otherwise perhaps many years from now it might be possible to say "Look at the Sun, it is a supernova spread across the solar system. The truth has made the state of those two realities of its existence "a quality of state of being actual in objective existence.
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