What if Adam had refused to eat the forbidden fruit?

[ewq1938]

There would only be personal sin.

There is only personal sin anyways. No one is born with anyone else's sin.

 

[adhidw]

If Adam had not sinned, He would have been Christ to her. There were no other men no other women. The loss of either meant they would be utterly alone. Adam had experienced being alone. He would be alone if He did not sin but not utterly alone. She would hate him for being a living contradiction against her. He would have to love her through that hate like Christ did us. She would have to accept salvation. He would have saved his generation of being born in sin. There would only be personal sin.

How would Adam have saved her , since Adam was not the creator ?, how then about us ?, since we were created before the foundation of the world too Eph1:4 ?

 

[fhansen]

Question: What would have happened if Adam
had refused to eat the forbidden fruit?

Assuming that Eve ate it and transgressed the command of God, but Adam did not.
Would she have been saved by Adam's obedience? Would humankind have been in a
fallen state as a consequence of her sin alone? Furthermore, if Adam had eaten from
the Tree of Life instead, how would that have further affected the situation.

I think that Adam hadn't, with his freedom, yet bound himself to the Ultimate Good: God, Himself. Adam was interested in exploring that which might lay outside God's will, not yet trusting God's wisdom and goodness, not yet recognizing his inescapble need for God.

So I believe that Adam, while created good, existed in a sort of moral neutral state in his relation to God to begin with. He must decide, with an act of the will, to draw nearer to God or further away, with no comfortable neutral ground to be had at the end of the day. And eating from the Tree of Life would mean to draw nearer while we know the outcome of eating from the other tree.

 

[Eloy Craft]

How would Adam have saved her , since Adam was not the creator ?, how then about us ?, since we were created before the foundation of the world too Eph1:4 ?

Because Adam had not severed his relationship with God. We no longer have the Grace of Paradise. All the gifts Adam and Eve enjoyed. The reason God had to come and save us was because ADAM sinned.

 

[Eloy Craft]

There is only personal sin anyways. No one is born with anyone else's sin.

Then there was no reason that God was Jesus' father? No reason for the Virgin birth? He could have had an earthly father. If He was born sinless anyway.
How is it a kid's first sin doesn't have the importance of damnation attached to it? Why did Paul say the things he did about Adam's sin? Why did the Psalmist say he was born in sin?

 

[adhidw]

Because Adam had not severed his relationship with God. We no longer have the Grace of Paradise. All the gifts Adam and Eve enjoyed. The reason God had to come and save us was because ADAM sinned.

did you also think angels could save her too?, since they were the faithfuls .

 

[ewq1938]

Why did the Psalmist say he was born in sin?

He said he was born because of a sinful act, not that he had sin when he was born.

 

[Eloy Craft]

He said he was born because of a sinful act, not that he had sin when he was born.

Psalm 51:5
5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.

Psalm 58:3
The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Who's fault do you see in these passages.?

 

[mindlight]

Question: What would have happened if Adam
had refused to eat the forbidden fruit?

Assuming that Eve ate it and transgressed the command of God, but Adam did not.
Would she have been saved by Adam's obedience? Would humankind have been in a
fallen state as a consequence of her sin alone? Furthermore, if Adam had eaten from
the Tree of Life instead, how would that have further affected the situation.

The rupture of sin would then have been between Adam with God and Eve without Him.

But casting out Adams companion from Eden would have resulted in his loneliness once more which Eve was supposed to be the answer for. Since she was now a fallen woman I guess it would have been sin for Adam to continue to sleep with her as he had before and so no children would have been possible and also no eventual Messiah.

So I see 2 possible scenarios:

1) God would have simply executed Eve and created Adam a new wife.

2) Some kind of redemption of Eve would have occurred. But what sacrifice would have been sufficient for that to happen if no Messiah could now be conceived? Probably Adam (still a perfect man) would have had to stake his life for her sake and for her redemption trusting that God would resurrect him and restore His wife. But I think they would have needed Divine counselling for a millennia or so to get things fixed.

 

[ewq1938]

Psalm 51:5
5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.

Psalm 58:3
The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Who's fault do you see in these passages.?

David and his mom.

 

[Eloy Craft]

did you also think angels could save her too?, since they were the faithfuls .

No. An angel could not restore her humanity. You can't give what you don't have. Remember that Scripture....

Hebrews 1:5
For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

 

[Eloy Craft]

David and his mom.

I agree with that. David is shapen in iniquity and his mom's womb was the place he was shapen. He sinned in the womb?

 

[Eloy Craft]

2) Some kind of redemption of Eve would have occurred. But what sacrifice would have been sufficient for that to happen if no Messiah could now be conceived? Probably Adam (still a perfect man) would have had to stake his life for her sake and for her redemption trusting that God would resurrect him and restore His wife. But I think they would have needed Divine counselling for a millennia or so to get things fixed.

I think your whole post is right. I think bodily death if necessary would result in Adam's resurrection. At this point Eve must reconcile with whom she receives the Word of God. She has offended both God and Adam. Her matrimonial bond with her savior is a great benefit, her being utterly alone is death to her. A mysterious experience for her to be alone. Not so for Adam. If she doesn't choose salvation that is her alternative. To her it would have seemed like death. Being alone is what Adam suffered in this scenario and her sinful recoil from Adam isn't hatred of a state of being she hadn't experienced personally. She would have remembered that with him and a state of death without him. It seems to me that Adam's mission isn't as heavy as Christ's and Eve's acceptance isn't as difficult as ours.

Adam's generation would not be born in sin if Eve sinned and he didn't but....

 

[Saint Steven]

Sooner or later someone would have sinned, I think.

Right. Then we would have had both pre-Fall and post-Fall ancestors.
Quite a curve ball to grace theology. Romans 3:23 would have to read as follows:

… for most have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

 

[Saint Steven]

First off this would mean Adam truly Loved God more than he loved Eve, but how did Adam obtain such a Godly type Love without first sinning?
Adam had been with Eve long enough to say Adam was "with" Eve which denotes a oneness with Eve.

On that basis what would the conclusion be?

 

[Saint Steven]

If Adam had not sinned, He would have been Christ to her. There were no other men no other women. The loss of either meant they would be utterly alone. Adam had experienced being alone. He would be alone if He did not sin but not utterly alone. She would hate him for being a living contradiction against her. He would have to love her through that hate like Christ did us. She would have to accept salvation. He would have saved his generation of being born in sin. There would only be personal sin.

Thanks for your thoughtful and intelligent response.
That is a reasonable hypothesis.

 

[JoeP222w]

Question: What would have happened if Adam
had refused to eat the forbidden fruit?

Assuming that Eve ate it and transgressed the command of God, but Adam did not.
Would she have been saved by Adam's obedience? Would humankind have been in a
fallen state as a consequence of her sin alone? Furthermore, if Adam had eaten from
the Tree of Life instead, how would that have further affected the situation.

It is a moot point since Adam did indeed eat the fruit, because it was part of God's sovereign decree.

 

[Saint Steven]

mindlight said: ↑
2) Some kind of redemption of Eve would have occurred. But what sacrifice would have been sufficient for that to happen if no Messiah could now be conceived? Probably Adam (still a perfect man) would have had to stake his life for her sake and for her redemption trusting that God would resurrect him and restore His wife. But I think they would have needed Divine counselling for a millennia or so to get things fixed.

I think your whole post is right. I think bodily death if necessary would result in Adam's resurrection. At this point Eve must reconcile with whom she receives the Word of God. She has offended both God and Adam. Her matrimonial bond with her savior is a great benefit, her being utterly alone is death to her. A mysterious experience for her to be alone. Not so for Adam. If she doesn't choose salvation that is her alternative. To her it would have seemed like death. Being alone is what Adam suffered in this scenario and her sinful recoil from Adam isn't hatred of a state of being she hadn't experienced personally. She would have remembered that with him and a state of death without him. It seems to me that Adam's mission isn't as heavy as Christ's and Eve's acceptance isn't as difficult as ours.

Adam's generation would not be born in sin if Eve sinned and he didn't but....

Thanks guys. (I had to paste mindlight's post at the top it was missing)

I was just thinking about the genetic mess that would occur in the offspring of Adam and Eve, if she was fallen and he was not.

Imagine the moment when parents realized that a child was either "innocent" or fallen.
Giving each other that knowing look. Yup, fallen. lol

 

[Saint Steven]

It is a moot point since Adam did indeed eat the fruit, because it was part of God's sovereign decree.

God's "sovereign decree" that humankind should fall?
Why would he want that?

 

[JoeP222w]

.