I would tell you the truth but my comment would be deleted as in the past, private message me if you wish. The truth is in Jesus words only.
Can we be saved and then lost?
It seems to me that we can! This is critical as many, many Preachers teach otherwise. Here are some scriptures that convince Preachers that one cannot lose their Salvation. John 10:28-29 gives ample proof to believe the old pronouncement, "Once saved, always saved". Here it is: John 10: Verse
28 "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [
man] pluck them out of my hand. Verse
29 "My Father, which gave [
them] me, is greater than all; and no [
man] is able to pluck [
them] out of my Father's hand."
HOWEVER, isn't it possible that God could simply release them from His hand, under certain dire circumstances?
ADDITIONAL AND EXPANDED HOWEVERS:
What if the hundreds-of-years-old saying, "Once saved, always saved" were not true? What If there were sinful conditions that would cause God to remove us from His "saved list" (The Book of Life)? What would the impact of such a possibility have on us, God's family members?
Would the effect be good or bad for believers, and for the world? Would we guard our salvation more seriously? Would we take his commands to reach the world more seriously? Would we be desirous of building closer relationships with Him, automatically, and also overtly?
For many years I have been considering and studying this controversy. And even today, I dare not "preach" (with authority) that which seems to me to be the truth in the matter. In my studies, it seems to me that there is much evidence indicating it is indeed possible to lose one's trajectory to Heaven, after it was once proffered!
By the way, The Word Of God says that God chooses us "before the foundation of the world", how then could we be taken from Him? As mentioned above, the Word also says that nothing can snatch us from His hand! But, could God let us go, if we fail to walk with Him; if we refuse to follow Him; if we cease to take any interest in the things of God? If we change our minds and say, no, couldn't He merely say, "Have it your way"?
Heaven knows, that I personally consider such a belief very, very frightening! If such a belief were true, I wouldn't be so complacent about my salvation. I would, "work out my Salvation with fear and trembling"! Hmmmm, seems like I've read that somewhere? I would make sure that I stayed connected with (abide in) Christ, lest I be cut-off and thrown into the fire by God. That sounds familiar, too! I would be diligent to prevent myself from falling away, because the Word tells me that if I fall away, I could never be renewed again unto repentance. And there's no way would I ever blaspheme the Holy Spirit! We all know that doing that is the unforgivable sin!
Wait a minute, there's an "unforgiveable sin"? Then, "once saved, always saved" can't be true? Oh, you say "committing the 'unforgiveable sin' can only happen to an unbeliever"! I see…?
If losing my salvation were possible, I would also be careful to overcome the Devil, as much as I possibly could, so as not to have my name "blotted out of the Book Of Life". Jesus overcame the Devil for me, and I overcame the Devil when I stopped rejecting Jesus Christ as my Savior, therefore I am perfect in God's sight. I don't mean to imply that I no longer sin, because Jesus overcame, and I dislike the saying that Jesus took away my sins, because He did not! They're still here!!! Well, He didn't take away my ability to sin, He just gave me the ability to not sin! Perhaps He took my sins away from the court case that Satan continually prosecutes against me, before God Almighty. If my sins were still in Satan's briefcase, it would be "double jeapardy", because those sins were already paid for, by Jesus!
If "Once saved, always saved", were not true, I would grasp with all of my strength the grace of God, by which I am saved, and stay so connected to Him that I could never lose my salvation.
Aren't these the very goals that God wants us to have?
Consider the following examples:
Recently, I came across a potential dilemma! If God predestines people to go to Heaven, then how could they lose their salvation? I believe the answer is that He only proffered Himself and Heaven to us, before the foundation of the world. We must accept His offer, before He predes-tines us for Heaven! We must accept Him before He accepts us (or predestines us). I suspect that God looked into the future, where we exist in time and makes His decision to predestine us for Heaven or Hell, based on our response to His offer. And, even if we fall away and then return, he sees it, and predestines us accordingly, whether we are saved or fallen. He does not predestine us for Hell, until our final refusal of His offers. At some point in our lives, we finally accept or re-ject Jesus Christ, and if we reject Christ, God says, "Have it your way".
LET'S LOOK AT SOME MORE SCRIPTURES ON THIS POSSIBILITY:
II Pet 3:17 - Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard that you do not get led astray by the error of these unprincipled men and fall from your firm grasp on the truth.
MY COMMENT(S): Peter is writing to the believers in 4-5 cities about being led astray from the truth of "The Way" (Christianity). It sounds as though they might "fall away" from the truth. This may not mean that they could lose their salvation, but it could mean that they were counting on Jesus
and circumcision to save them. They needed to learn that they must choose between the freedom that Christ offers, or the impossible law, which no one ever performed perfectly.
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How about: Matt 5:13 - “You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its flavor, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything except to be thrown out and trampled on by people.
MY COMMENT: The Salt of the Earth is certainly Believers! It appears so obvious, that Jesus is saying that we can be good for nothing; no longer headed for Heaven; no longer saved.
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II Cor 6:1 "We then, [
as] workers together [
with him], beseech [
you] also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain."
MY COMMENT: If receiving the grace of God means receiving salvation, as I suspect it does, then it appears one could receive it "in vain", meaning it would not result in eternity with God; that one could receive salvation and then lose it?
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I Tim 5:9-12 Let not a widow be taken into the number under threescore years old, having been the wife of one man,
4 10 Well reported of for good works; if she have brought up children, if she have lodged strangers, if she have washed the saints' feet, if she have relieved the afflicted, if she have diligently followed every good work. 11 But the younger widows refuse: for when they have begun to wax wanton against Christ, they will marry; 12 Having damnation, because they have cast off their first faith.
MY COMMENT: I guess we must ask if "damnation" means a loss of salvation, in this Scripture? This too, seems somewhat conclusive regarding losing one's Salvation.
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ROMANS 11:18-23 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, [
take heed] lest he also spare not thee. 22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [
his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. 23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
MY COMMENT: Above, It seems that believers were broken off - losing their salvation?? But, praise God, He will also bring them back into the family if they return to Him. Could it be that we can be saved and lost multiple times? Verse 23 says that God can graft us back in again (after we are cut off), so since God can do anything that He wishes, He could be so gracious as to graft us back into the vine (Jesus Christ) more than once!
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Eph 5:1-3 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not en-tangled again with the yoke of bondage. 2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. 3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
MY COMMENT(S): Here, again, it sounds as though some Ephesians were once saved (having faith in Jesus Christ) and then lost because they returned to placing their faith in the law! They were saved under grace then fallen from grace? If they are counting in the law to save them, they cannot choose part of the law (circumcision), but must live by the whole law, which no one could do.
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Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
MY COMMENT(S): Paul is speaking to Galatians who accepted Christ through his ministry and then were led astray by false teachers who were telling the Galatians that they needed to be circumcised. In sounds like Paul is saying, if you now need to be circumcised for salvation, then you no longer need grace and therefore have fallen from its work (redemption) in your life! "Christ is become of no effect, suggests, that his audience once belived, and Christ affected them greatly, now Christ is of no effect! They were saved, but now are lost!
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HEB 38: 36-39 - 36 For you need endurance in order to do God’s will and so receive what is promised. 37 For
just a little longer and
he who is coming will arrive and not delay. 38
But my righteous one will live by faith, and if he shrinks back, I take no pleasure in him. 39 But we are not among those who shrink back and thus perish, but are among those who have faith and preserve their souls.
MY COMMENT(S): The writer of Hebrews seems to be saying we need to endure in faith to receive, "what is promised" (salvation?), But, if we "shrink back" from enduring in faith, Jesus will take no pleasure in us, and we will perish in Hell.
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II Pet 1:10 "… give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:…"
MY COMMENT: Truly, if one performs correctly, he will not fall. But, what about the one who does not perform correctly…… he falls, ignoring his election and his calling.
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II John 1:8 Watch out, so that you do not lose the things we have worked for, but receive a full reward.
MY COMMENT(S): Again, John is writing to believers, and telling them to hold onto their faith/beliefs, so that they may receive a full reward. So, there must be a lesser reward, joy/job, position/responsibility in Heaven, not becoming "unsaved", but receiving a lesser reward in Heaven? Different measures (levels?) of salvation? Different amounts of reward(s)?
a. In Luke 8:13,
13 They on the rock [
are they], which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away. Jesus says Some people hear and then fall away. Admittedly, in this case, the people who Jesus is referring to, may be people who ONLY HEAR, and do not become Believers. In this, Jesus says that they believe, for awhile.
MY COMMENT: It's difficult to imagine them falling away, if they were never "there", in the first place, meaning if they were never saved? How could they fall from a place they never were?
b. In Revelation 3:5, Jesus states, "He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and
I will not blot out his name out of the Book of Life (my italics), but I will confess his name before my Father, and before His angels".
MY COMMENT(S): In Revelation (above), I believe Jesus is saying to John, that He (Jesus) may blot someone's name out of the Book Of Life, if that person does not over-come! There seems to be a condition (or conditions?) for keeping one's name in the Book Of Life. Jesus says this as if He has blotted names out of the Book Of Life before (this is purely speculation on my part).
In any case, if the person's name was in the Book Of Life, then he was saved. Yet, he may no longer be saved, if he does not overcome. This seems to refute the teaching, "Once saved, always saved"! It is impossible to think Jesus would say this, if it were not possible!
c. In Matt 12:32, Jesus (speaking to believers) mentions a sin that cannot be forgiven (blasphemy against the Holy Spirit). If a Believer ever blasphemed the Holy Spirit, he could not be forgiven, and therefore he would lose his eternity in Heaven; having been saved, then lost.
MY COMMENT(S): The question here is, can a Christian blaspheme the Holy Spirit?
d. Philippians 2:12 - Paul writes to the Philippians that they must "work out their salvation with fear and trembling."
MY COMMENT(S): What if a person refused to "work out his/her salvation with fear and trembling" (It appears to me, in my life experience, that few Christians "work" at all for God! They seem to just go to church and get fat [fed on the Word of God], and go home to re-sume lives like the rest of the world, emphasizing temporal living - accumulating things, and having "fun", solving problems, working on earthly goals, etc.).
e. Hebrews 6:4-6 says "For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.
MY COMMENT(S): It appears clear that some people are saved and then "fall away", showing that it is indeed possible to be saved and then lost! The point of these verses is that such a person cannot be "re-saved"! Doing so would require "re-crucifying" Jesus, making His crucifixion initially ineffective; suggesting that it did not work; that Jesus' crucifixion was insufficient to save! This is a lie straight out of Hell! Christ's death was completely sufficient unto totally undoing the Devil's work, that is undoing all sin, of all men, for all time.
MY COMMENT(S): THIS SEEMS TO BE A DIRECT CONTRADICTION TO
Romans 10:23 "And they also,
if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again." Here The Apostle Paul is saying if Believers who have been cut from Christ's Vine, that they can return and be grafted back into the vine (which is Jesus Christ), by God Himself. That is, they were lost, but will be grafted back in (re-saved?). But perhaps God makes an exception for Blasphemy? Blasphemy is the "unforgivable sin"! The only sin wereby a once Believer cannot be grafted back in.
f. How about Galatians 5:4. "You have become estranged from Christ, you who have attempted to be justified by law, you have fallen from grace."
MY COMMENT(S): Doesn't this say that one can "fall from grace"; having been living in Christ (under grace) and then become "estranged" from Christ (no longer under grace); at one time having been saved by grace and then attempt to be justified by law (and therefore lose one's salvation)?
How about Colossians 1:21-23 - "And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in [
your] mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death,
22 to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and [
be] not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, [
and] which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister.
MY COMMENT(S): There are many such verses that suggest if we continue in the faith, we will be saved. Why would the Apostles say so many times that we must "continue in the faith", stay as we were when we first believed the Gospel, etc. if we cannot lose our salvation?
I am not a Biblical Scholar or a Preacher, so I resist questioning anything that I have been taught. It is painful for me to suggest that Christians might actually lose their salvation; that most valuable gift of God. And I am well aware that the idea of losing one's Salvation flies in the face of other Bible Scripture.
Oh Lord, how I feel faint, to think that I might write something that is in error; something that might lead someone astray?
Lord, do not let anyone believe this, if it is not true! But, if it is true Lord, cause believers to be drawn ever closer to you and let it be a warning to those who have taken their salvation for granted, just ignoring the way God wants us to live for Him. May they repent and turn to You
