What does it mean to be, have or possess a consciousness, or be conscious...?

[Neogaia777]

First off, I wanted to post this in the philosophy forum, but it won't let me post there (maybe someone could help me out with that maybe...?)

Anyway, What does it mean to be, have or possess a consciousness, or be conscious...?

I got into this discussion with another poster in the physical and life sciences forum, and you might want to check out the conversation going on there to get what I am meaning, sample post from that thread here:

Considering the very enourmous size, vast distances, and marvelous complexities, and nuances of....

By conscious, I mean, fully, truly cognizant, (self) aware, or truly aware, sentient, or the ability to have completely independent thought(s)...

I do not mean to "seem to be", alive, awake, aware, or simply "seeming" to exist, but, to "truly" be alive, awake, aware, or how I define truly existing...

Comments...?

 

[Neogaia777]

Could someone help me out with why I cannot post in the philosophy forum...? (please)...?

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

This might help in this discussion as well:

Consciousness - Wikipedia

 

[drjean]

Can you not open this page, or just not be able to start a new thread once there? Christian Philosophy & Ethics

 

[drjean]

Let's begin with this one instead: Consciousness (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

Simply put, to me, consciousness is experiencing the reality of being.

I don't like the term SUBconscious at all but NONconscious better... even so, with dreaming and especially lucid dreaming, we are always aware of our living. We are never out of God's thoughts, and indeed even in dreams He speaks to us and we listen.

 

[Zoii]

The topic is a brilliant one - I have listened to podcasts on this topic.
I have wondered for while now, how it is that I am simply a composition of carbon, sodium, potassium, nitrogen, oxygen etc.... when I die that's what i will fall back to - a bag of elements and compounds, Yet this bag of chemicals has arranged in such a way that it has self-realisation. This collective of chemicals thinks. It recognises me. And just who exactly is ME.... am I the sum of action potentials in my brain; the web of neural pathways that allow me to think critically and adapt. When you break that down, that means my consciousness, my sense of self, is the collective movements of sodium and potassium across neural cell membranes. That really means that everything I register, my sight, my smell, my pain....they are just chemical movements...I could really be asleep and I'd register those things.

But if I am nothing but chemical movement.... what decides the prescription that gives me my identity. Because ME changes yet its still ME. I am not who I was at age 5 or 12 or 15. I'm 17 and I'm at uni and ME is now a very very different person. The image of myself is eclectic..... I cant wait to see what people write about this


Great topic OP

 

[Zoii]

Let's begin with this one instead: Consciousness (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

Simply put, to me, consciousness is experiencing the reality of being.

I don't like the term SUBconscious at all but NONconscious better... even so, with dreaming and especially lucid dreaming, we are always aware of our living. We are never out of God's thoughts, and indeed even in dreams He speaks to us and we listen.

Well whats the reality of being. Is it what you see, or what you hear? Because thats just a chemo-electric movement in your brain. And when youre unconscious you are still "being" yet you are incapacable of recognising yourself.

And what is yourself - its not body per se - because if you remove your arms and legs you still have a sense of self - so whats self?

 

[Neogaia777]

Can you not open this page, or just not be able to start a new thread once there? Christian Philosophy & Ethics

Yes, I got it, thanks.

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Some might say there are varying "levels" of consciousness...?

But, what level does one have to be at, to live, exist, or go beyond "this"...? Or do they...? (have to be at, or attain to, a certain "level of consciousness", or have a certain kind of understanding or belief...?) (and what would that be...?)

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Are we more than the sum of our (physical) "parts"...? And, is a certain level or type of consciousness the answer...?

 

[Neogaia777]

Are we truly "conscious", and what would or does that mean...?

Or are we just acting and reacting to stimuli, and not really "thinking" persay, independent of that...?

 

[Neogaia777]

Is all that is not conscious, not really "real"...? Or a part of a simulation in which true consciousness(es) live...? (For now)...

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

First off, I wanted to post this in the philosophy forum, but it won't let me post there (maybe someone could help me out with that maybe...?)

Anyway, What does it mean to be, have or possess a consciousness, or be conscious...?

I got into this discussion with another poster in the physical and life sciences forum, and you might want to check out the conversation going on there to get what I am meaning, sample post from that thread here:

Considering the very enourmous size, vast distances, and marvelous complexities, and nuances of....

By conscious, I mean, fully, truly cognizant, (self) aware, or truly aware, sentient, or the ability to have completely independent thought(s)...

I do not mean to "seem to be", alive, awake, aware, or simply "seeming" to exist, but, to "truly" be alive, awake, aware, or how I define truly existing...

Comments...?

Oh good topic. It is a long one for me because I am still learning. Once when I was a little girl, I was looking into a mirror, I saw me. I don't mean I saw the flesh and blood me. I mean I saw the me inside of my body. I know that may sound weird, but that is the only way I can describe the experience. That is when I discovered that I was inside of my body. Along the way, I learned a lot about who I was. I learned that my mind is housed inside of my brain. My spirit is housed inside my solar plexus. My soul is housed in my pineal gland. All of it is held together by this suit called my body. But I am NOT my flesh and blood body.When I was born, I was not aware of these things.I was not aware of these things, but I had awareness of a sort of self awareness.

Later in life I learned a new word , plexus. It is funny how our Father can use all of our experiences to teach us about who we are in Christ. I have always believed there had to be more to life than just living.I use to wonder about some of the songs I heard growing up.What were they really saying. I enjoyed reading science fiction.I enjoyed the fairy tales, I loved Walt Disney (back in the day), I loved to daydream. Through my youth, my head was in the clouds and people around me would just tell me to snap out f it. But, there was something there in my spirit, in my soul.I could not put my finger on it.So, I learned that I was created in God's image. I was saved at a very young age.So, like at 9-10 I read the creation story in Genesis.I thank God for my experiences back then because my environment consisted of home, church, school. (prayer was allowed in school). Have you ever been in a state where you think you are supposed to know something but you just can't seem to get it.That is that plexus state of neither here nor there. I learned about original sin. Adam sinned when Eve gave him of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.Now, everybody is born with the sin nature. What a sad story. Now, everybody has to die; A truly depressing story.So, I continued to learn. I will continue this on my next post which may be tomorrow. It is late and I am getting sleepy.

 

[Neogaia777]

If your not conscious of anything beyond "this", then you'll never go, be, or attain to anything beyond "this", when "this" is done...

Only problem for people conscious of anything beyond "this", is there is one of two places you can go...

God Bless!

 

[drjean]

I believe the conscious is more than the physical brain. The mind, modern science has discovered, can CREATE! Just as God can speak, well DOES speak everything into existence (that's why He cannot LIE!) we can create things into our lives--and others'--- by our postiive thoughts/energy. God has truly created us marvelously. (In addition, good thoughts grow healthy "tree like" structures in the brain and negative thoughts kill brain cells and create dead trees in the brain.)

Our conscious is God-given, and spiritual. 2 Peter 1:3 seeing that his divine power hath granted unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that called us by his own glory and virtue;

"His law written in our hearts", Romans 2:15

Ecclesiastes 3:11 He has SET ETERNITY in the HEARTS of men (which means we all have a yearning for God, to worship, and a knowledge of an afterlife.)

Matthew 13:11 He replied, "The knowledge of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.

1 Corinthians 2:10 But unto us God revealed them through the Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

and Romans 1:19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.

This awareness, this knowing, this "consciousness" is spiritually based... through our minds and hearts... and our stomachs! Science calls the gut the second mind.

Acts 14:15-17 "......'Men, why are doing these things? We also are men with the
same nature as you, and preach to you that you should turn from these vain things
(idols) to the LIVING GOD, who made the heaven, the earth, the sea, and all things
that are in them, who in bygone generations allowed all nations to walk in their own
ways. Nevertheless,He did not leave Himself without WITNESS, in that He did
good, gave us rain from heaven and fruitful seasons, filling our HEARTS
with food and gladness.'"

We are to have the mind of Christ... this consciousness of the Omnipotent, Omnipresent, Omniscient, Most Gracious and Merciful God Almighty Who displays love for those who seek Him and worship Him...

So science has proven our thoughts are energy. God's laws of thermodynamics gives us the basis for this energy in that it cannot be destroyed. That means our "Being" (mind, will) who we are, will always "be". (It is our physical bodies that change energy form.) God is eternal (having no beginning and no end) we are everlasting (having a beginning but no end).

 

[Zoii]

Our conscious is God-given, and spiritual. 2 Peter 1:3 seeing that his divine power hath granted unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that called us by his own glory and virtue;


This awareness, this knowing, this "consciousness" is spiritually based... through our minds and hearts... and our stomachs! Science calls the gut the second mind.
.

If consciousness is spiritually based and God given, does that mean that spirit has been withdrawn for those people who suffer dementia? How does consciousness fit for those with altered brains using your theory?... Im not arguing youre wrong - But I'm questioning it

 

[Neogaia777]

If consciousness is spiritually based and God given, does that mean that spirit has been withdrawn for those people who suffer dementia? How does consciousness fit for those with altered brains using your theory?... Im not arguing youre wrong - But I'm questioning it

I've thought about that as well, but, intelligence often does not have to be a determining factor in belief or ones level of belief or faith or level of consciousness, either they believe or they don't... just intelligence is often is not a major determining factor in being conscious of something more than "this"...

A person of a high level of intelligence, might not be very conscious, while a person of a low level of intelligence could have a very high level of consciousness...

And God knows each one, their level of abilities or inabilities, level of responsibility to believe or be aware or conscious of such things, (and ours, each one of us also) and any "other" determining factors, or non-factors that need to weighed in and/or considered, in judging cause he's the perfect judge, and we are not, and we should have faith in that...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

I know there are forces in this world who target low and high pretty equally, that do not want any of us to think or believe we are, or that there is any "more" than "this"...?

These forces are evil and are our enemies, and are threatened by us thinking this way, and want to take us all out, we have to fight them, for all of our sakes...

God Bless!

 

[Zoii]

I've thought about that as well, but, intelligence often does not have to be a determining factor in belief or ones level of belief or faith or level of consciousness, either they believe or they don't... just intelligence is often is not a major determining factor in being conscious of something more than "this"...

A person of a high level of intelligence, might not be very conscious, while a person of a low level of intelligence could have a very high level of consciousness...

And God knows each one, their level of abilities or inabilities, level of responsibility to believe or be aware or conscious of such things, (and ours, each one of us also) and any "other" determining factors, or non-factors that need to weighed in and/or considered, in judging cause he's the perfect judge, and we are not, and we should have faith in that...

God Bless!

Thats not what I was saying - are you Neogaia when you get dementia? .... are you the person who you believe you to be when you no longer have cognitive function? - and if not then where does spirituality fit in when you believe that Neogaia is the person he is because of God? If you cease to be the person you believe you to be then wheres God in that..... If God is consistent and you have a fixed idea of who you are - then who is that person with dementia? - by the theory you just gave me I am to deduce you're dead already when you have dementia..... and if thats what youre saying I can in part support that. My dad has even said to me - "when I dont know who you are anymore Zoii, feel free to let my wheelchair disappear off a cliff because I left long ago when I get to that point".

Consciousness in that paradigm isnt then about life - it appears its connected to an identity we have of ourselves.

 

[Neogaia777]

Thats not what I was saying - are you Neogaia when you get dementia? .... are you the person who you believe you to be when you no longer have cognitive function? - and if not then where does spirituality fit in when you believe that Neogaia is the person he is because of God? If you cease to be the person you believe you to be then wheres God in that..... If God is consistent and you have a fixed idea of who you are - then who is that person with dementia? - by the theory you just gave me I am to deduce you're dead already when you have dementia..... and if thats what youre saying I can in part support that. My dad has even said to me - "when I dont know who you are anymore Zoii, feel free to let my wheelchair disappear off a cliff because I left long ago when I get to that point".

Consciousness in that paradigm isnt then about life - it appears its connected to an identity we have of ourselves.

Sorry, dementia, right, I was thinking about mentally disabled and handicapped, sorry...

God would know, wouldn't he...? And would he not factor every and all factors in and judge righteously and accordingly...? I mean, a person with dementia was not always that way right...?

My answer is God knows and would judge accordingly... And rightly...

I would think that a person with or that is developing worse dementia, is very close to death or dying, and it's sad that they still have to exist for a while in that state, but, when they do finally die, God will know whether they ever were conscious or possessed a true consciousness in the way that we are talking about consciousness here or not... And will resurrect them and restore them if they were or did...

I hope that answers your question...?

God Bless!