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What controversial beliefs do you hold?

What controversial beliefs do you hold?

  • Annihilationism/Conditional Immorality

    Votes: 13 10.2%
  • Full Preterism

    Votes: 7 5.5%
  • Open Theism

    Votes: 11 8.6%
  • Ordination of women

    Votes: 52 40.6%
  • Premarital sex is not always sinful

    Votes: 33 25.8%
  • Same-sex relationships are not sinful

    Votes: 31 24.2%
  • Theistic Evolution

    Votes: 40 31.3%
  • Universalism

    Votes: 27 21.1%
  • Other

    Votes: 56 43.8%
  • None

    Votes: 20 15.6%

  • Total voters
    128

Halbhh

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I am pleased that someone doesn't think this is particularly controversial. I would have assumed that almost all Christians would take up pitchforks against anyone who implies the law makes people more sinful.

In addition to what I said above, the phrasing that the law induces us to sin more -- that learning the law actually increases the urge to sin (!) -- I've heard said at a Lutheran church. (not that only a Lutheran church might say so)
 
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mark kennedy

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I am pleased that someone doesn't think this is particularly controversial. I would have assumed that almost all Christians would take up pitchforks against anyone who implies the law makes people more sinful.
I really don't see why, NT Wright is simply describing the Pauline doctrine of sin and the Law:

Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. For sin, seizing the opportunity afforded by the commandment, deceived me, and through the commandment put me to death. (Romans 7: 9-11)
That's why the Jerusalem council refused to require Gentiles to have to be circumcised. In the words of the Apostle Peter:

Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.” (Acts 15:10-11)
That's justification by grace through faith, apart from works of the Law. It's no more controversial then the gospel itself, which is not to say the controversy isn't real.

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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mark kennedy

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In addition to what I said above, the phrasing that the law induces us to sin more I've heard said at a Lutheran church. (not that only a Lutheran church might say so)
Would to God they were all saying it, which is not to dismiss the Law, but the New Testament doctrine regarding how we fulfill the righteous requirements of the Law:

Grace not only saves us but sanctifies us, apart from Christ we can do nothing and to make myself clear, your merit counts for nothing. If one were to ask the Apostle Paul how it is that he worked so hard and suffered so much and bringing so many the Gospel, he would, and did, tell us that it is by grace.

But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect. No, I worked harder than all of them—yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me. (I Cor. 15:10)​

A good working definition for grace is 'unmerited favor', Paul worked in the ministry field by grace alone and he is crystal clear on this point. The merits of Christian ministry are Christ's alone we can add nothing. It's encouraging to hear that Lutherans still embrace this doctrine.

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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RC1970

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Hi there,

I have seen this Calvinist term used quite a bit by Americans, can you briefly explain what you mean by being a Calvinist as your denomination?

PS, if there is a more suitable thread for this please move it mods. Thanks

Ryan
Yes, the answer to your question can be found in the two links below:

Doctrines of Grace
Theopedia


"Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else." ~ Charles Spurgeon
 
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Sibyl

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I was curious what all controversial beliefs are held here on CF so I decided to make a poll about it. Please do not debate the issues themselves, but if you want to reply with what you voted, please feel free.
God has allowed me to believe that Saul and Mathias were not apostles. Which questions the legitimacy of half of the new testament and the agenda of "organized religion" and that "The Church" is possibly the false profit that Jesus warned us about. I also believe that Mary Magdalene is the thirteenth apostle whose teachings were disparaged and she was driven from Israel by the misogynist Peter and the other male apostles.
 
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RC1970

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God has allowed me to believe that Saul and Mathias were not apostles. Which questions the legitimacy of half of the new testament and the agenda of "organized religion" and that "The Church" is possibly the false profit that Jesus warned us about. I also believe that Mary Magdalene is the thirteenth apostle whose teachings were disparaged and she was driven from Israel by the misogynist Peter and the other male apostles.
Are you sure it was God?
 
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Sibyl

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Sounds like you do belief in a variation of universalism.

Universal reconciliation - Wikipedia

Basically Hell is not a permanent place and all eventually accept Christ and are saved.

For me, I think their is a possibility that are all saved through Jesus, but im not 100% certain so I couldn't identify as apart of Christian Universalism.
God has allowed me to believe that sin is removed through pain and suffering. And that everyone must be purged of sin before entering heaven. Thus the purpose of hell is to cleanse your soul not to punish it. That is why Jesus didn't just die he suffered to remove our sins.
 
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Sibyl

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"The Controversial Christian Theology forum is open to Christian members only (faith groups list). These unorthodox topics include (but are not limited to):
  • Universalism
  • Open Theism
  • Full Preterism
  • Annihilationism
  • Gnosticism"
How open minded of you. A christian is any one who believes in the teachings of Jesus, often different from the teachings of "the church". Which denomination in your narrow minded "faith groups list" believes that Jesus is the son of god but that the Bible was edited and compiled to appease Constantine and his mother? The Cathars? And that "the church" exists to enforce its own authority and power. Ask William Tyndale about the evil of "the church".
 
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Albion

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How open minded of you. A christian is any one who believes in the teachings of Jesus, often different from the teachings of "the church".
You're entitled to your own definition, of course, but Christian Forums has one, too. I merely reprinted the relevant wording for you in case you, a relatively new member, might have missed seeing this information.
 
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Sibyl

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You're entitled to your own definition, of course, but Christian Forums has one, too. I merely reprinted the relevant wording for you in case you, a relatively new member, might have missed seeing this information.
I am still not sure if I am welcome or should I be stoned.
 
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rturner76

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How open minded of you. A christian is any one who believes in the teachings of Jesus, often different from the teachings of "the church". Which denomination in your narrow minded "faith groups list" believes that Jesus is the son of god but that the Bible was edited and compiled to appease Constantine and his mother? The Cathars? And that "the church" exists to enforce its own authority and power. Ask William Tyndale about the evil of "the church".
The new translation of the finalized Biblical canon was largely the work of St Jerome, who, in 382 AD, was commissioned by Pope Damascus I to revise the Vetus Latina ("Old Latin") collection of biblical texts in Latin then in use by the Church. Emperor Constantine was not involved in choosing the Biblical Canon but The early Church fathers chose most of the writings that would be included. The Eastern Church had a similar canon that did not include Revelation at that time. The Cathar's had no input on the finalized Biblical Canon but the books were chosen by an ecumenical counsel of elders and Bishops, Not Constantine or the Roman government.

William Tyndale got killed for being disobedient and that was wrong but thousands of Protestants AND Catholics were killed during the troubled times and it even still goes on in Ireland. So intolerance is intolerance no matter who or how you worship.

One other thing then I'll let it go. The Tyndale Bible, The Anglican Church, The Lutheran Church and all the other spin off churches can go ahead and be grateful that the "evil" Catholic Church brought Christianity to western Europe, otherwise they would still be living in small communities worshipping various gods of the Earth and the seasons and they would still be killing each other on a regular basis as half naked Pagan Warriors
 
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rturner76

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I am still not sure if I am welcome or should I be stoned.
You are welcome here any time brother. Just don't promote homosexuality,abortion, or tell anybody they are not a Christian. Those are the main rules that get people tripped up. That and flaming~basically directly insulting people, name calling, calling people liars, or even sometimes you get busted for in-directly insulting somebody. Oh one other thing, sometimes there are certain rules depending on what forum you are in where you can't talk about certain topics or disagree with certain points of view. Just read that gorum's "statement of purpose" to find out the rules of that "room"
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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God has allowed... ... apostles.

How ... ... a quote from the letter of a false apostle.

I am still not sure if I am welcome or should I be stoned.
Terms of Service and Christian Forum Rules | Christian Forums

"Challenging Paul's position as an Apostle of Jesus Christ who (although not one of the original twelve) was sent forth by Christ after his conversion [Acts 9:15-16], or arguing against the inclusion of Paul's writings in the New Testament canon, is not allowed in any "Christians Only" forums (including the Controversial Christian Theology forum). You may disagree on the interpretation and application of his writings, but not their place as canon or Paul as an inspired author of Scripture."
 
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Albion

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One other thing then I'll let it go. The Tyndale Bible, The Anglican Church, The Lutheran Church and all the other spin off churches can go ahead and be grateful that the "evil" Catholic Church brought Christianity to western Europe, otherwise they would still be living in small communities worshipping various gods of the Earth and the seasons and they would still be killing each other on a regular basis as half naked Pagan Warriors

Let me guess. You're a recent convert. :doh:

Actually, the Anglican Church is most likely older than the Church in Rome; and most of Northern Europe was Christianized by missionaries sent out from Britain, not Rome. But don't bother with the real history. The one you were told in RCIA classes is a lot more colorful.
 
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rturner76

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Let me guess. You're a recent convert. :doh:

Actually, the Anglican Church is most likely older than the Church in Rome; and most of Northern Europe was Christianized by missionaries sent out from Britain, not Rome. But don't bother with the real history. The one you were told in RCIA classes is a lot more colorful.
I looked up a couple of sources about what you are saying here and I believe we are both right in a way. It is true that Christianity was introduced to the British Isles before the Roman Catholic Church got there in the first century by travelers from Rome and other areas where there were Christians like artisans and tradesman.They started having small gatherings. However at that time and for the next couple of centuries, Paganism was still the norm especially on the main Island. Christianity surged with the conversion of Constantine however in the third century with the departure of Rome from the British Isles then arrived Angles, Saxons and Jutes with their religions. Yet somehow Christianity survived on the Western edges of Britain. Missionary activity continued in Wales and Ireland, and in Western Scotland Saint Columba helped to bring a distinctly Irish brand of Christianity to mainland Britain.

Then the game changer: Augustine's famous mission in 597 AD from Pope Gregory the Great to King Aethelbert of Kent. AEthelbert had married the Christian daughter of the French king and was converted by Augustine becoming the first Christian king of The Britons loyal to Rome. Augustine converted many in the king's service and held a mass baptism of one thousand converts on Christmas day. Aethelbert gave the church lands for a monastery and Augustine became the first Bishop of Canterbury.

The Roman church gained authority but still competed with the Celtic Church until William the Conqueror installed and reformed many of the Abbies, Parish's and Cathedral's. William did not bend to Rome but the church he took over from Old English authority which has slowly moved away from Rome and restored it to Roman authority instituting celibacy and outlawing simony.

The English Church of course would split for good under Henry the VIII. So while in this small amount of research I have done I have seen that the English indeed has had it's own Christians from the beginning. On the mainland of Britain,I believe the organized "Church" was established under King AEthelbert. I believe this was the church that would survive unbroken up until King Henry VIII and was responsible for the conversion of the majority of the island.
 
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Albion

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I looked up a couple of sources about what you are saying here and I believe we are both right in a way. It is true that Christianity was introduced to the British Isles before the Roman Catholic Church got there in the first century by travelers from Rome and other areas where there were Christians like artisans and tradesman.They started having small gatherings. However at that time and for the next couple of centuries, Paganism was still the norm especially on the main Island.
Well, it was also the norm in most of the "Christian world" of that time, in all the countries bordering the Mediterranean, for example. Mithraism was a close competitor, too, as well as various other cults.

Yet somehow Christianity survived on the Western edges of Britain. Missionary activity continued in Wales and Ireland, and in Western Scotland Saint Columba helped to bring a distinctly Irish brand of Christianity to mainland Britain.
I think you underestimate the church in Britain. After all, three British bishops were delegates to the Council of Arles in the early fourth century (before Augustine and even Constantine's doings).
 
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