Weeping and Gnashing

[bbbbbbb]

Given the topic of the thread, any reference to it seems to be in order. If the OP merely said weeping and gnashing of teeth from the Bible, or orthodox Christian perspective, then sources outside of that realm would be out of order. As it is, in the Unorthodox Forum any and all sources can be used unless otherwise specified.

The bottom line remains that the LDS teach that there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth for those who die in any unmarried state. Relative to the use of that term in the Bible, this is a very serious matter indeed.

 

[Ran77]

drstevej is right on.

Then maybe he should post for you all the time.

 

[timewerx]

Those thrown in will be in such a state of rebellion that just pure anger with weeping and gnashing is all they have left, with no relief. Not even crying out for mercy, how sad.

Once there was a very evil man. He had a person with him that is shrouded from head to foot, barely recognizable. The evil man then deceived every man, woman, and child that the shrouded person is their enemy and they must kill.

Then a multitude got this shrouded person and trampled underfoot. After a time, they succeeded in killing the shrouded person in a bloodfest. They remove the shroud and discovered a young and innocent child whom they just murdered.

All who helped to murder the young and innocent child, wept bitterly, now fully aware of the very evil thing they did. They wept bitterly for they chose to save their own lives by doing what everybody else does even if it is the wrong thing to do!

For the rest of their lives, none sought comfort, they bitterly wept day and night. Their memories of murdering an innocent child won't go away.

 

[Norah63]

'Thinking' they were doing God a favor by killing the shrouded one, because they were discieved by the evil one.
It takes others joining in to feed the fear of what can not be clearly seen.
Reasoning among themselves that to kill was the only way to protect themselves.
No getting away from the gnashing and weeping, over the responsibility from the actions.

Another good parable timewerx.

 

[timewerx]

Yes, as long as survival instinct is your god, you'll always be in the side that kills the one that says survival (finding your life in this world) will cause you to forfeit your life in the end.

Deception is everywhere. You'll find it in your church, when you go to work, when you turn on the TV, when you pay your taxes (Sorry for the Morpheus talk but that is the Truth!)

Everywhere you look, you'll see, "love yourself", "Find your place in the world", "Take control of your life", "Be what you want to be", "Reward yourself", "Insure your future"

In exact opposition of:

John 12:25
Anyone who loves their life will lose it, while anyone who hates their life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

Matthew 10:39
Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

The world, (Greek "kosmos" meaning order, system) will always oppose God because:

1 John 5:19
We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.

These are some of the guidelines I've used to avoid deception and it has served me well. It also made me realize that a lot of Christians are deceived because they are under the grip of the teachings of this world (which is under the evil one) which they also heard from preachers who are also deceived.

The Word of God is speaking the Truth when it says, only few will find the way and that many Christians will be utterly surprised in the end (Matthew 7:22-23) that they killed Jesus through mockery and twisting the meaning of the Words of God.

 

[Norah63]

And the worlds system is now even beginning to gnash like vampires. Much of the young are being led to that dark side. The body markings, and piercings, and cuttings, for relief from what ever they are depressed by.
We know the gospel is the answer, yet the world offers another kingdom.
No man that loves his own body would want to harm it, as we read in scripture.
That would be following after the spirit of this world.
We are members of the body of Christ, and do no harm to the other parts of His body.

 

[Der Alte]

One of the other threads brought up "weeping and gnashing of teeth." I thought it might be interesting to discuss that topic here. Please offer your understanding of the verses that are provided.

Matthew 24: 51

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.​

Checking Strong's Concordance it lists the word klauthmos for weeping and brygmos for gnashing.

Klauthmos = weeping, wailing, lamentation.​

Seems to be indicating that this person is unhappy. Very unhappy.

Brygmos =

1) a gnashing of teeth
a) used to denote extreme anguish and utter despair of men consigned to eternal punishment in hell

2) snarling, growling: in the sense of biting​

More of the same.

And

Matthew 13: 41-42

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.​

Based on these two verses this seems to be a phrase used to describe the unhappiness a person feels when they are cast away from God. The first describes being appointed the same fate as the hypocrites and the second describes a fiery furnace.

Here are a few more verses.

Luke 13: 28

28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.​

This gnashing is done when a person sees the rewards of the prophets as they are thrust out from among them.

Acts 7: 51-54
51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
53 Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.
54 When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth.​

Those who resisted the Holy Ghost and also did not keep the law gnashed when they heard the truth.

The scripture you quoted does not say, e.g. "wailing and gnashing of teeth, then they are destroyed"

These scriptures indicate a continuing, unending condition away from the presence of God.

 

[bbbbbbb]

The scripture you quoted does not say, e.g. "wailing and gnashing of teeth, then they are destroyed"

These scriptures indicate a continuing, unending condition away from the presence of God.

However, please keep in mind that these folks are happy at the same time in their eternal state, at least as happy as they can be, but not as happy as those in the Celestial Kingdom who are not weeping and gnashing their teeth.

 

[Ran77]

The scripture you quoted does not say, e.g. "wailing and gnashing of teeth, then they are destroyed"

I don't remember claiming that they did. Can you point that out to me?

These scriptures indicate a continuing, unending condition away from the presence of God.

Please point that out to me as well. Was it in the portion of the verses that I didn't quote? Because I did a quick scan of what I posted and I didn't see that continuing, nor unending, was part of what I quoted.

 

[he-man]

One of the other threads brought up "weeping and gnashing of teeth." I thought it might be interesting to discuss that topic here. Please offer your understanding of the verses that are provided. Matthew 24: 51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

The exegesis is that those who are not allowed into the Kingdom will be crying out in angry voices against God, remorsefully for themselves, because they thought the message they carried was the correct one, but because they only followed the precepts of men whom they thought were the Fathers, they are extinguished from ever receiving eternal life.

Luk 13:28There shall be crying and angry utterances, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and youthrust out.
G2805 κλαυθμος crying, weeping
G1030 βρυγμος from G1031 βρυχώμα growling, gruff or angry utterance

Luk 13:27But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, allworkers of iniquity.