Warp Drive-how feasible?

[Strathos]

FTL is theoretically possible without violating Einstein's Relativity and there maybe hard evidence in nature.

Ergosphere - Wikipedia
Lense–Thirring precession - Wikipedia

I think many of you here should unlearn years of 'brainwashing' of a lot of things that was thought to be "impossible".

The thing is, if you're on a spaceship 2000 light-years away from Earth, and if you somehow manage to transport yourself instantaneously to Earth, you'll end up on Earth 2000 years ago, unless you also independently travel 2000 years forward in time.

 

[timewerx]

The thing is, if you're on a spaceship 2000 light-years away from Earth, and if you somehow manage to transport yourself instantaneously to Earth, you'll end up on Earth 2000 years ago, unless you also independently travel 2000 years forward in time.

I hope you read the first article I gave.

Because the situation you are describing would be unlikely in reality. There's a lot of misconceptions flying around FTL theories from outdated/misleading/incomplete info. Newer theories suggests the matter is much much simpler.

 

[Radrook]

The thing is, if you're on a spaceship 2000 light-years away from Earth, and if you somehow manage to transport yourself instantaneously to Earth, you'll end up on Earth 2000 years ago, unless you also independently travel 2000 years forward in time.

I have difficulty visualizing how events that have already transpired are still going on somewhere else and can be accessed in some way and even travelled to. Perhaps all this might make sense mathematically but does everything that makes sense mathematically always have its equivalent in reality itself?

Suppose it makes sense mathematically to instantaneously disintegrate a human body and reassemble it on a planet's surface below as is done in the Star trek scenarios. Does that mean that such a thing is really possible without instantly killing the person? Looking good on paper and being feasible or actually real can be two entirely different things.

 

[Strathos]

I have difficulty visualizing how events that have already transpired are still going on somewhere else and can be accessed in some way and even travelled to. Perhaps all this might make sense mathematically but does everything that makes sense mathematically always have its equivalent in reality itself?

Suppose it makes sense mathematically to instantaneously disintegrate a human body and reassemble it on a planet's surface below as is done in the Star trek scenarios. Does that mean that such a thing is really possible without instantly killing the person? Looking good on paper and being feasible or actually real can be two entirely different things.

Study general relativity. Basically, causality is limited by the light cone of any given space. If light has not had the time to reach a place yet, then the things that light reflects haven't happened yet, as far as the universe is concerned.

 

[Radrook]

Study general relativity. Basically, causality is limited by the light cone of any given space. If light has not had the time to reach a place yet, then the things that light reflects haven't happened yet, as far as the universe is concerned.

How is causality limited by a light cone and what does that have to do with being able to go back in time and interact with dead people? Sounds to me like the same old claim made in Eden that we really never die?

 

[Strathos]

How is causality limited by a light cone and what does that have to do with being able to go back in time and interact with dead people? Sounds to me like the same old claim made in Eden that we really never die?

It's complicated. I don't have a physics degree so I only understand the basics. But there are online resources you can use for research if you're really interested.

 

[Radrook]

It's complicated. I don't have a physics degree so I only understand the basics. But there are online resources you can use for research if you're really interested.

I hope you do realize the religious implications of such a concept. Christ would always be forever hanging on the cross alive somewhere in time. People would not really ever be dead.

 

[Strathos]

I hope you do realize the religious implications of such a concept. Christ would always be forever hanging on the cross alive somewhere in time. People would not really ever be dead.

God exists outside of time though. Heaven would be the same.

 

[Loudmouth]

What crew in its right mind would agree to make a trip which would have them arrive two million Earth years later?

We have been going in circles around a single star for millions of years now (counting our hominid ancestors) and no one seems to complain.

The best solution would be to build a generational ship that is like a mini-Earth. Treat it like a planet orbiting the Sun with the added bonus of your ancestors actually reaching a more interesting destination.

 

[Radrook]

God exists outside of time though. Heaven would be the same.

Not everyone agrees that God and Heaven are totally apart from time since God is described as working within the parameters of the temporal.

We have been going in circles around a single star for millions of years now (counting our hominid ancestors) and no one seems to complain.

The best solution would be to build a generational ship that is like a mini-Earth. Treat it like a planet orbiting the Sun with the added bonus of your ancestors actually reaching a more interesting destination.

Well, if it's a place like Pandora in the film Avatar it is worth the trip.

 

[Strathos]

Not everyone agrees that God and Heaven are totally apart from time since God is described as working within the parameters of the temporal.

I liken it to a person standing outside of a pond, but who can still influence the pond by throwing stones into it. Just one possible metaphor.

Well, if it's a place like Pandora in the film Avatar it is worth the trip.

A world with a poisonous atmosphere and deadly creatures that will kill you on sight. Sounds lovely.

 

[timewerx]

We have been going in circles around a single star for millions of years now (counting our hominid ancestors) and no one seems to complain.

The best solution would be to build a generational ship that is like a mini-Earth. Treat it like a planet orbiting the Sun with the added bonus of your ancestors actually reaching a more interesting destination.

Based on the combined principles of Frame-Dragging and General Relativity, a more massive ship would certainly have it easier exceeding the speed of light relative to distant stationary observer.

 

[Radrook]

I liken it to a person standing outside of a pond, but who can still influence the pond by throwing stones into it. Just one possible metaphor.



A world with a poisonous atmosphere and deadly creatures that will kill you on sight. Sounds lovely.

How exactly is God OUTSIDE of time? There are events that take place in heaven. There is a before and an after in heaven. Things flow from past to present to future in heaven for God and all his heavenly creatures. So the concept that God is outside of time or that time didn't exist until he caused the BIG Bang seems inapplicable.

In fact, there are physicists who hypothesize about events taking place in a temporally linear way even before the Big Bang. In short, they imagine that time only came into existence for our universe after the Big Bang but that events were occurring before it in other universes and in the realm where those universes are supposedly existing. So if time existed prior to the BB for those universes, how is it that it didn't exist for God simply because he is God? So I guess we disagree on that.

BTW

About Pandora not being inviting:
You are right, there is a danger of wildlife attack and the atmosphere is unbreathable to us. But to me the bioluminescent beauty, the panoramic scenery such as the Halleluiah Mountains which defy gravity, and the fascinating fauna of Pandora which can be studied and observed at a safe distance more than compensate for it.
I guess feel the same about our solar system's Jovian moons Titan and Europa. They are inviting despite their extreme coldness because they have fascinating Earthlike compensatory features which invite both exploration and study.

 

[Radrook]

The thing is, if you're on a spaceship 2000 light-years away from Earth, and if you somehow manage to transport yourself instantaneously to Earth, you'll end up on Earth 2000 years ago, unless you also independently travel 2000 years forward in time.

So the Earth and its people and animals are all still existing right now just waiting for visitors and things that haven't happened yet have already happened? That might work out mathematically on paper but I seriously doubt that it is describing an actual reality.

 

[Radrook]

The thing is, if you're on a spaceship 2000 light-years away from Earth, and if you somehow manage to transport yourself instantaneously to Earth, you'll end up on Earth 2000 years ago, unless you also independently travel 2000 years forward in time.

So the Earth and its people and animals are all still existing right now just waiting for visitors? That might work out mathematically on paper but I seriously doubt that it is describing an actual reality.

 

[Strathos]

How exactly is God OUTSIDE of time? There are events that take place in heaven. There is a before and an after in heaven. Things flow from past to present to future in heaven for God and all his heavenly creatures. So the concept that God is outside of time or that time didn't exist until he caused the BIG Bang seems inapplicable.

In fact, there are physicists who hypothesize about events taking place in a temporally linear way even before the Big Bang. In short, they imagine that time only came into existence for our universe after the Big Bang but that events were occurring before it in other universes and in the realm where those universes are supposedly existing. So if time existed prior to the BB for those universes, how is it that it didn't exist for God simply because he is God? So I guess we disagree on that

Well I think that scripture supports the idea that God doesn't experience time the same way as we do (2 Peter 3:8 for example). But He can interact with us in a way that we can understand with our linear perception of time.

The details are probably beyond our comprehension, like the divine mystery of the Trinity (3 that are 1).

 

[Radrook]

Well I think that scripture supports the idea that God doesn't experience time the same way as we do (2 Peter 3:8 for example). But He can interact with us in a way that we can understand with our linear perception of time.

The details are probably beyond our comprehension, like the divine mystery of the Trinity (3 that are 1).

Well, his perception of time is definitely described as being different since it allows 1000 Earth years to elapse and it seems to him as a day is for us or as a watch in the night.

Psalms 90:4

“For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.”

Strange how warp drive has the potential of giving us an even more drastic perspective.

 

[keith99]

Warp drive in the Star Trek sense simply will not happen. It was and is a clumsy way to ignore relativity and travel faster than light speed.

There may be other ways. Those ways may be limited to specific places or may be general. We simply won't be able to even make decent guesses until we actually go into space in a serious way and try. I can guarantee some early trials will be fatal.

 

[Radrook]

Warp drive in the Star Trek sense simply will not happen. It was and is a clumsy way to ignore relativity and travel faster than light speed.

There may be other ways. Those ways may be limited to specific places or may be general. We simply won't be able to even make decent guesses until we actually go into space in a serious way and try. I can guarantee some early trials will be fatal.

There are always individuals with suicidal tendencies who are willing to blindly go where nobody has gone before.

BTW
I have a feeling that the baby steps which we are fearfully willing to take in personal space exploration will keep us in our solar system for maybe the next thousand years or beyond. Especially if the first brave souls wind up getting spaghettified, or unceremoniously disintegrated in the initial process.

Spaghettification - Wikipedia

 

[keith99]

There are always individuals with suicidal tendencies who are willing to blindly go where nobody has gone before.

BTW
I have a feeling that the baby steps which we are fearfully willing to take in personal space exploration will keep us in our solar system for maybe the next thousand years or beyond. Especially if the first brave souls wind up getting spaghettified, or unceremoniously disintegrated in the initial process.

Spaghettification - Wikipedia

Unless the companies backing those first few end up getting a payoff from the exploitation of resources that makes the gold shipped back to Europe from the New World look like pocket change, which is very possible.