Venerate

[livingword26]

The Bible is revelation that is authoritative in matters of faith, doctrine, salvation, and spirituality. It is not however the Word; that title is Jesus the Christ's only, and those who give it to others are performing latria to a book.

Rev 1:1-2
(1) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
(2) Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

2Ti 3:16-17
(16) All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
(17) That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

 

[PaladinValer]

My bible says "Holy Bible" on it. What does yours say.

Dumb means unable to speak for itself.

Difficult means hard.

Mine actually says "Holy Bible" too. However, I'm not so egotistical to think that my limited experience with various subjects, especially those which I have little to no formal training in, allows me, even with the Holy Spirit, to allow me to fully comprehend the Holy Scriptures on my own.

No, I rely on a collective interpreative process in which many, not just one lone individual, discuss with the Holy Spirit as their guide and invoked aid. I am a voice, strong but not infallible. I also rely on what others in the past have said who were far more knowledgeable than I.

Now if you want an actual single scholar of the Bible, I will direct you to St. Augustine of Hippo or one of the other great doctors of the Church who did have the shema necessary. As strong as mine is, particularly in history, geography, theology, and religious studies, it is not even close to his.

 

[PaladinValer]

ROFL don't it though.........

I doubt it'll last long. I smell an IP ban

Edit: See? Gone already!

Rev 1:1-2
(1) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
(2) Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Word of God=Jesus.

It refers to both Him and of His testimony.

2Ti 3:16-17
(16) All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
(17) That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Point being? It doesn't make it the Word of God, which the Bible gives only to one thing, or I should say, Person: Jesus the Christ.

The Bible contains the words (note the plural) of God but it itself is not the Word of God.

 

[livingword26]

Mine actually says "Holy Bible" too. However, I'm not so egotistical to think that my limited experience with various subjects, especially those which I have little to no formal training in, allows me, even with the Holy Spirit, to allow me to fully comprehend the Holy Scriptures on my own.

Then how can you dismiss a very long list of scriptures that describe what the word of God is, even going so far as to use it in conjunction with Jesus Christ in the same sentence, without even bothering to address the scriptures themselves?

2 Cor 4:2
2 But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .
KJV

 

[Epiphanygirl]

Kumbaya my Lord.........

 

[livingword26]

Prov 30:5-6

5 Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.
6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
KJV

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .
KJV

These two verses refer to "every" word of God. I guess that there are more than one Jesus Christs.

 

[kepha31]

Hhmm...
Who shall I address first? There is too many on the thread, so I'll start at the top of the page.

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .
KJV

Rev 20:4
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God , and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
KJV

Rev 1:9
9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God , and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
KJV

Eph 6:17

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God :
KJV

2 Cor 4:2
2 But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.
KJV

Acts 18:11
11 And he continued there a year and six months, teaching the word of God among them.
KJV

Acts 4:31
1 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
KJV

Luke 8:11
11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God .
KJV

Acts 13:42-44
42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God .
KJV

Give me a verse in the bible that explicitly states the "word of God" is confined to the written word only. Written, yes, but confined to the written word only?? The answer is there is no verse. It does not exist. God is not so limited as to narrow his Divine Revelation to the written word alone. We are Christians, not Muslems.

Woah, i am sure that everyone on here will disagree that The Bible is a dumb and difficult book.....You have spoken against The Word of God and i will pray for you that you repent before your final hour! You need to go and pray and ask for forgiveness...and try not to post in anger. God Bless You!

No, he means the Bible is disparaged and cannot be interpreted apart from the Church that gave it to you. Self-interpretation of scripture apart from the Magisterium is forbidden in the Bible, and there is no verse that says the bible is self-explanatory. The Bible should never be so denigrated as it is by those who reject God's design.

The root of the problem has exposed itself. The bible is the word of God and the scriptures I posted clearly back that up. But I guess if you don't believe that the bible is the word of God then the scriptural proof just doesn't matter.

If course the Bible is the WRITTEN word of God, Jesus is the Word made flesh. But the bible is not the ONLY word of God. Just because Tradition is a different mode of transmission does not make it inferior. Preserving the books of the Bible before they became a Bible is also a Tradition. It is also proof that those opposed to Tradition dont know what Tradition is.

2Ti 3:16-17
(16) All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
(17) That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Not enough context.

2Ti 3:14 But as for you, continue in what you have learned (TRADITION) and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it (MAGISTERIUM) 15 and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings (SCRIPTURE) which are able to instruct you for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
17 that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.

Note that Scripture is not the first thing on his list but the last. And he tells them that the Bible is "profitable" not sufficient to instruct us. It is only when we include Scripture with Tradition and Magisterium that we are "fully equipped."

I challenge any to prove the full doctrine of Scripture (ie., canon, inspiration, inerrancy, authority, etc.) independently of Tradition.


Incidently, you cannot separate the office of bishop from the Gospel message he has been entrusted with, to teach. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that each individual believer can interpret scripture apart from the Magisterium of the Church.

Jesus did not condemn all traditions, just one: the one that the scribes and Pharisees invented so they could claim to give all glory to God, and have no honor left for their parents. Jesus said, "Your traditions..." Not the traditions He himself kept.

Seems to me there are some who even deny having a mother. Let him surely die!

 

[lionroar0]

5 Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.
6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
KJV

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .
KJV

These two verses refer to "every" word of God. I guess that there are more than one Jesus Christs.

it would be helpful for your argument if you can quote someone in this thread saying that there is more then one Jesus. Otherwise with out evidence your post is arguing a straw man.

Peace

 

[livingword26]

Hhmm...
Who shall I address first? There is too many on the thread, so I'll start at the top of the page.


Give me a verse in the bible that explicitly states the "word of God" is confined to the written word only. Written, yes, but confined to the written word only?? The answer is there is no verse. It does not exist. God is not so limited as to narrow his Divine Revelation to the written word alone. We are Christians, not Muslems.

Indeed, Jesus is the word made flesh

No, he means the Bible is disparaged and cannot be interpreted apart from the Church that gave it to you. Self-interpretation of scripture apart from the Magisterium is forbidden in the Bible,

1Jo 2:27
(27) But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

I challenge any to prove the full doctrine of Scripture (ie., canon, inspiration, inerrancy, authority, etc.) independently of Tradition.

Tradition is good as long as it does not contradict the bible.

Act 17:11
(11) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the Scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Incidently, you cannot separate the office of bishop from the Gospel message he has been entrusted with, to teach. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that each individual believer can interpret scripture apart from the Magisterium of the Church.

Again:

1Jo 2:27
(27) But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

And

Joh 16:13
(13) Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

Seems to me there are some who even deny having a mother. Let him surely die!

If yo are referring to Mary as the "Queen of heaven" perhaps you could post some scripture.

 

[livingword26]

it would be helpful for your argument if you can quote someone in this thread saying that there is more then one Jesus. Otherwise with out evidence your post is arguing a straw man.

Peace

If Jesus is not the Word of God then these scriptures refer to more than one Jesus

Excuse me, but I'm rather tired of you telling me to worship a dumb and difficult book. I worship the Living God, not a text, and Christianity does not tolerate anyone suggesting that the Bible is the Word. That title is Jesus' and Jesus' only.

Prov 30:5-6

5 Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.
6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
KJV

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .
KJV

These two verses refer to "every" word of God. I guess that there are more than one Jesus Christs.

 

[lionroar0]

Indeed, Jesus is the word made flesh

Does not equal Bible.

And right before 1John2:27 says...

20But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.[d] 21I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

24See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is what he promised us—even eternal life. 26I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. 27As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him.

John is not talking to individuals but a church. He is telling them to keep to what they have heard and to keep away from other other who are trying to lead them astray.Not that they will be taught magically by the Holy Spirit.

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

If Jesus is not the Word of God then these scriptures refer to more than one Jesus

ANd has some said that Jesus is not the Word.

Do you woship the Bible or who the Bible points to?

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

Joh 16:13
(13) Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

Jesus was speaking to the Apostles not everyone that read those words in the bible.
He was telling the apostles about Pentecost.

Peace

 

[livingword26]

Jesus was speaking to the Apostles not everyone that read those words in the bible.
He was telling the apostles about Pentecost.

Peace

Wrong, any follower of Jesus Christ receives the Holy Spirit. That is how you get saved, through the workings of the Holy Spirit. If we just had to follow the instructions of others, why did Jesus have to die? If we could just follow the Law, why salvation? No one is saved without the Holy Spirit. No one understands truth without the Holy Spirit.

 

[livingword26]

ANd has some said that Jesus is not the Word.

Do you woship the Bible or who the Bible points to?

Peace

I only worship God. I venerate the bible.

 

[lionroar0]

only worship God. I venerate the bible.

Catholics do the samething.

Peace

 

[livingword26]

Does not equal Bible.

And right before 1John2:27 says...

20But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.[d] 21I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

24See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. 25And this is what he promised us—even eternal life. 26I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. 27As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him.

John is not talking to individuals but a church. He is telling them to keep to what they have heard and to keep away from other other who are trying to lead them astray.Not that they will be taught magically by the Holy Spirit.

Peace

Indeed, John is speaking to the Church, of which I am a member. The church is made of people, people with the Holy Spirit in them. No Holy Spirit, not a member of the Church, unable to discern truth.

1 John 4:4-6

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth , and the spirit of error.
KJV

 

[lionroar0]

Wrong, any follower of Jesus Christ receives the Holy Spirit. That is how you get saved, through the workings of the Holy Spirit. If we just had to follow the instructions of others, why did Jesus have to die? If we could just follow the Law, why salvation? No one is saved without the Holy Spirit. No one understands truth without the Holy Spirit.

You misunderstand.

I did not say that belivers do not get the Holy Spirit.

What I said was that Jesus was only speaking to the Aposltes in the verses that you posted. He was telling them about Pentecost.

The whole discourse start at chapter 13 At what we call the Last supper. It starts with Him washing the Apostles feet.

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth , and the spirit of error.
KJV

He speaking to the Church wich already knows the Truth. They are to keep it. They do not require any new teachings from those that do not have the Truth nor have not beign anointed.

Peace

 

[kepha31]

Luke 4:3-4
3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God .

Does that apply to the words Jesus said in John 6 as "every word of God."???