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the Lake of Fore and the New Jerusalam obviously happen at the same time. They are described the same way, they both are as long as the last age, which is forever.the argument (mine) makes perfect sense because you are using one descriptive word to describe two different things and saying that since the same descriptive word is used the two different things are the same size. I have given three examples as to how this logic does not function.
That isn't God's will, it's His "read in" will by people who want it toOh the heresy! God being able to fulfill His own will! It's been provided for you time and again and yet you seemingly insist that it's impossible. Along with other people suffering interminably in order to conform to the "right" doctrine... AMEN!!
What has been provided is cut and paste commontaries and out of context verses. Nothing scripturly sound. The whole idea is proprosterous, out of charactor for a righteous God in a sinful, rebelous universe.Oh the heresy! God being able to fulfill His own will! It's been provided for you time and again and yet you seemingly insist that it's impossible. Along with other people suffering interminably in order to conform to the "right" doctrine... AMEN!!
If you guys would stick to quoting scripture we could talk easier.
This is the Christian Philosophy and Ethics sub-forum. Philosophical inquiry was one of the bases upon which I first became interested in Universalism.
I have tried consistently to bring philosophical inquiries into this topic, but you and others appear unwilling to give that brand of argument proper due. Scripture is a valuable resource, but one should not ignore the value of philosophy. In fact, philosophy enables us to interpret Scripture at all.
I'm simply saying, for the record (since this is 'my' topic and all), Scripture need not and will not be the only resource used in this discussion.
I don't mind philosophy, but Christians should measure all things by scripture. My request was for "QOUTING" scripture, rather than giving us the mis-interpretation of it. I would say minds are equally closed on both sides. If it were only you I wouldn't waste as much time here in a Universalist thread, but others tune in to read and follow and I want them to get the truth, especially the truth of what scripture says about those who will NOT be living with God in the new holy city, those who will not excape the Lake of Fire (Rev. 21:6,7,8).This is the Christian Philosophy and Ethics sub-forum. Philosophical inquiry was one of the bases upon which I first became interested in Universalism.
I have tried consistently to bring philosophical inquiries into this topic, but you and others appear unwilling to give that brand of argument proper due. Scripture is a valuable resource, but one should not ignore the value of philosophy. In fact, philosophy enables us to interpret Scripture at all.
I'm simply saying, for the record (since this is 'my' topic and all), Scripture need not and will not be the only resource used in this discussion.
There is most definitly heresey on this thread. Those who teach God does not have the right to send away those who live in rebelion of Him.Oh the heresy! God being able to fulfill His own will! It's been provided for you time and again and yet you seemingly insist that it's impossible. Along with other people suffering interminably in order to conform to the "right" doctrine... AMEN!!
Sorry; I tend to overestimate others' familiarity with Scripture.why don't you quote scripture unstead of mis-interpreting it for us!
It appears that many would rather be assured of their "free will" thanOh the heresy! God being able to fulfill His own will! It's been provided for you time and again and yet you seemingly insist that it's impossible. Along with other people suffering interminably in order to conform to the "right" doctrine... AMEN!!
We are not hijacking it. We are not abusing it. We hold Scripture to be of great value. We are simply trying to discern what it is truly saying.
There is a very deep thread of arrogance in your argument. 'Because someone disagrees with me (that is, they have come to a different conclusion), they must be wrong.' This is the essence of a closed mind, and closed minds are of no value to discussions, or to God (after all, did it not take an open mind to take the first step in the Christian walk? Does it not talk an open mind to heed and listen to the voice of God?).
Be more charitable to your brothers and sisters.
Nadine- As far as repentance In the Lake Of Fire, after we are judged we are not delivered until we have paid the Uttermost farthing.
Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
God has the right to do whatever He wishes. What we're trying toThere is most definitly heresey on this thread. Those who teach God does not have the right to send away those who live in rebelion of Him.
I figured this was the sort of response I would get.I can recognize a total waste of time. You cut and past your out of context verses, stick the word "UNITLL" in the mittle and quote something completely mis-interpreted, and I'm supposed to go through them all and quote them accurately and explain them? NO, the people can read for themselve, it only takes one or two to see what you have done, if you even did it yourself. You are so sold out you don't believe scripture anyway. To argue scripture with you is futile until you believe what it says.
Evil is not so powerful God isn't able to disintegrate it entirely? On the contrary, God is entirely able. But he allows it to exist, and always exist, as a matter of choice. What kind of world would it be if we have no choice in our destiny?
God has the right to do whatever He wishes. What we're trying to
get through to you is that evil is not so powerful that God has to find
a place to relocate it because He wasn't powerful enough to
disintegrate it entirely. This is THE God we're talking about here,
not some lesser derivative with no more power than the average joe.
.
.
Exactly.Universalism basically teaches that you can do whatever you want and still go to heaven, that is blasphemy.
yet you are on a site that titles itself as Christian, and it is open conversation, and of course you will be challenged, and if challenged by Christians, you will be challenged with Bible verses, the Word of God, by which Christians live by and draw strength from for it is a Lamp unto our feet and a Light unto our path.
Philosophy is man's limited ideas,
dreaming with no destination in mind
sometimes a means of escape
and sometimes a diversion from looking life square in the eye and sometimes it is merely wishful thinking...you could say at times it's verbal pot.
I don't mind philosophy, but Christians should measure all things by scripture.
My request was for "QOUTING" scripture, rather than giving us the mis-interpretation of it. I would say minds are equally closed on both sides. If it were only you I wouldn't waste as much time here in a Universalist thread, but others tune in to read and follow and I want them to get the truth, especially the truth of what scripture says about those who will NOT be living with God in the new holy city, those who will not excape the Lake of Fire (Rev. 21:6,7,8).
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