Uh oh, Another allegation against Kavanaugh

[Halbhh]

Should the statute of limitation come into play in this?

People do change over time, I know I have done things in my past that I wouldn't even think about doing now.

Really like your signature quotes, Tanj.

Ah, but we all want to see sinners (meaning every last person) repent.

Does Kavanaugh show humility and repentance in his life generally?

There is no statue of limitations for the Day that really matters.

But there is amazing grace available for those that confess their sins! 1 John chapter 1

 

[Ringo84]

Strawman.

I was writing about the establishment of innocence or guilt - that is wholly in the hands of the Judiciary.

The Executive branch (along with other authorities) can only gather evidence; they do not establish innocence or guilt.

I never said they establish innocence or guilt. Who's the one knocking down a straw man here? I said that investigation will show Kavanaugh's innocence or guilt very quickly, because if they look into his life and find nothing, that will show Ford to be a liar. They won't even do that.
Ringo

 

[ananda]

You said that it is out of the power of the president and the Senate to initiate an investigation. I responded that this was untrue. That is not a "straw man"; that is refuting your bad faith arguments.

No, I wrote that they can investigate:

I don't oppose an investigation. They can investigate all they want

It seems you do not understand the difference between an investigation and establishing innocence or guilt.

 

[Ringo84]

No, I wrote that they can investigate:



It seems you do not understand the difference between an investigation and establishing innocence or guilt.

You said this:

An aggrieved party must initiate proceedings in the Judiciary; this is not the responsibility of the Senate or the President.

I pointed out that was wrong, and you started arguing about the difference between an investigation and establishment of innocence, which I never disputed.

You're trying to create an issue where there is none. Are you going to start arguing in good faith, or am I going to be done with you?
Ringo

 

[ananda]

I never said they establish innocence or guilt. Who's the one knocking down a straw man here? I said that investigation will show Kavanaugh's innocence or guilt very quickly, because if they look into his life and find nothing, that will show Ford to be a liar. They won't even do that.
Ringo

I did not say that you said that.

I wrote that an aggrieved party must initiate a lawsuit (to establish innocence or guilt) through the Judiciary. You said that was wrong, and that Trump could ask the FBI for an investigation.

Why did you change the subject from initiating lawsuits to investigations, if not to create a strawman?

 

[Ringo84]

I did not say that you said that.

I wrote that an aggrieved party must initiate a lawsuit (to establish innocence or guilt) through the Judiciary. You said that was wrong, and that Trump could ask the FBI for an investigation.

Why did you change the subject from initiating lawsuits to investigations, if not to create a strawman?

You keep moving the goalposts. First you said that the president and the Senate are powerless to begin an investigation. That turned out to be true. Then you started ranting about a non-existent "straw man" about the difference between establishing innocence and an investigation. Now you're revising your first statement to say "Oh but I was talking about a lawsuit".

I don't think you can decide what the issue is here, except that you don't seem to want an investigation to be done of Brett Kavanaugh. I think I'm finished here.
Ringo

 

[essentialsaltes]

Another another allegation.

Government investigators confirmed Monday they’re aware of a potential second sexual assault complaint in the county against former Georgetown Prep student and Supreme Court nominee Kavanaugh.

While investigators weren’t specific and spoke on background, they said they are looking at allegations made against Kavanaugh during his senior year in high school after an anonymous witness voluntarily came forward to speak with them this weekend.

This would potentially bring the number to four women accusing Kavanaugh of wrongdoing [it's not clear whether this is the same person that Avenatti has discussed.]

 

[ananda]

You keep moving the goalposts. First you said that the president and the Senate are powerless to begin an investigation.

Where did I write this? I read through my posts, and I see that nowhere in my posts in this thread.

 

[Halbhh]

Should the statute of limitation come into play in this?

People do change over time, I know I have done things in my past that I wouldn't even think about doing now.

Really like your signature quotes, Tanj.

What I should have added above, to be more clear and full: it's how Christ said --

"Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison."

That "judge" is the one who won't miss a thing -- but has true omniscience! But He is so merciful to forgive those that confess and throw themselves on His mercy.

 

[Halbhh]

Second woman comes forward with misconduct claims

Looks like we're going to have to fire up the microwave and get a couple more cases of popcorn.

Does this make Ford's claim more credible? Is this an offense that he should be punished for?

A general question though -- drunk people don't remember what they did, right? (I'm just having a vague impression that's how it works -- they are really drunk, and can't remember).

As Christine Blasey Ford tells it, only one person can offer eyewitness confirmation of her account of a sexual assault by Supreme Court nominee Brett M. Kavanaugh: Mark Judge, Kavanaugh’s friend and classmate at Georgetown Prep.

Ford says Judge watched Kavanaugh attack her at a high school party in the early 1980s and then literally piled on, leaping on top of her and Kavanaugh. Judge says he does not remember the party and never saw his buddy behave like that. ...

Judge wrote about the pledge he and his friends at the all-male school on Rockville Pike in North Bethesda, Md., made to drink 100 kegs of beer before graduation. On their way to that goal, there was a “disastrous” party “at my house where the place was trashed,” Judge wrote in his book “God and Man at Georgetown Prep.” Kavanaugh listed himself in the class yearbook as treasurer of the “100 Kegs or Bust” club...

‘100 Kegs or Bust’: Kavanaugh friend, Mark Judge, has spent years writing about high school debauchery
(Interesting article continues with more about Judge's life and his increasing progress into deeper learning than he did in the Catholic schools he attended.)

So....that would suggest Kavanaugh could be telling the truth to say he doesn't remember doing any such thing....

 

[essentialsaltes]

A general question though -- drunk people don't remember what they did, right? (I'm just having a vague impression that's how it works -- they are really drunk, and can't remember).

Only if you get blackout drunk, which is not all that common (um, in my experience).

But yes, that's a possibility.

 

[Halbhh]

Only if you get blackout drunk, which is not all that common (um, in my experience).

But yes, that's a possibility.

hmmm....ok, but I'm also thinking of the stories I heard recently via some article shared in a group talking of reading about those driving quite drunk, running over a pedestrian, and not even noticing, even when the body of the victim is still on the car.

It's somewhat like hearsay, but here's an example. Is this realistic?
https://abc13.com/archive/8218296/

 

[Halbhh]

Only if you get blackout drunk, which is not all that common (um, in my experience).

But yes, that's a possibility.

before the blackout...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...ot-remember-what-you-did-while-you-were-drunk

 

[essentialsaltes]

It's somewhat like hearsay, but here's an example. Is this realistic?
Police: Driver leaves pedestrian in windshield as he continues down I-45

I've heard of this happenning once or twice before. It is apparently possible.

I think we have to keep clear two different things -- the impairment of faculties due to being drunk, versus not remembering afterwards.

The person in this news story was apparently so drunk that he didn't know he had hit a person (but knew he had hit something). He knew the event had happened, but was very unclear about the details. This is different from not remembering an event afterwards.

(So the analogy would be that Kavanaugh thought he had merely molested a mannikin, or a stuffed animal. Or less ridiculously, he knew he had molested somebody, but was too impaired to know who it was.)

 

[iluvatar5150]

A general question though -- drunk people don't remember what they did, right? (I'm just having a vague impression that's how it works -- they are really drunk, and can't remember).

It depends. You have to be pretty drunk to not remember *anything*. IME, it's more common to remember pieces - but even then, you have to be pretty hammered. And the alcohol doesn't necessarily hit your system immediately. Depending on a lot of things, it can you hit really hard, really quickly, or it can be really gradual and never peak very high.

 

[Ringo84]

Well, again - I've said this many times before and I'll repeat myself because it bears repeating - an investigation could bear this out. I'm not sure that being so black-out drunk that you have no control over what you're doing is exonerative, though. He did what he did, whether he was drunk or not.
Ringo

 

[whatbogsends]

A general question though -- drunk people don't remember what they did, right? (I'm just having a vague impression that's how it works -- they are really drunk, and can't remember).

As Christine Blasey Ford tells it, only one person can offer eyewitness confirmation of her account of a sexual assault by Supreme Court nominee Brett M. Kavanaugh: Mark Judge, Kavanaugh’s friend and classmate at Georgetown Prep.

Ford says Judge watched Kavanaugh attack her at a high school party in the early 1980s and then literally piled on, leaping on top of her and Kavanaugh. Judge says he does not remember the party and never saw his buddy behave like that. ...

Judge wrote about the pledge he and his friends at the all-male school on Rockville Pike in North Bethesda, Md., made to drink 100 kegs of beer before graduation. On their way to that goal, there was a “disastrous” party “at my house where the place was trashed,” Judge wrote in his book “God and Man at Georgetown Prep.” Kavanaugh listed himself in the class yearbook as treasurer of the “100 Kegs or Bust” club...

‘100 Kegs or Bust’: Kavanaugh friend, Mark Judge, has spent years writing about high school debauchery
(Interesting article continues with more about Judge's life and his increasing progress into deeper learning than he did in the Catholic schools he attended.)

So....that would suggest Kavanaugh could be telling the truth to say he doesn't remember doing any such thing....

It's certainly possible that Kavanaugh did this and was drunk enough to not remember doing it. As I've said in other thread, it's possible that both Ford and Kavanaugh are telling the truth as they remember it, and that the facts can range from one of them being right or somewhere in between.

I had blackout experiences in college. It's not pleasant being unable to remember what you did the night before.

That being said, being too drunk to remember committing sexual assault isn't an excuse for the action, itself.

 

[Allandavid]

I read your signature. I believe Lovecraft would, if his words meant anything, acknowledge Kavanaugh has had his background checked out by the FBI six times already.

And now obviously requires a seventh...

 

[Sistrin]

I'm not sure that being so black-out drunk that you have no control over what you're doing is exonerative, though.

When one is "so black-out drunk" they have no control over what they are doing, the norm is they become incapacitated as opposed to morphing into a sex-crazed monster. Timothy Piazza and the good-old boys from Penn State.

It's certainly possible that Kavanaugh did this and was drunk enough to not remember doing it.

It is possible she was abducted by aliens from Tralfamadore. Just as much evidence exist to support that theory as exist to support her allegation against Kavanaugh.

He did what he did, whether he was drunk or not.

I am sure the boys in Congress would appreciate it if you shared your evidence Kavanaugh is guilty with them.

 

[Sistrin]

How long did the Anita Hill investigation last?

A question which is irrelevant. We no longer live in the Anita Hill age in context of how far liberal Democrats are willing to go or what they are willing to do in order to achieve a goal. The goal here is to destroy Brett Kavanaugh by any means necessary. In pursuit of that goal allow an investigation by the FBI to open and it will not end, it will not be allowed to end, until one way or another liberals get what they want. Just as has been proven constant during the entire Meuller investigation, the truth will not matter.