Twisted Scripture (False Doctrines)

[Jack Terrence]

Absolutely wrong!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Absolutely wrong!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Absolultely wrong!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Jesus said that he who believes should not perish, but have eternal life

Absolutely wrong! Relationship is what cannot be lost. Fellowship is lost WHEN a believer sins.

Absolutely wrong! Neither relationship nor fellowship can be lost. There is no scripture anywhere which supports your theory.

Absolutely wrong! God is eternal life. There are no verses that support your claim.

And THIS IS eternal life, that they might KNOW you, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

Nothing has been "compartmentalized". One must only understand the difference between relationship, which cannot be lost, and fellowship, which can.

Translated: One must CREATE the difference between relationship and fellowship.

Let's use a human situation that you should be able to understand.

Marriage. When 2 people marry, they are in a RELATIONSHIP. But they may not always be in fellowship. If that doesn't make sense to you, then there is no hope of getting you to understand the difference.

Poor example. Spouses at their best are not near as committed to their relationship as God is committed to having fellowship with His children. You do not understand the heavenly Father. ALL God's children will be conformed to the image of His Son. This CHIEFLY means that they will be made like Christ in righteousness and true holiness (2 Cor. 3:4-18; Colossians 3:8-11)?

Those who think that aren't thinking. There is no verse that says that.

In other words, ALL Christians until Free Grace Theology was born in the latter 20th century did not think. Please!

Obviously refers to intimate knowledge. Only believers have such intimate knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. Those who only know about Jesus or only know some things do have this intimate knowledge.

Boom! Bang! Pow! You cannot acquire intimate knowledge except through fellowship. You shot yourself in the foot!

And believers possess eternal life. Pretty straight forward.

Of course, but not according to YOUR Greek.

"Whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life."

Oh, stop it. There are NO verses that say that, or even imply that. None.

Oh stop it! There is not one verse in the entire bible which the term "world" means every human being. Therefore, it can mean only the elect.

You are NOT free to super-impose your modern notions of terms back into biblical times.

 

[Bro in Christ]

The question should not be how does one get saved ... but why does not everyone get saved

 

[Bro in Christ]

and why any get saved

 

[FreeGrace2]

Denial is not rebuttal!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Just giving the truth!

Jesus said that he who believes should not perish, but have eternal life

Correct.

Absolutely wrong!

Denial is not rebuttal!

Neither relationship nor fellowship can be lost. There is no scripture anywhere which supports your theory.

There is none that supports yours.

And THIS IS eternal life, that they might KNOW you, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

Translated: One must CREATE the difference between relationship and fellowship.

I reject your "translation". God creates the new creature and adopts us as His children. We don't create anything. I have no idea what your paraphrase means.

Poor example. Spouses at their best are not near as committed to their relationship as God is committed to having fellowship with His children. You do not understand the heavenly Father. ALL God's children will be conformed to the image of His Son. This CHIEFLY means that they will be made like Christ in righteousness and true holiness (2 Cor. 3:4-18; Colossians 3:8-11)?

It's actually a great example. Believers are referred to as the Bride of Christ, and Christ as the husband. I thought that was common knowledge among believers. Of course comparing human husbands to Christ falls short, but the point remains in the difference between relationship and fellowship. But you would just rather ignore it.

Oh stop it! There is not one verse in the entire bible which the term "world" means every human being. Therefore, it can mean only the elect.

What bias!!

 

[extraordinary]

"And THIS IS eternal life, that they might KNOW you, the only true God
and Jesus Christ whom you have sent."
John 17:3 is the one and only place where our Lord EXPLICITLY DEFINES eternal life.

Don't forget ...

John 10:
27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish;
neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Please consider, everyone, what it means to follow Jesus!
Not to mention hearing His voice.
And you say, "Jesus knows me." ... Really? Are you sure about that?

Does following Jesus mean to believe in Him, to trust Him, etc.,
or does it mean more than that, and if so ... how much more?
.

 

[Bro in Christ]

1 cor 15:2 unless you believe in vain.....



why does one go to hell .... john 16:9 because they believe not in Me

good places to start....

and to all you adjetives... what about the thiefs on the cross did he do any of those or just believe?

 

[THIS]

1 cor 15:2 unless you believe in vain.....



why does one go to hell .... john 16:9 because they believe not in Me

good places to start....

and to all you adjetives... what about the thiefs on the cross did he do any of those or just believe?

The thief on the cross did a lot of things.

The thief on the cross feared God; God’s salvation is near those who fear Him. The thief on the cross had faith with right actions. The thief on the cross believed Jesus; the work of God is to believe in the one He sent. The thief on the cross humbled himself. God pleads with people to be humble. The thief admitted his sins, this is confession; he also admitted he deserved his punishment, that is regret for his sin. The thief on the cross confessed Jesus in front of others; Jesus says whoever acknowledges him before others, he will also acknowledge before his Father in heaven The thief also called on the name of the Lord, when he told Jesus to remember him when he got to his kingdom.

God knows our hearts, Acts 15:8. The Bible says His salvation is near all those who fear him, see Psalm 85:9. God says these are the ones I look on with favor:
those who are humble and contrite in spirit,
and who tremble at my word. See Isaiah 66:2.

We are to believe and confess, trust in God, call on the name of the Lord, See Romans 10:10, 11, and 13.

Matthew 10:32 "Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven.

One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Christ? Save yourself and us!” Luke 23:39.

But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.” Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.” Luke 23:40-43.

Jesus answered him, “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise.”

 

[extraordinary]

... what about the thief on the cross did he do any of those or just believe?

Maybe we can put this one to rest ... once and for all ... and for all time also.

The thief did not really have time to ...
fall away from the faith, fall out of God's grace, throw away (reject) his salvation, and many etcs.

And let's not forget Jesus' parable about the latecomers getting as much grace as the hard-workin' early birds.
.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Maybe we can put this one to rest ... once and for all ... and for all time also.

The thief did not really have time to ...
fall away from the faith, fall out of God's grace, throw away (reject) his salvation, and many etcs.

Regardless of what the thief "might have been able to do", given enough time, is irrelevant anyway. Why? Because Paul "put this one to rest…once and for all…and for all time also".

Romans 8:38
For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Romans 8:39
nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The "things present" and "things to come" refer to ANY thing that occurs. So, even if the thief might have later lost his faith, the promise remains; nothing will be able to separate us (those who have believed) from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

And let's not forget Jesus' parable about the latecomers getting as much grace as the hard-workin' early birds.
.

Yes, everyone gets grace, none of which is earned, of course.

It is because of God's grace that salvation is secured by God.

 

[THIS]

Regardless of what the thief "might have been able to do", given enough time, is irrelevant anyway. Why? Because Paul "put this one to rest…once and for all…and for all time also".

Romans 8:38
For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Romans 8:39
nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The "things present" and "things to come" refer to ANY thing that occurs. So, even if the thief might have later lost his faith, the promise remains; nothing will be able to separate us (those who have believed) from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.


Yes, everyone gets grace, none of which is earned, of course.

It is because of God's grace that salvation is secured by God.

Of course, people can fall away from Jesus see Galatians 5:4; 1 Corinthians 10:12; 2 Peter 3:17. We are warned not to drift away, Hebrews 2:1, not to draw back, Hebrews 10:38. We are told how not to fall, 2 Peter 1:10, how not to be hardened, Hebrews 3:8,13.

God can throw people out, Matthew 22:13, blot people out, Exodus 32:32-33, remove your lampstand, Revelation 2:5, sign you a place with unbelievers, Luke 12:46, and cut you off, Romans 11:19-21. We can become defiled, Hebrews 12:15. Our lamps can burn out, Matthew 25:8. We can cause ourselves to have to have Christ formed in us again, Galatians 4:19.

We are told how to remain in Jesus, John 6:56, and if we do Jesus will remain in us, John 15:4. Jesus tells us of the good if we remain in him, John 15:5, and of the bad when we do not, John 15:6. Jesus exhorts us to remain in him, John 15:9, 10, Acts 14:22, and 1 John 2:24.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Of course, people can fall away from Jesus see Galatians 5:4; 1 Corinthians 10:12; 2 Peter 3:17. We are warned not to drift away, Hebrews 2:1, not to draw back, Hebrews 10:38. We are told how not to fall, 2 Peter 1:10, how not to be hardened, Hebrews 3:8,13.

Yes, people can do all of these things. But none of these things means loss of salvation.

Is there a clear verse that specifically warns against loss of salvation by any means?

God can throw people out, Matthew 22:13, blot people out, Exodus 32:32-33, remove your lampstand, Revelation 2:5, sign you a place with unbelievers, Luke 12:46, and cut you off, Romans 11:19-21. We can become defiled, Hebrews 12:15. Our lamps can burn out, Matthew 25:8. We can cause ourselves to have to have Christ formed in us again, Galatians 4:19.

I believe you have misunderstood these verses. None of them refer to loss of salvation.

We are told how to remain in Jesus, John 6:56, and if we do Jesus will remain in us, John 15:4.

This refers to fellowship with Him. Relationship is forever. Fellowship is what can be lost by lifestyle.

Jesus tells us of the good if we remain in him, John 15:5, and of the bad when we do not, John 15:6. Jesus exhorts us to remain in him, John 15:9, 10, Acts 14:22, and 1 John 2:24.

Again, it's about fellowship.

Relationship, once established, cannot be broken. The Bible clearly says that those who believe become children of God. A child is ALWAYS a child, no way around it.

 

[THIS]

[FONT=&quot]Yes, people can do all of these things. But none of these things means loss of salvation.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Of course, it means loss of salvation. Salvation is now, and later. If you have fallen away from Christ, then what kind of salvation do you have in this life? None.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
Is there a clear verse that specifically warns against loss of salvation by any means?

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]All those scriptures I gave you are warnings.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Here are some more:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matthew 5:13[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][ Salt and Light ] “You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matthew 8:12[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Luke 13:28[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Luke 14:35[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; it is thrown out. “Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I believe you have misunderstood these verses. None of them refer to loss of salvation.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I think that you are denying God’s Truth. What do you think those scriptures are saying if not warning us about losing salvation?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Again, it's about fellowship.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Fellowship with Jesus Christ is salvation. If you are not living through the Spirit, then from what are you saved?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
Relationship, once established, cannot be broken. The Bible clearly says that those who believe become children of God. A child is ALWAYS a child, no way around it.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Show the scripture that says that. You cannot show a scripture that says that, because it does not exist. Not only does it not exist, it goes against the many scriptures I gave that warn us.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

 

[extraordinary]

As a postscript to THIS, who has some considerable insight, I present ...
(Perhaps he should call himself THIS INSIGHT.)

Years ago, Finis Jennings Dake was a very highly-respected Bible scholar!
Just came across this in Dake’s Anotated Reference Bible (1399 pages + drawings, maps, etc.).

23 Conditions of Eternal Life
1 … Come to Jesus (John 6:37, 44, 45, 65)
2 … Eat His flesh – drink His blood (John 6:50-58)
3 … Labour (John 6:27)
4 … Reap (John 4:35-38)
5 … Hate (love less) the life in this world (John 12:25)
6 … Know God and Christ (John17:2-3)
7 … Enter the right gate (Matt 7:13-14)
8 … Cause no offense (Matt 18:8-9)
9 … Keep the commandments (Matt 19:17)
10 … Forsake all (Matt 19:27-29, Mark 10:28-30, Luke 18:28-30)
11 … Live free from sin (Rom 5:21, Rom 6:16-23, Rom 8:1-13, Titus 2:11-14)
...... WOW, I’m not the only one who “gets” what Paul was saying in Romans 6!
12 … Continue in well-doing and seek eternal life (Rom 2:7)
13 … Sow to the Spirit (Gal 6:7-8)
14 … Fight the good fight of faith; lay hold on it (1 Tim 6:12, 6:19)
15 … Be sober and hope to the end for it (Titus 1:2, 3:7, 1 Peter 1:5-13)
16 … Endure temptations (James 1:12)
17 … Let the promise of it remain in you (1 John 2:24-25, 5:11-20)
18 … Love everyone (1 John 3:14-15)
19 … Keep yourself in the love of God, looking for eternal life (Jude 20-24)
20 … Overcome sin (Rev 2:7, 2:11, 2:17, 2:26, 3:5, 3:12, 3:21)
21 … Be faithful unto death (Rev 2:10, Heb 12:14-15)
22 … Believe and obey the gospel (John Chapters 3-6, 2 Cor 5:17, Rom 1:5)
23 … Be born again, hear Christ, follow Him (John 3, John 10:27-29)

Dake continues:
“We get eternal life now and keep it forever, if we meet the above conditions,
but it does not become an unforfeitable eternal possession until we …
“enter into” it (Matt 7:13, 18:8-9, 19:17, Rom 6:22,)
“receive” it (Rom 6;23, James 1:12, 1 Peter 1:13, Rev 2:10)
“reap” it (Gal 6:7-8)
“inherit” it in the world to come (Matt 19:27-29, Mark 10:28-30, Luke 18:28-30)
and at the “end” of this life (Rom 6:22)”

The question … What could be more obvious than eternal life is conditional?
The answer … Not much, except to receive spiritual Truth,
one needs to be free from pre-conceived biases and brainwashings.

Dake’s note on “eternal life”(John 3:15) and “everlasting life”(John 3:16)
“The life itself is eternal. Man’s possession of it does not change
its nature or existence. It is eternal whether man loses it or not.
It is still eternal whether man loses it or not. It is like an eternal diamond or
anything else eternal. It always remains eternal, and is only in Jesus Christ.”
.

 

[THIS]

As a postscript to THIS, who has some considerable insight, I present ...
(Perhaps he should call himself THIS INSIGHT.)

Years ago, Finis Jennings Dake was a very highly-respected Bible scholar!
Just came across this in Dake’s Anotated Reference Bible (1399 pages + drawings, maps, etc.).

23 Conditions of Eternal Life
1 … Come to Jesus (John 6:37, 44, 45, 65)
2 … Eat His flesh – drink His blood (John 6:50-58)
3 … Labour (John 6:27)
4 … Reap (John 4:35-38)
5 … Hate (love less) the life in this world (John 12:25)
6 … Know God and Christ (John17:2-3)
7 … Enter the right gate (Matt 7:13-14)
8 … Cause no offense (Matt 18:8-9)
9 … Keep the commandments (Matt 19:17)
10 … Forsake all (Matt 19:27-29, Mark 10:28-30, Luke 18:28-30)
11 … Live free from sin (Rom 5:21, Rom 6:16-23, Rom 8:1-13, Titus 2:11-14)
...... WOW, I’m not the only one who “gets” what Paul was saying in Romans 6!
12 … Continue in well-doing and seek eternal life (Rom 2:7)
13 … Sow to the Spirit (Gal 6:7-8)
14 … Fight the good fight of faith; lay hold on it (1 Tim 6:12, 6:19)
15 … Be sober and hope to the end for it (Titus 1:2, 3:7, 1 Peter 1:5-13)
16 … Endure temptations (James 1:12)
17 … Let the promise of it remain in you (1 John 2:24-25, 5:11-20)
18 … Love everyone (1 John 3:14-15)
19 … Keep yourself in the love of God, looking for eternal life (Jude 20-24)
20 … Overcome sin (Rev 2:7, 2:11, 2:17, 2:26, 3:5, 3:12, 3:21)
21 … Be faithful unto death (Rev 2:10, Heb 12:14-15)
22 … Believe and obey the gospel (John Chapters 3-6, 2 Cor 5:17, Rom 1:5)
23 … Be born again, hear Christ, follow Him (John 3, John 10:27-29)

Dake continues:
“We get eternal life now and keep it forever, if we meet the above conditions,
but it does not become an unforfeitable eternal possession until we …
“enter into” it (Matt 7:13, 18:8-9, 19:17, Rom 6:22,)
“receive” it (Rom 6;23, James 1:12, 1 Peter 1:13, Rev 2:10)
“reap” it (Gal 6:7-8)
“inherit” it in the world to come (Matt 19:27-29, Mark 10:28-30, Luke 18:28-30)
and at the “end” of this life (Rom 6:22)”

The question … What could be more obvious than eternal life is conditional?
The answer … Not much, except to receive spiritual Truth,
one needs to be free from pre-conceived biases and brainwashings.

Dake’s note on “eternal life”(John 3:15) and “everlasting life”(John 3:16)
“The life itself is eternal. Man’s possession of it does not change
its nature or existence. It is eternal whether man loses it or not.
It is still eternal whether man loses it or not. It is like an eternal diamond or
anything else eternal. It always remains eternal, and is only in Jesus Christ.”
.

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Well, I am glad that you see insight to what I am saying. I do not know who Dake is; however, it sounds as if Dake, you, and I agree that we have a part in our salvation.[/FONT]

 

[FreeGrace2]

Of course, it means loss of salvation. Salvation is now, and later. If you have fallen away from Christ, then what kind of salvation do you have in this life? None.

No, it does not mean loss of salvation. There are no verses that tell us that salvation can be lost. None.

And your question makes no sense. "what kind of salvation do you have in this life?" Our salvation looks ahead to eternity. It isn't based on the temporal.

All those scriptures I gave you are warnings.

Yep. Warnings of loss of blessings in time and reward in eternity. Nothing about loss of salvation.

[FONT=&quot]Here are some more:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matthew 5:13[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][ Salt and Light ] “You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matthew 8:12[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Luke 13:28[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Luke 14:35[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; it is thrown out. “Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I think that you are denying God’s Truth. What do you think those scriptures are saying if not warning us about losing salvation?[/FONT]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Fellowship with Jesus Christ is salvation. If you are not living through the Spirit, then from what are you saved?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][/FONT]

Again, none of these verses SAYS that salvation can be lost. None. N.O.N.E.

When one believes in Christ, they are Regenerated and born AGAIN to NEW LIFE. And this life is called eternal life.

Eternal life isn't temporary, as your view would claim. It is what it is: eternal.

[FONT=&quot]Show the scripture that says that. You cannot show a scripture that says that, because it does not exist. Not only does it not exist, it goes against the many scriptures I gave that warn us.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

There is no need to "show Scripture" regarding the relationship between Father and child. It is so obvious it doesn't need a verse to support it.

If your view of loss of salvation were correct, why aren't there any verses that specifically tell us that? You have not provided ANY verse that does. You simply misunderstand ALL of them.

When a person believes in Christ, they are born again. Show me HOW eternal life can then die later on.

 

[THIS]

[FONT=&quot]No, it does not mean loss of salvation. There are no verses that tell us that salvation can be lost. None.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You are in denial of what is plainly and clearly written.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
And your question makes no sense. "what kind of salvation do you have in this life?" Our salvation looks ahead to eternity. It isn't based on the temporal.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]We have salvation now, and later.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The Bible says we are saved, see Romans 8:24 and Ephesians 2:5–8, it also says we are being saved, see 1 Corinthians 1:8, 2 Corinthians 2:15, and Philippians 2:12, and I have the assurance that I will be saved, Romans 5:9–10, and 1 Corinthians 3:12–15.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now, I want you to explain to me what kind of salvation do you have now if you stopped having faith in Christ.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Yep. Warnings of loss of blessings in time and reward in eternity. Nothing about loss of salvation.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You are badly mistaken. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]

When one believes in Christ, they are Regenerated and born AGAIN to NEW LIFE. And this life is called eternal life. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you no longer keep the faith, then you no longer have life now. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]

Eternal life isn't temporary, as your view would claim. It is what it is: eternal.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You sound as someone taught by someone who was wrong. I have heard people say what you say, even denying the very scriptures that I have shown you.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Eternal life is not temporary. It is NOW and for later. If you do not stay in the Lord now, then you are now no longer in this salvation. However, you may still be saved from the lake of fire, or not.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]There is no need to "show Scripture" regarding the relationship between Father and child. It is so obvious it doesn't need a verse to support it. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You are so wrong. You prove you believe something that is not in the Bible. You even go against the warnings from Jesus himself.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]We can be sure of our salvation, but we must also heed Jesus’ warnings.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]

If your view of loss of salvation were correct, why aren't there any verses that specifically tell us that? You have not provided ANY verse that does. You simply misunderstand ALL of them.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You deny all the scriptures that I gave you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Luke 14:35[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; it is thrown out. “Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Can you hear?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]

When a person believes in Christ, they are born again. Show me HOW eternal life can then die later on. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I have shown you from the written Word.[/FONT]

 

[Bro in Christ]

The thief on the cross did a lot of things.

The thief on the cross feared God; God’s salvation is near those who fear Him. The thief on the cross had faith with right actions. The thief on the cross believed Jesus; the work of God is to believe in the one He sent. The thief on the cross humbled himself. God pleads with people to be humble. The thief admitted his sins, this is confession; he also admitted he deserved his punishment, that is regret for his sin. The thief on the cross confessed Jesus in front of others; Jesus says whoever acknowledges him before others, he will also acknowledge before his Father in heaven The thief also called on the name of the Lord, when he told Jesus to remember him when he got to his kingdom.

God knows our hearts, Acts 15:8. The Bible says His salvation is near all those who fear him, see Psalm 85:9. God says these are the ones I look on with favor:
those who are humble and contrite in spirit,
and who tremble at my word. See Isaiah 66:2.

We are to believe and confess, trust in God, call on the name of the Lord, See Romans 10:10, 11, and 13.

Matthew 10:32 "Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven.

One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Christ? Save yourself and us!” Luke 23:39.

But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.” Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.” Luke 23:40-43.

Jesus answered him, “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise.”

He believed that JC was God after hours of insulting him JC was silent ..... that was the work of God that he did believe just like Peter in Matt 16

Matt 11:20-24 shows that with a simple message some get EL and others eternal judgement .... at God wills ... connect romans 9

 

[shturt678s]

We were "saved," and are in the process of "being saved." We shall also "shall be saved" providing one can separate the two aspects of "1" call. What is fallaciously done today is combining the "call" within the Epistles with the Gospel's "call" resulting in the fallacious OSAS and even fallacious shades of the former, not even bringing aboard all the warnings about one many lose their faith like Judas did.

Old Jack's lower paygrade opinion

 

[A New Dawn]

We were "saved," and are in the process of "being saved." We shall also "shall be saved" providing one can separate the two aspects of "1" call. What is fallaciously done today is combining the "call" within the Epistles with the Gospel's "call" resulting in the fallacious OSAS and even fallacious shades of the former, not even bringing aboard all the warnings about one many lose their faith like Judas did.

Old Jack's lower paygrade opinion

I don't believe that anyone who has been truly saved is fallaciously combining the "call" within the scriptures with the actual "call" from God. Only those who are not truly saved would make that error, since regeneration brings with it the desire to please God. I don't believe that Judas was ever part of the elect to have fallen away. He was chosen for the job he had to do. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[shturt678s]

I don't believe that anyone who has been truly saved is fallaciously combining the "call" within the scriptures with the actual "call" from God.

Only clarifying, ie, fallaciously viewing as "1" concept, the Scriptural Epistle "call" within the Scriptural call (eg, Rom8:28, 29), and the Gospel's "call" also within the Scriptural call (Matt. chapters 20 and 22).

Only those who are not truly saved would make that error, since regeneration brings with it the desire to please God. I don't believe that Judas was ever part of the elect to have fallen away. He was chosen for the job he had to do. Nothing more, nothing less.

Old Jack's opinion