True Justification, works of the Law of Moses, & Conditional Security

[Bible Highlighter]

If the emboldened is correct, why do you only seek to obey through fear of the penalty for sin? Does love offend the person it loves?
Agai9n, you do not understand the process Jason. When a truly born again believer sins their conscience is seered as with a hot iron. Why? For the law has been placed on their heart. I really do wish you could spend time reflecting on what that actually means

And yet you ignore other parts of Scripture that says, it is the fear of the LORD that men depart from evil. For we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling? Jesus said fear not him who can kill the body, but fear him who can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna (i.e. the Lake of Fire). Yes, perfect love casts out fear, but this is if one has perfected their walk with the LORD by allowing Christ do work in them.


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[stuart lawrence]

Well, I am not a part of the Seventh Day Adventists nor any other church brand name. I am non-denominational as my statement profile says in each of my posts. The SDA Church believes in keeping the Sabbath for salvation. I do not believe that. I also imagine some of them are confused on the topic of salvation, too. Works are not man directed but they are God directed. Christ works in the believer to do of His good will and pleasure.


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I only refer to myself as Christian. I don't know what church you go to, but do all the worshippers believe they have attained to sinless perfection?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

What do I think?
I think..Praise God!

While it is good to praise God, it is just as equally important to preach the Word of truth to others, too (Letting folks not slip into the pits of hell because of sin).


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[stuart lawrence]

And yet you ignore other parts of Scripture that says, it is the fear of the LORD that men depart from evil. For we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling? Jesus said fear not him who can kill the body, but fear him who can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna (i.e. the Lake of Fire). Yes, perfect love casts out fear, but this is if one has perfected their walk with the LORD by allowing Christ do work in them.


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I certainly would fear on giving up on grace, it is the only path that can give you life, and it is certainly the only way you can love God as he wants you to love him
When I believed as you do now, I never loved God, I wanted to, and I so much tried to obey. But how can you love someone if you fear being cast into hell unless you perform perfect, it isnt possible Jason. Now I truly can love God, then I could not

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I only refer to myself as Christian. I don't know what church you go to, but do all the worshippers believe they have attained to sinless perfection?

I believe in house fellowship.


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[Bible Highlighter]

I certainly would fear on giving up on grace, it is the only path that can give you life, and it is certainly the only way you can love God as he wants you to love him
When I believed as you do now, I never loved God, I wanted to, and I so much tried to obey. But how can you love someone if you fear being cast into hell unless you perform perfect, it isnt possible Jason. Now I truly can love God, then I could not

Performing perfectly is done by the working of God in you. Not hating, not lying, not lusting is not hard to do if one abides in Christ.


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[ToBeLoved]

But see, this only works if you ignore the majority of the New Testament, though. There are Commands written in the New Testament that have consequences in not obeying them. Where does it state that these Commands in the New Covenant that have serious after-life consequences have been now made obsolete? Why put forth New Testament Commands with bad after-life consequences just so as to undo them. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense. For why would Jesus scare us with telling us how our entire bodies can be cast into hell-fire if we look upon a woman in lust if there was no real threat in doing so? Is God a respecter of persons? Does Jesus say that a believer can do this on occasion (without worrying about) and yet not the unbeliever? Think about it.
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What are the verses that show that our sins have bad after-life consequences?

Our sin brings us bad consequences here on earth.

After death, we receive our full inheritance in Christ Jesus. We will literally be that new creation.

 

[stuart lawrence]

And yet you ignore other parts of Scripture that says, it is the fear of the LORD that men depart from evil. For we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling? Jesus said fear not him who can kill the body, but fear him who can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna (i.e. the Lake of Fire). Yes, perfect love casts out fear, but this is if one has perfected their walk with the LORD by allowing Christ do work in them.


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You have to rightly divide scripture Jason. The warnings of the fires of hell are to0 the luke warm, not those who truly love God, remember Jesus words.
I will not lose anyone of those you have given me

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Then if you are telling the truth, you know the man ends the chapter being freed from alcohol addiction, foul language, stealing and constant affairs. So why are you so upset with it? b

The thing is that I do not believe it is true or that it will be lasting for that individual. I know this because people have killed themselves because of your belief.


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[stuart lawrence]

Performing perfectly is done by the working of God in you. Not hating, not lying, not lusting is not hard to do if one abides in Christ.


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So it is not hard to perform perfect? Oh Jason, please. If you want peole to take note of your posts, do not write posts such as this one

 

[Bible Highlighter]

What are the verses that show that our sins have bad after-life consequences?

Our sin brings us bad consequences here on earth.

After death, we receive our full inheritance in Christ Jesus. We will literally be that new creation.

Matthew 6:15
1 John 3:15
Matthew 5:28-30.
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Ephesians 5:4-5.
Galatians 5:19-21.
Colossians 3:5-6.
1 Timothy 1:9-10.

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[stuart lawrence]

The thing is that I do not believe it is true or that it will be lasting for that individual. I know this because people have killed themselves because of your belief.


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Then sadly those people did not know the truth.
Paul states the Christian is not under a righteousness of observing the law.
I put multiple scriptures to you(a post you ignored) concerning that
You cannot give me one scripture of any new testament writer where they state, you are not under a righteousness of obedience to the mosaic law, but you are to the moral law. That person mercy who made a few comments is correct, it is one whole law Jason. People have ended up sex addicts due to your belief.;

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So it is not hard to perform perfect? Oh Jason, please. If you want peole to take note of your posts, do not write posts such as this one

A person yields or surrenders to God and then He does the work in them.

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[Bible Highlighter]

Then sadly those people did not know the truth.
Paul states the Christian is not under a righteousness of observing the law.
I put multiple scriptures to you(a post you ignored) concerning that
You cannot give me one scripture of any new testament writer where they state, you are not under a righteousness of obedience to the mosaic law, but you are to the moral law. That person mercy who made a few comments is correct, it is one whole law Jason. People have ended up sex addicts due to your belief.;

As I said before, there are two wrong extreme views to salvation. Man Directed Works Salvationism and Antinomianism or OSAS. But people have believed strongly in OSAS and they committed suicide.

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[stuart lawrence]

A person yields or surrenders to God and then He does the work in them.

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You said it is not hard to perform perfect. I really do mean this sincerely. If you want people to read your posts and take you seriously, you will stop making such comments. It is your choice though

 

[stuart lawrence]

As I said before, there are two wrong extreme views to salvation. Man Directed Works Salvationism and Antinomianism or OSAS. This person believed strongly in OSAS and they committed suicide.

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No Jason, they believed in a righteousness before God of obedience to the moral law, as Paul did vin Rom 7. Do you know what the word concupiscence means?????

 

[stuart lawrence]

Paul speaking, under a righteousness of observing the law(this concerns a moral law)

What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.

11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You said it is not hard to perform perfect. I really do mean this sincerely. If you want people to read your posts and take you seriously, you will stop making such comments. It is your choice though

The Bible speaks in the same way. It speaks of works that we must perform. But it also speaks about how God does that work thru you. So the Bible is speaking from one persective of how you are cooperating with God and the other perspective it is speaking directly of how God works in the believer. So there is no contradiction.


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[stuart lawrence]

The Bible speaks in the same way. It speaks of works that we must perform. But it also speaks about how God does that work thru you. So the Bible is speaking from one persective of how you are cooperating with God and the other perspective it is speaking directly of how God works in the believer. So there is no contradiction.


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I gave you good advice Jason, it is up to you if you accept it

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Paul speaking, under a righteousness of observing the law(this concerns a moral law)

What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.

11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

Yes, Paul is speaking about the Old Testament Law of Moses as an Israelite here. He said when the Commandment came (i.e. the Law of Moses) sin revived and I died. For the knowledge of sin is the Law. But does that mean there was no Law or no sin before the Law of Moses? No. It is talking about how the law was codified and or written down. The Law was added because of transgressions. Paul is not speaking here as a Christian as you will admit. So this passage does not really help you.


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