Trolling around

[AntiCrash]

Ah, you're an expert.. Not true.
It proves this has been important to people for thousands of years.
It's the best preserved ancient book on the planet.

An Expert:

Ex: Unknown quantity
Spurt: A drip under pressure

 

[Hieronymus]

I was talking about it's contents, not it's popularity.

So was i.

 

[AntiCrash]

Are you sure it was the Most High God that imposed that fear on you?

If you are, then you did right to leave in order to ascertain the spirit of fear and imposition you get when you indulge the bible canon. Our Father doesn't work on fear, otherwise He wouldn't have died for us, and literally gone to hell and back. (Of course, going to hell and back for your child is par the course of being a parent.) There are plenty of counterfeit spirits that drive people away from Him.

You aren't an only [spiritual] child; when you don't understand your Father, or think He is being a mean entity, you should consult your Big Brother, or brothers and sisters. Many of us have been where you are; the Word of God Himself has definitely felt the way you do.

Well if you've been where I am you'd be an Ex-Christian.

 

[Spikey]

An Expert:

Ex: Unknown quantity
Spurt: A drip under pressure

I am a drip, but under absolutely no pressure.

 

[Hieronymus]

Well if you've been where I am you'd be an Ex-Christian.

An unknown quantity Christian?

 

[Kaon]

Well if you've been where I am you'd be an Ex-Christian.

I was where you are, and I did undergo a drastic change in how I approached my Father, and understanding how He works. I also had to think for myself, and stop letting other humans tell me how to spiritually live: blind leading blind and such. Our Father gave us a Comforter to convict us and give us hope, He has given us a massive grace period to get our stuff together, He allowed His Son to take on our deserved punishment for breaking His Universal Law, and He is always with us through our trials.

I eventually had to fundamentally change my thinking. You seem new, so you don't know my testimony, but to keep it short I was on top of my intellectual world - I was at what I thought was the peak of my education after finishing my thesis, and I felt even more like my own god because my education was mathematics. I was egotistical and haughty. And, I didn't actually come to Him until after all of that. Now, instead of me using math to demean other people though cleverly veiled intellectual insults and categorization, I was able to fundamentally understand Him through mathematics. To me, this is a big deal, because I did not entertain this dimension of knowledge.

That was the problem; my mind was narrow, despite the intellect I [thought I] had.


My Father stayed with me throughout it - even though I shook my fist at Him for decades, and I was so angry with Him I considered some pretty nefarious things. It was my knowledge that I thought came from my own strength that had me believing I didn't need Him, but it was that same knowledge that kept me chasing after Him - even if it was to "demand" answers. Eventually, I started coming to Him like a child goes to his Father, and that is when He began to calmly instruct me.


You may not have "quit Him" yet, which is why you are here. I would encourage you to direct everything to Him (respectfully), and if you sincerely want a relationship with Him - if there is a kernel of your spirit that knows who He truly is despite what the world and canons may say - then He will come to you.

But, of course, if you [believe] you are truly done with Him, then you are free to leave Him. Unlike the gods of antiquity, He will not force you to sacrifice yourself, or your children, for example, in order to keep His wrath from you. Hell is a consequence of locations that are not within the residence of the Most High God/Word of God. Some people openly choose hell over the Most High God; that is their choice. Just make sure you know who our Father is before you decide either way. Don't let sensationalism (spiritual rumors, gossip and misunderstandings) destroy an eternal relationship.

 

[Serving Zion]

What should I believe, the left or the right hand? You are telling me that your views on the Bible are right where other's Christian's wrong, so you are not aligned with the body of Christ.

There is wheat and tares, all within the same kingdom: "Christianity".. but the tares are of the seed of the enemy so are therefore not representing the same religion that Jesus and the bible writers bring. There can be no other foundation than the name of Jesus though, and that is why He said John 10:10.

Definitely, I do not call the tares my brothers and sisters and The Holy Spirit tells me that they aren't His, though the forum rules warn that I must not identify them and say they aren't Christian.

Do you understand how you can discern the wheat from the tares?

 

[AntiCrash]

There is wheat and tares, all within the same kingdom: "Christianity".. but the tares are of the seed of the enemy so are therefore not representing the same religion that Jesus and the bible writers bring. There can be no other foundation than the name of Jesus though, and that is why He said John 10:10.

Definitely, I do not call the tares my brothers and sisters and The Holy Spirit tells me that they aren't His, though the forum rules warn that I must not identify them and say they aren't Christian.

Do you understand how you can discern the wheat from the tares?

I do, but I don't live by biblical narrative anymore. I am better working without a net, besides the Bible is one form of wisdom. There are many ways to tackle an issue, and there are times that kind of wisdom fails to meet the issues I have this day and age.

 

[AntiCrash]

I was where you are, and I did undergo a drastic change in how I approached my Father, and understanding how He works. I also had to think for myself, and stop letting other humans tell me how to spiritually live: blind leading blind and such. Our Father gave us a Comforter to convict us and give us hope, He has given us a massive grace period to get our stuff together, He allowed His Son to take on our deserved punishment for breaking His Universal Law, and He is always with us through our trials.

I eventually had to fundamentally change my thinking. You seem new, so you don't know my testimony, but to keep it short I was on top of my intellectual world - I was at what I thought was the peak of my education after finishing my thesis, and I felt even more like my own god because my education was mathematics. I was egotistical and haughty. And, I didn't actually come to Him until after all of that. Now, instead of me using math to demean other people though cleverly veiled intellectual insults and categorization, I was able to fundamentally understand Him through mathematics. To me, this is a big deal, because I did not entertain this dimension of knowledge.

That was the problem; my mind was narrow, despite the intellect I [thought I] had.


My Father stayed with me throughout it - even though I shook my fist at Him for decades, and I was so angry with Him I considered some pretty nefarious things. It was my knowledge that I thought came from my own strength that had me believing I didn't need Him, but it was that same knowledge that kept me chasing after Him - even if it was to "demand" answers. Eventually, I started coming to Him like a child goes to his Father, and that is when He began to calmly instruct me.


You may not have "quit Him" yet, which is why you are here. I would encourage you to direct everything to Him (respectfully), and if you sincerely want a relationship with Him - if there is a kernel of your spirit that knows who He truly is despite what the world and canons may say - then He will come to you.

But, of course, if you [believe] you are truly done with Him, then you are free to leave Him. Unlike the gods of antiquity, He will not force you to sacrifice yourself, or your children, for example, in order to keep His wrath from you. Hell is a consequence of locations that are not within the residence of the Most High God/Word of God. Some people openly choose hell over the Most High God; that is their choice. Just make sure you know who our Father is before you decide either way. Don't let sensationalism (spiritual rumors, gossip and misunderstandings) destroy an eternal relationship.

Do you remember a time when you needed to believe not, a time you were fine without faith. I've recaptured that time, and it doesn't haunt me or scare me that I just don't know. I don't feel a great gap in my heart anymore, and even when I'm unfilled in some way I don't need to turn to 2000 year old stories to make myself feel better.

 

[Serving Zion]

I do, but I don't live by biblical narrative anymore. I am better working without a net, besides the Bible is one form of wisdom. There are many ways to tackle an issue, and there are times that kind of wisdom fails to meet the issues I have this day and age.

I'd rather say that the bible is the study of that wisdom. But there is God, too, who is more than wisdom itself. I acknowledge that He may find you some other way.

 

[AntiCrash]

I'd rather say that the bible is the study of that wisdom. But there is God, too, who is more than wisdom itself. I acknowledge that He may find you some other way.

If you believed I had the key to your salvation then you would be indebted too me. Thankfully I don't, and the key to our salvation I would think lies in each of us. It's up to us to unlock our own prison door's.

 

[Serving Zion]

If you believed I had the key to your salvation then you would be indebted too me. Thankfully I don't, and the key to our salvation I would think lies in each of us. It's up to us to unlock our own prison door's.

We aren't born imprisoned though! .. that conviction comes later. Therefore the one who caught us and threw us in prison is greater than we are. We need a greater one to grant our freedom - and how does that happen? By speaking the word that gives life. For that reason Jesus came, right? .. and so when we are free, we have the power to speak those words that give life. Those who are imprisoned speak according to their duty (that is deep - pause on it, for not all who are imprisoned are belonging to the jailer - but their ransom awaits them).

It brings John 10 to mind too. Very poetic!

 

[AntiCrash]

We aren't born imprisoned though! .. that conviction comes later. Therefore the one who caught us and threw us in prison is greater than we are. We need a greater one to grant our freedom - and how does that happen? By speaking the word that gives life. For that reason Jesus came, right? .. and so when we are free, we have the power to speak those words that give life. Those who are imprisoned speak according to their duty (that is deep - pause on it, for not all who are imprisoned are belonging to the jailer - but their ransom awaits them).

It brings John 10 to mind too. Very poetic!

No one threw us in prison, we threw ourselves in there by what we think and believe.

 

[Serving Zion]

No one threw us in prison, we threw ourselves in there by what we think and believe.

Exactly! .. and that all came from the world! .. not all words have the power to set our thinking free, and indeed some words have the effect of causing us to err.

For this reason Jesus laid down His life, that we may be free to carry on His work until such time as the war is ended (Daniel 9:26).. and yet, not all who claim to speak in His name are doing His work. That is the problem, and why I have warned about trusting English translations too much (some more than others).

 

[Neogaia777]

No one threw us in prison, we threw ourselves in there by what we think and believe.

So, what do you believe/think...? (for they are also on in the same IMO)...

And, how's that working for you...?

God Bless!

 

[Hieronymus]

If you believed I had the key to your salvation then you would be indebted too me. Thankfully I don't, and the key to our salvation I would think lies in each of us. It's up to us to unlock our own prison door's.

Nah, i mean, IF God exists, He decides who or what He wants to keep or discard.
And since He is the Author of Everything, He is the One who decides what the requirements are.
His Will is Law. Comes with the territory of being the Creator.

BUT, this may be the thing that feels like a yoke about the whole thing:

In the Bible there's a lot of text about the requirements, and they're often hard or even impossible to meet.
So the reader / interpreter may feel he / she can never be good enough but still has to meet the requirements.
It may often be taught that way too.
This is especially heavy on the shoulders when you have been taught that if you don't meet the requirements, you will have to endure eternal conscious torment.
It's a living hell when you believe all that!

So what is the solution?
Jesus meets the requirements on our behalf.
And there's no other way.
For the presence of God is like a consuming fire for everything that's corrupted.
(Consuming, not eternally tormenting !)
This is why God is not present on earth, because everything and everyone would be destroyed.

So, the requirements you read of in the Bible can not be met by any human.
Except for 1.
That's King and High Priest Jesus Christ.

So, there's no yoke really, there's LIBERATION.
The Truth shall set you FREE.
It's the letter of the Law (thou shallt this, thou shallt not that) is the yoke, a heavy burden.
Even though they're good moral laws, they condemn us, because we are corrupt(ed) beings.
But God loved the world so much that He gave his unique Son, so that whosoever believes (trust) in him shall have eternal life and not perish.

So is the belief and trust in Him a commandment or Law?
I think it rather means that if you think you can rely on your own attempts to be purified and eligible for eternal life, you're sadly mistaking.
Not gonna work.

So what does God warn us about?
Pride, for example.
People thinking they can be good enough by themselves and earn their salvation.
Of course false teachers are to blame for this too.
But it's also human nature.
When things are going well enough in life, people often become cocky.
Hypocrisy, for example.
People judging others while they ought to know they're not holy either.
This can take really sick forms, where people project their own corruption on others.

Well, i could go on, but i won't.
Maybe it won't change your mind or view on the matter, but i try to explain some things which i think may be what has turned you off, and put it in a better light.
So i hope you read it with attention.

It shouldn't be a yoke.
Jesus said: My yoke is light.
If it's heavy, it's not Jesus' yoke.

 

[Serving Zion]

It shouldn't be a yoke.
Jesus said: My yoke is light.
If it's heavy, it's not Jesus' yoke.

Very inspiring post! .. I am inspired to add Galatians 6:8 as food for thought, to OP at this time, to consider what is spirit compared to flesh in context of a yoke - a 'way of doing the work we do'..

The flesh is the thing that groans with anguish within us from all the discomfort and pain, it searches for ways to produce words that bring it relief .. whereas St. Paul is saying that when we look to the spirit, we see how our words can be produced to grow a harvest of good when those words have come to fruition.

I just thought it was timely and good to mention these thoughts I have while in the context of sowing words that can grow into freedom.

 

[Kaon]

Do you remember a time when you needed to believe not, a time you were fine without faith. I've recaptured that time, and it doesn't haunt me or scare me that I just don't know. I don't feel a great gap in my heart anymore, and even when I'm unfilled in some way I don't need to turn to 2000 year old stories to make myself feel better.

As I said, that time was before I finished my thesis. I felt free, and despite having Christian friends, I didn't mind silence from my Father because I was going to invest in math/science. I freely threw around feel-good cliches about life (and, truly believed it).

But, feelings lie. And, that feeling of freedom and no-stress is a deceptive placebo affect of replacing the real thing with something as empty and ephemeral as anything this world could offer.

Honestly, you have to decide for yourself if you want to believe your feelings, or if this Most High God is worth it to seek, search and find Him with all of your strength.


Our enemies will not make it easy for us to attain Life when they so freely gave it up because of their own vendetta with the Most High God. Be sure to ascertain whether you just need space, or if you really want to "quit him".

 

[AntiCrash]

As I said, that time was before I finished my thesis. I felt free, and despite having Christian friends, I didn't mind silence from my Father because I was going to invest in math/science. I freely threw around feel-good cliches about life (and, truly believed it).

But, feelings lie. And, that feeling of freedom and no-stress is a deceptive placebo affect of replacing the real thing with something as empty and ephemeral as anything this world could offer.

Honestly, you have to decide for yourself if you want to believe your feelings, or if this Most High God is worth it to seek, search and find Him with all of your strength.


Our enemies will not make it easy for us to attain Life when they so freely gave it up because of their own vendetta with the Most High God. Be sure to ascertain whether you just need space, or if you really want to "quit him".

It's pretty obvious that anyone outside the believer's faith is their enemy, even other Christians who don't follow your belief's are an enemy.

 

[Hieronymus]

It's pretty obvious that anyone outside the believer's faith is their enemy, even other Christians who don't follow your belief's are an enemy.

Do only Christians do this, or is it human nature?
Is it Christ's teaching to love or to hate your fellow humans?