Transparency
- Thread starter Treeplanter
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- Aug 11, 2017
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Everyone dies and it’s seldom ever pleasant. Your speaking from a ignorance of what Heaven is like compared to life in this hell hole of a world. I would gladly suffer 4 minutes of pain in return for eternity in paradise.
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- Jun 9, 2021
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What of your position have I left out?
What of your position have I quoted out of context?
How have I lied?
You level these charges against me, but you refuse to back them up...
Show me where I have done these things and I will retract them and offer you an apology!
If you're not willing to type it out then at least provide a post number
Convert?
No!
I am here to de-convert Christians because I belief that Christianity is a harmful belief system
This is not harassment, pastor, this is a discussion board
One that you choose, of your own free will, to partake in
If you wish to be left alone - then stop posting!
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- Jun 9, 2021
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You're missing the point
God has a choice
He can inflict harm upon you prior to giving you paradise
or
He can refrain from inflicting harm upon you prior to giving you paradise
When He chooses to inflict harm prior to paradise then the harm is, by definition, needless because God didn't need to inflict the harm - God could just as easily have given us paradise without 1st inflicting harm
To consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm is immoral
I, too, would gladly endure minutes of pain in exchange for an eternity of paradise {were it that I had to}
However, pain is NOT a prerequisite for paradise
God can give you paradise WITHOUT causing you needless harm
I would suggest that it is you who is speaking from ignorance when you refer to our world as a "hell hole"
This is precisely why Christianity is such a detrimental belief system
It warps it's adherents into such grotesque beliefs as "the world is a wicked place" and "we are wicked beings who deserve to be eternally punished"
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- Aug 11, 2017
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Unless that harm was meant for the greater good by providing a dual incentive encouraging people to repent and believe.
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- Jun 9, 2021
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God can provide for a greater good AND provide an incentive for repentance and belief WITHOUT causing harm in the process!
God doesn't have to use harm to achieve a greater good
God can achieve any end He wants by whatever means He wants
God is God
God can do anything He wants {provided it is within His nature to do so}
For ex:
It's silly to think, much less argue, that God HAD TO drown babies in the Flood in order to save and resurrect them to a better world
He could have done so WITHOUT causing them needless harm
Instead, He consciously and purposefully chose to inflict the needless harm of drowning upon them
And, again, to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm is immoral
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topher694
Go Turtle!
- Jan 29, 2019
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I said nothing is more important to me than God in post 126. You keep ignoring that context.
I’ve made it clear several times, several different ways, that Christianity is deeper than simply, “Trust in Jesus”. While that is true there is much more to it than that. So to say all of Christianity can be summarized by that statement IS FALSE. Additionally you have changed the vocabulary of your statements in the middle of the debate from:
“Trust in Jesus”
“Nothing is more important to me than God”
“Nothing is more important than following Jesus”
Those are all different things that I could - and have - spent hours preaching and teaching on.. Just because you think they are the same doesn’t make it so. Yet, you continually just dismiss that and keep beating the same drum again. My answers were entirely in the context of 1) those three things being different and 2) that Christianity is deeper than just one simple statement (and mostly focusing on the first version of what you said). Your re-quoting me has NOT been in the proper context of my words... because you have belittled them or ignored them... that makes your statements about me dishonest (lies). You may not agree with what I’m saying, but ignoring the substance of what I’m saying twisting surface of what I'm saying and attacking me via my congregation is harassment.
You never once asked for clarity on the substance of what I was saying. Like WHY those things are different, you just said, "nope, their not. I know more than you". You never asked anything about WHAT some of those other deeper more important things are... you just said, "no, I'm right".
If you don’t want to listen, fine, but this is now just coming across as a vendetta. If you stop your dishonest posts about me I'll stop replying.
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And I made mention of your assertion that nothing is more important to you than is God in my very next post to you!
Post#128
My words
"If nothing is more important to you than God then why did you say that I am wrong when I asserted that "there is NOTHING MORE IMPORTANT to a Christian than following Christ"?"
Did you somehow miss this post?
How can you possibly claim that I have ignored this?
You have asserted several times that Christianity is deeper than "trust in Jesus", but you have hardly made it clear that this is so!
Disagree
In fact, I can sufficiently summarize Christianity in a single word...Jesus
Why are you so upset with summarization?
Do you feel somehow threatened in that the removal of complexity / over-complication from Christianity might render your services as a pastor obsolete?
And I am not intending to "belittle" you - I am asking an honest question...
Disagree
Trusting in Jesus
Loving Jesus
Following Jesus
These are all the same things
It's all about giving your life to Jesus and there IS, according to Christianity, scripture, and Jesus Christ, Himself, NOTHING MORE IMPORTANT!
Just because you don't think they are the same doesn't make it so
I said:
"Sure, there is more to the existence of a Christian than just following Christ, but there is NOTHING MORE IMPORTANT to a Christian than following Christ - am I wrong?"
You answered:
"Yes, you are wrong"
How, exactly, within the context of
“Trust in Jesus”
being different from
“Nothing is more important to me than God”
being different from
“Nothing is more important than following Jesus”
does a denial of "following Christ as the MOST IMPORTANT THING to a Christian" make sense?
In other words, even if you are correct and these are three separate things - how does this justify your claim that following Christ is NOT the MOST IMPORTANT THING??
Likewise, even if you are correct and Christianity is more than "one simple statement" - how does this support your assertion that following Christ is NOT the MOST IMPORTANT THING to a Christian??
Untrue
My quoting of you was/is in context
I said:
"Sure, there is more to the existence of a Christian than just following Christ, but there is NOTHING MORE IMPORTANT to a Christian than following Christ - am I wrong?"
and you answered:
"Yes, you are wrong"
This is cut and dried, man!
Where have I belittled you?
Disagreeing with you is NOT belittling you!
100% inaccurate!
I defy you to identify one single lie that I have told about you!
Attacking you "via your congregation"?
What does this even mean?
Oh, you mean like when you asked me all those times for clarification as to how and why all these things are the same?
Oh, that's right...you never did that!
Instead, you just said:
"Yep, they are - I know more than you"
Seems you, too, just fell back upon:
"No, I'm right"
Seriously, dude, get a grip!
This is a discussion, not a vendetta!
You're free to stop communicating with me at any time
Personally, I hope that you choose to continue because I am enjoying our conversation - despite your dishonest allegations that I am being dishonest...
Last edited:
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No, pastor, to anyone and everyone in possession of a modicum of reading comprehension
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It's all right here, pastor - all for the reading
Your mocking posts
Your aspersions upon my character
Your name calling
Your false allegations
Your refusals to back up your allegations
Your logical inconsistencies
Etc
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I've too much pride to let you have the last word
How bout you, pastor?
Is it pride that has driven you to make your last 5 insignificant posts?
Might be more productive and becoming of a man of the cloth to address my post #168 as opposed to engaging in such silly antics, don't you think?
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I have my moments...
I do hope, though, that you will address post #168 and we can continue having an actual discussion of substance
This tit for tat, back and forth inanity ain't cuttin' it!
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