today's slavery vs slavery of the 1800s

[dogs4thewin]

No but, yes is a complete sentence.



Makes all kinds of sense.


Incorrect, anyone who took part in enslaving others were bad and behaved in an evil way.

What sense would it make for people to beat their animals that worked for them none as they could not work effectively in poor shape; there what sense would it make for an employer to beat an employee ( whether slave or not because they cannot work well if they are unfit to work. This would be why the idea that slave owners beat and did not care for their slaves makes no sense as they cannot work for you whether paid or not if they are unfit to work.

 

[Estrid]

What sense would it make for people to beat their animals that worked for them none as they could not work effectively in poor shape; there what sense would it make for an employer to beat an employee ( whether slave or not because they cannot work well if they are unfit to work. This would be why the idea that slave owners beat and did not care for their slaves makes no sense as they cannot work for you whether paid or not if they are unfit to work.

People are different. They rebel.

Many times and places people are / have been
worked to death. Trafficked gitls are not kept in
good health as the service 40 men a day.

Elsewhere men are starved, beaten, and overworked
and kept unable to resist.

Some slaves have been treatrc well- for a slave.

 

[WolfGate]

What sense would it make for people to beat their animals that worked for them none as they could not work effectively in poor shape; there what sense would it make for an employer to beat an employee ( whether slave or not because they cannot work well if they are unfit to work. This would be why the idea that slave owners beat and did not care for their slaves makes no sense as they cannot work for you whether paid or not if they are unfit to work.

The entire system was built upon brutality. It had to be. The 1860 census indicates there were 395,000 slave owners and 3.9 million slaves. With that ratio, slaves could easily have outmanned their owners. The system set up to prevent communication, prevent literacy, and make the consequences of any non-compliance or aggression so severe that slaves would not be willing to risk revolt. Physical beatings, family separation and other tactics were used for minor offenses to drive that point home. Even owners who were generally kind to their slaves benefited from that widespread abuse. To be blunt, the lost productivity was deemed acceptable to avoid a greater disruption to the system

 

[durangodawood]

What sense would it make for people to beat their animals that worked for them none as they could not work effectively in poor shape; there what sense would it make for an employer to beat an employee ( whether slave or not because they cannot work well if they are unfit to work. This would be why the idea that slave owners beat and did not care for their slaves makes no sense as they cannot work for you whether paid or not if they are unfit to work.

There are ways to inflict severe pain and punishment that dont incapacitate a person for too long.

And a few examples probably kept everyone in line, especially knowing that if you tried to leave, the apparatus of the state would be engaged against you with probably an even worse fate awaiting.

This brings up one of the worst aspects of US slavery: it was legal, recognized and protected by the state.

 

[comana]

What sense would it make for people to beat their animals that worked for them none as they could not work effectively in poor shape; there what sense would it make for an employer to beat an employee ( whether slave or not because they cannot work well if they are unfit to work. This would be why the idea that slave owners beat and did not care for their slaves makes no sense as they cannot work for you whether paid or not if they are unfit to work.

Even if every single slave was was well cared for and none were abused, the institution of US slavery would still be abhorrent and evil.

 

[ralliann]

Even if every single slave was was well cared for and none were abused, the institution of US slavery would still be abhorrent and evil.

All slavery is cruelty. It is going on today. People including children being trafficked all over the globe., including the U.S. of course.

 

[durangodawood]

All slavery is cruelty.....

Yes it is. The great shame for the USA however was that we legalized it and legitimized it, and even fought a war to preserve it.

As for individuals who owned slaves, I cant look into the hearts of each one and say who was evil and who was just along for the ride of the times. But all were engaged in an atrocity, for sure.

 

[durangodawood]

....slavery was in fact likely God's plan to get black people here......

When you think of the conditions on a slave ship, as reported, its really hard to think of that as Gods plan without imagining an evil God.

....Not to mention so many other aspects of slavery including even the corroding effect on enslavers souls, etc. Its just too deep a rabbit hole, justifying evil because it must be "Gods plan".

 

[ralliann]

Yes it is. The great shame for the USA however was that we legalized it and legitimized it, and even fought a war to preserve it.

As for individuals who owned slaves, I cant look into the hearts of each one and say who was evil and who was just along for the ride of the times. But all were engaged in an atrocity, for sure.

All those who enslaved peoples legalized it. We fought a war to end it. Hopefully we can do our best to eliminate it now.

 

[A servant of the Kings]

If people have so much issues with the slaves of yesyear and the way they were treated ( not saying that slavery was right, but clearly there were many of slaves that were provided for and even chose to stay with their masters once freed.

This being the case why is it that today's slaves (in a sense in a much worse spot because they are often not provided for and there is more slaves now than there has EVER been number two ( along with the fact that there are more of them which tells me in ad of itself that either people do not care or for slavery to be illegal they are AWFUL are enforcing it ( in terms of the owners) The real kicker though is depending on where you are today's slaves actually have to prove that they are slaves so that THEY will not face legal charges ( that depends on location and the age of the person, but still for people to say that slavery is SO wrong ( not saying it is not but for people to assert that it is so wrong and is illegal they surely have done a VERY poor job of ridding the world of it.

In short why do people have such a problem with the slavery of yesterday and yet there are more slaves now than ever and some of the laws actually STILL favor the owners why does it seem to matter what "kind" of slaves they were sex slaves as opposed to working slaves.

In fact, the human "black market" that is the slave market ( trafficing humans is I believe the largest black market in the world. For people to be so up in arms about the slavery of 100s of years ago it sure seems like the only thing that has really changed is what the slaves are expected to do and if anything they are treated worse now ( on the whole than they were then what gives?

I think you ask very good questions, since the "owner " has so much power over the slave, the owners character seem all important. And also the owners generosity.

Many people live as though they were slaves, the bonds are in their heads. Often they are as you say paid less than the slaves of old times, not even enough to buy good food. Then most "slave owners" seems to have been careful to allow the slaves to eat enough to be strong and healthy, so they could work hard for a long time.

Slavery is also very prevalent in Africa, and some muslim countries outside Africa. the arabs traded/took people from africa for about a thousand years, and sold them into slavery. There is also very cruel slavery in east asia, people locked in factories, but I guess the us has those also, attached to prisons. They would be like traditional working slaves. There were sexslaves also in ancient times, like in Rome, and among the muslims, who would often take european women as sex slaves.

It seems some modern people seem to oppose slavery when europeans were slave owners, (if he is not a woke billionaire of today owning such slave factories in asia for example), but they seem totally ok with all kinds of slavery as long as the "owners" are not european or descendants of europeans, for such people hate of europeans seem to be most important

Slavery on earth is an extremely vivid manifestation of the slavery of sin, of the heathens, born again Christian would not want to own slaves.

May Gods Love conquer their hearts, when humanity is free of bondage, we are in heaven.

 

[Estrid]

I think you ask very good questions, since the "owner " has so much power over the slave, the owners character seem all important. And also the owners generosity.

Many people live as though they were slaves, the bonds are in their heads. Often they are as you say paid less than the slaves of old times, not even enough to buy good food. Then most "slave owners" seems to have been careful to allow the slaves to eat enough to be strong and healthy, so they could work hard for a long time.

Slavery is also very prevalent in Africa, and some muslim countries outside Africa. the arabs traded/took people from africa for about a thousand years, and sold them into slavery. There is also very cruel slavery in east asia, people locked in factories, but I guess the us has those also, attached to prisons. They would be like traditional working slaves. There were sexslaves also in ancient times, like in Rome, and among the muslims, who would often take european women as sex slaves.

It seems some modern people seem to oppose slavery when europeans were slave owners, (if he is not a woke billionaire of today owning such slave factories in asia for example), but they seem totally ok with all kinds of slavery as long as the "owners" are not european or descendants of europeans, for such people hate of europeans seem to be most important

Slavery on earth is an extremely vivid manifestation of the slavery of sin, of the heathens, born again Christian would not want to own slaves.

May Gods Love conquer their hearts, when humanity is free of bondage, we are in heaven.

Um, I am a "heathen" who is in no way enslaved.
Not would i treat another so.

Nor am I anyone's servant.

You sure you dont have this backwards?

 

[Hans Blaster]

Many people live as though they were slaves, the bonds are in their heads. Often they are as you say paid less than the slaves of old times, not even enough to buy good food. Then most "slave owners" seems to have been careful to allow the slaves to eat enough to be strong and healthy, so they could work hard for a long time.

Slavery is also very prevalent in Africa, and some muslim countries outside Africa. the arabs traded/took people from africa for about a thousand years, and sold them into slavery. There is also very cruel slavery in east asia, people locked in factories, but I guess the us has those also, attached to prisons. They would be like traditional working slaves. There were sexslaves also in ancient times, like in Rome, and among the muslims, who would often take european women as sex slaves.

It seems some modern people seem to oppose slavery when europeans were slave owners, (if he is not a woke billionaire of today owning such slave factories in asia for example), but they seem totally ok with all kinds of slavery as long as the "owners" are not european or descendants of europeans, for such people hate of europeans seem to be most important

Be careful newcomer to the board and thread that you do not provide apologetics for past slave holding practices through minimization of the past or over exaggeration of the present. (What the other poster has fallen prey to.)

 

[rturner76]

If people have so much issues with the slaves of yesyear and the way they were treated ( not saying that slavery was right, but clearly there were many of slaves that were provided for and even chose to stay with their masters once freed.

This being the case why is it that today's slaves (in a sense in a much worse spot because they are often not provided for and there is more slaves now than there has EVER been number two ( along with the fact that there are more of them which tells me in ad of itself that either people do not care or for slavery to be illegal they are AWFUL are enforcing it ( in terms of the owners) The real kicker though is depending on where you are today's slaves actually have to prove that they are slaves so that THEY will not face legal charges ( that depends on location and the age of the person, but still for people to say that slavery is SO wrong ( not saying it is not but for people to assert that it is so wrong and is illegal they surely have done a VERY poor job of ridding the world of it.

In short why do people have such a problem with the slavery of yesterday and yet there are more slaves now than ever and some of the laws actually STILL favor the owners why does it seem to matter what "kind" of slaves they were sex slaves as opposed to working slaves.

In fact, the human "black market" that is the slave market ( trafficing humans is I believe the largest black market in the world. For people to be so up in arms about the slavery of 100s of years ago it sure seems like the only thing that has really changed is what the slaves are expected to do and if anything they are treated worse now ( on the whole than they were then what gives?

I think that the main difference between slavery now and in the 1800s is that during that time, slavery was legal and considered fair trade commodities for slavers. They were allowed to whip, beat, and tar and feather any slave they wanted to "break" The difference is now people (mostly Eastern European women and Southeast Asian women including many Africans and Middle Eastern women) are duped into thinking that they are being exported for a valid job opportunity and then are forced to be sex slaves. None of it is legal like it was in the 1800s but the system is just as vicious as it was when Europeans would tackle and shackle Africans and ship them to North and South America in horrific conditions where they had to sleep in their feces and urine for months before they were taken off the boat and "broken" by their masters by whipping and beating them.

I have no idea why you would accept the treatment of the Africans in the slave trade or try to excuse it because now white slavery is prevalent in the sex trade but you sound like either a fool or a staunch racist. Which one are you?

 

[A servant of the Kings]

Um, I am a "heathen" who is in no way enslaved.
Not would i treat another so.

Nor am I anyone's servant.

You sure you dont have this backwards?

Huh What are you doing here on Christian forums, I thought you were not allowed, I am sorry if I was blunt, but it is my experience, I was a heathen, or what I left behind was a heathen.

But after that baptism Jesus led me to clean my soul, and clen my spirit, so that all was like transparent. There inside is the light of God, God is Love, God is light, and when we see with the eye that can see the light, then we can know the greatest explosions of Love that will obliterate all else.

That is why Jesus says the greatest and the first commandment is to Love God with all our heart soul and mind, when we do all we want is there.

So it is why I serve the Lord, He is better, He know how to love better, He treats ladies better, He is magnificent and beautiful beyond compare, and all I ever wanted, so to serve Him is like a dream, even if people abuse me sometimes for it.

When we have not cleaned/ repented, and do not know the light of God within, then all we see is flesh.

Young women will think they are flesh, and men will see them as flesh. But Love is inside, that love is light, that light is the life of all mankind as it is written, when it leaves a body of flesh it falls down dead. so it is why flesh is death, and the light of God is life.

So now I am serving life and not death, you see what I mean?

 

[rturner76]

It seems some modern people seem to oppose slavery when europeans were slave owners, (if he is not a woke billionaire of today owning such slave factories in asia for example), but they seem totally ok with all kinds of slavery as long as the "owners" are not european or descendants of europeans, for such people hate of europeans seem to be most important

It might have something to do with how African slaves were beaten, whipped, and even burned alive and hanged for disobedience. Why would you excuse that behavior?

 

[A servant of the Kings]

Be careful newcomer to the board and thread that you do not provide apologetics for past slave holding practices through minimization of the past or over exaggeration of the present. (What the other poster has fallen prey to.)

Yes thank you I did not mean to sound that way, to me all kinds of slavery is bad, and it is even worse when slaves are badly abused, starved, and mistreated, here in the country I live it has been banned for about 700 years. But many still live for labour, and labour to live, many are in massive debt, and subjected to propaganda and brainwashing massive lies, and mental abuse that way. But still there is some freedom, some spare time. So there has definatly been worse conditions for some during some periods of histry

 

[rturner76]

You sure you dont have this backwards?

I'm sure he does. I've bumped heads with you before but you are spot on here on this topic.

 

[A servant of the Kings]

It might have something to do with how African slaves were beaten, whipped, and even burned alive and hanged for disobedience. Why would you excuse that behavior?

I have not excused it at all, no I added to it by writing arabs took african peoples as slaves for about a thousand years and sold them as slaves, the men used to be castrated, and when the women gave birth they would often kill the babies, that is why there are no, or very few african looking arabs, even though an enormous amount of slaves were taken there

But there are also written down examples of people becoming friends with "their slaves", giving them a higher position in society, lots of money, and freedom, if you want I can tell you more about it.

Unfortunately that is rare and most slaves have been and are badly abused, in a way that would make most people crushed and miserable

 

[Hans Blaster]

Yes thank you I did not mean to sound that way, to me all kinds of slavery is bad, and it is even worse when slaves are badly abused, starved, and mistreated, here in the country I live it has been banned for about 700 years. But many still live for labour, and labour to live, many are in massive debt, and subjected to propaganda and brainwashing massive lies, and mental abuse that way. But still there is some freedom, some spare time. So there has definatly been worse conditions for some during some periods of histry

But these aren't slavery. The OP was made because the poster tried to minimize the nature of slavery in the US South for personal (familial) reasons and some how made themselves look worse.

 

[A servant of the Kings]

But these aren't slavery. The OP was made because the poster tried to minimize the nature of slavery in the US South for personal (familial) reasons and some how made themselves look worse.

Well the first people that were taken slaves to the us by the British were mostly Irish I believe, those were desperately financially poor people who sold them selves into slavery, they would get their boat ticket paid for 20 years of labour or something like that, I believe it was mostly in the 16 hundreds. But almost non of them would survive for 20 years.

The history of the world is often complicated, sometimes one people abused the other in a horrible way, hundred years later it may be reversed.

How ever I do not mean to minimize any suffering. But there has been many slaves, in all parts of the world for many thousands of years, the us is a baby, only existed a little while. Those slaves, in other parts of the world, their suffering should also not be minimized right?

And in order to not get too negative about human nature, more than is warranted, I think it is great that some "slave owners" actually treated "their slaves" good enough for them to become friends and free them. Those are the rare sunny exeptions, I do not see anything wrng with mentioning that, like the thread starter seemed to do.

But I think those cases were rare exceptions, I believe it was quite common though to give slaves food enough so that they could remain strong and work hard, but unfortunately it was probably not because of the kindness of their hearts, but because it would be more financially rewarding that way