This Means WAR: The ObamaCare Betrayal By Senators Capito And Murkowski Can Never Be Forgotten

[mark46]

If they voted for what they believed was for the good of their state then they were doing their job.

We have a different idea of the role of US Senator. IMHO, a US Senator does not take polls overtime an issue comes up so that he can be sure that he is representing his or consistency.

Of course, when the numbers are as bad as they are for this bill, it is a bit different. let's see if McConnell votes no because his constituency doesn't like the bill.

 

[PeachyKeane]

Read the sequence of posts and quotes, and the confusion should be cleared up for you.

They did not?

You said that the Republicans talked to these groups, right? Did they not take their advice and expert opinions seriously?

 

[wing2000]

QFT...

When push comes to absolute shove... It is a little comforting to know that there are some Senators that aren't blind and can see the harm the bill would have caused.

They put country ahead of party and deserve praise and respect.

 

[mark46]

The Republicans tactics on this have been pretty abysmal, and you are right the processes are not comparable at all.

The Republicans crafted all their bills in secret without even involving everyone in their whole party and have yet to find anything that they can all unite behind nor have they been able to strong arm the people they haven't involved in the process.

When they bring it up to a vote the people who were never on board are still not. Which should not be surprising to anyone.

I honestly can't tell if the issue is the lack of imagination, ability or will to craft a better bill and get everyone they need to involved.

Or, perhaps it is just laziness. The idea that they will be perpetually rewarded without doing any real work on an issue. I wonder why the senators feel so entitled to easy wins...

Probably because republicans will vote for a crumpled up sweat sock as long as it has an R after it's name.

Ryan and McConnell did what they did because they thought that this strategy would give the bill the best chance of passing.
=====
The reality is that Americans like all the goodies they have gotten out of Obamacare. They don't like the ever increasing premiums, lack of choice and the individual mandate.

Trump promised everything: no cuts in Medicaid, Medicare and Social Security, AND lower premiums in the short run, AND lower deductibles, AND better choices AND much better medical care. And he promised the party that it would be easy.

Why should anyone be surprised when reducing federal spending on healthcare by $1TRILLION dollars wouldn't be popular?

 

[mark46]

All four should be blamed, but there are a few more that would likely have voted no if these two did. Of course, no one wants to be the third to announce.

BTW, I guess there wasn't enough pork for Alaska. McDonnell certainly tried.
Health care bill has money for Alaska, home of a GOP holdout

This Means WAR: The ObamaCare Betrayal By Senators Capito And Murkowski Can Never Be Forgotten

They voted in favor of the (partial) repeal in 2015 — and yet they claim they cannot vote for the same bill today, in 2017.
...
So what is the difference between 2015 and 2017? ... The difference is that today, in 2017, we have a president who would sign that repeal bill into law. In 2015, we did not.

Senators Capito and Murkowski knew this. They lied to their voters, straight up.
...
I think the GOP establishment is hoping that you will forget about their treachery in the intervening four to six years.

I, for one, am not going to forget. I will never forget.

I hereby pledge to donate money to the strongest conservative challenger willing to primary either of these senators on the basis of their refusal to vote to repeal Obamacare. I don’t care if I have to wait until 2020 or 2022, I am doing it. And I will vocally support that person against these Senators, and do everything I can to see that these women are unseated.​

 

[wing2000]

So what is the difference between 2015 and 2017? ...

Medicaid cuts.

 

[Hank77]

We have a different idea of the role of US Senator. IMHO, a US Senator does not take polls overtime an issue comes up so that he can be sure that he is representing his or consistency.

I never said anything about taking polls.
I said that they need to meet with people across their state. They need to listen to people across their state. They can even listen to what people are telling their Representatives from the different districts, not to them directly.
They should always be voting with their view of what is good first for the people of their state. Their own state should come first.

 

[Albion]

This is what some conservatives believe. We'll see in 2018.

I am convinced of it. But it's really a compliment given to the Democrats to acknowledge that they're able to do that, time and again. Even when the cold, hard facts should give the GOP the stronger argument, the Dems will almost always create a counter-scenario and sell it to the public. For anyone who is talking now that this health care fiasco will leave the Democrats owning Obamacare when it collapses, they'll find out soon enough the reason is allegedly going to be that it would have worked out well except that the Republicans instilled uncertainty into the insurance markets, preventing necessary planning and making costs rise higher than would have been the case if the system had been allowed just to run as planned.

Perhaps, the Republicans will be able to convince their base that they failed in meeting their goals, even with a Republican president, a Republican House and a Republican Senate.

I seriously doubt it.

 

[FreeinChrist]

Susan Collins may have been influenced by her own constituents who disliked the bill.
And by things like this:

Beyond that meanness, Maine’s economy would take a big hit. An analysis by the Maine Center on Economic Policy found that Trumpcare would cause 10,000 jobs to be lost, in part because rural hospitals would be under great strain and some would close.
​

People in rural areas get upset at the thought of losing their local hospitals and the jobs that go with them.
She is representing her constituents.

And consider why the others may have planned to vote no:

Stunning polls show Sanders soaring while 'TrumpCare' crashes

Meanwhile, a shocking new poll from Quinnipiac University found American voters opposing the pending Republican healthcare bill by a three to one margin. Fifty-six percent of voters disapprove of TrumpCare (or "RyanCare," or whatever name is attached to the disastrous GOP bill), while only 17 percent support it.
​

Take away people's healthcare and ....that will be war from my point of view.

Simply put, TrumpCare's unpopularity creates a grave danger of disaster for Republicans in 2018 and 2020.​

 

[TLK Valentine]

The arrogance of Republican leaders and their willingness to work against their base has been noteworthy in recent years.

And who is their base?

 

[TLK Valentine]

This Means WAR: The ObamaCare Betrayal By Senators Capito And Murkowski Can Never Be Forgotten

They voted in favor of the (partial) repeal in 2015 — and yet they claim they cannot vote for the same bill today, in 2017.
...
So what is the difference between 2015 and 2017? ... The difference is that today, in 2017, we have a president who would sign that repeal bill into law. In 2015, we did not.

Senators Capito and Murkowski knew this. They lied to their voters, straight up.
...
I think the GOP establishment is hoping that you will forget about their treachery in the intervening four to six years.

I, for one, am not going to forget. I will never forget.

I hereby pledge to donate money to the strongest conservative challenger willing to primary either of these senators on the basis of their refusal to vote to repeal Obamacare. I don’t care if I have to wait until 2020 or 2022, I am doing it. And I will vocally support that person against these Senators, and do everything I can to see that these women are unseated.​

When the GOP runs out of enemies, they'll inevitably turn on each other.

 

[bhsmte]

I am shocked -- shocked -- to find that senators sometimes vote for symbolic or PR purposes.

Yep. Normal operating procedure in washington.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Senators Capito and Murkowski knew this. They lied to their voters, straight up.
​

It's no different from the lip-service the GOP pays to conservative religious values, and people keep gobbling that up year after year.

 

[morningstar2651]

So what is the difference between 2015 and 2017? ... The difference is that today, in 2017, we have a president who would sign that repeal bill into law. In 2015, we did not.

Senators Capito and Murkowski knew this. They lied to their voters, straight up.

Yeah. This shouldn't be surprising.

Seven years, and once the Republican party is in a position to repeal and replace Obamacare it turns out that they can't get their own party to follow through on the promises they constantly used to get elected.

It's easy to promise something impossible and pretend to make progress toward that promise (see also: "People won't say happy holidays anymore", "I will overturn Roe v. Wade if you elect me", "We're going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it"), but when the party is actually in a position to deliver on that promise, they lose the tool they used to manipulate their supporters into giving them power.

 

[morningstar2651]

I am shocked -- shocked -- to find that senators sometimes vote for symbolic or PR purposes.

Part of the problem of our current election system is that it rewards PR and marketing far better than it rewards job performance.

 

[super animator]

Part of the problem of our current election system is that it rewards PR and marketing far better than it rewards job performance.

That's because we couldn't fire them for poor performance until election day.

 

[TLK Valentine]

When push comes to absolute shove... It is a little comforting to know that there are some Senators that aren't blind and can see the harm the bill would have caused.

They put country ahead of party and deserve praise and respect.

Not from Trump, they don't. Anytime anyone puts anything over loyalty to Donald, it's a betrayal.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

They voted in favor of the (partial) repeal in 2015 — and yet they claim they cannot vote for the same bill today, in 2017.
...
So what is the difference between 2015 and 2017? ... The difference is that today, in 2017, we have a president who would sign that repeal bill into law. In 2015, we did not.

That's not the only difference...

A few of the details are different, and the implications are different as well.

In the 2015 vote, it was mainly about returning it to the status quo that existed pre-ObamaCare. (Removing the mandates, Cadillac tax, etc...).

This present-day vote does those same things, but does some additional things as well: Weakens Medicaid by replacing much of it with Block Grants (which are just thinly veiled budget cuts), weakens insurance regulations (and hands the insurance companies a $70 billion check), ties subsidy amounts to the price of the least comprehensive plans, and greatly cuts federal funding for certain aspects of womens' health.

So while there is some overlap, voting for the 2015 repeal, but not the 2017 doesn't make them hypocrites.

The 2017 version isn't just a repeal...it's putting in place a different system that has some very problematic aspects attached to it. If it were just as simple as a "let's put things back the way they were before Obama", I suspect the bill would've been signed already.

 

[rambot]

I am shocked -- shocked -- to find that senators sometimes vote for symbolic or PR purposes.

What surprises me is that perhaps they are doing this because they think that the new bill is not a benefit for the majority of the people they represent and they are willing to go against their party. Honestly, that RARELY happens with democrats but I don't know if I've heard about it with republicans...

 

[Uncle Siggy]

Perhaps after being fired by Republican voters they can become the new leaders of the Democrat party.

Kinda makes you wonder how many of them are being paid to vote they way they are by members of the Democrat party???