Think There's No Link Between Darwinism and Nazism?

[ondaball]

Watch This, says John West @ http://.evolutionnews.org

The http://YouTube.com link hasn't printed here - I'll try to find & edit it in later



Those like Arthur Caplan who claim that Nazi ideology did not draw on Darwinism should watch this clip from a 1930s Nazi propaganda film justifying forced sterilization.

Near the beginning of the clip the narrator warns that modern society is transgressing against a fundamental law in preserving the unfit.

Just what law is he talking about? (Hint: You find it mentioned repeatedly in The Origin of Species and The Descent of Man.)

"Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed" features parallel readings of Hitler's notorious Mein Kampf & those 2 ill-advised Darwin books

Darwinism is a mere philosophy that rather clearly misinterprets & stubbornly ignores obvious overwhelming evidence of Intelligent Design reported by hundreds of MSc/PhD scientists, from microbiology to astronomy

True ID science is careful observing/testing all evidence

• 14 minutes ago
• - 3 days left to answer @ Yahoo Answers

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question...5021358AAahZj5


If link doesn't work - @ busy times of day etc - cut URL to 'index'

My name there is WonderWye & it's in Arts & Humanities: Philosophy OK?


Additional Details


You Tube link doesn't come up, so see clip @ http://evolutionnews.org

It openly advocates exterminating sick folk on the grounds of 'crime against natural selection'

Yahoo "Impressive Depressives" to see that many famous writers, artists, musicians, poets & generally creative people, inc Mozart, Bach, Handel, Boticelli, Pepys, Napoleon, Churchill etc, etc were bi-polar, aka manic depressives: the 'genius illness'

So am I: Spike Milligan founded The Manic Depressive Fellowship & wrote "How To Cope With Depression"

I was in Sefton Mental Health Support Group, chosen to present WRAP - Wellness & Recovery Action Plan - to a UK-wide conference of 'inter-disciplinary cross-fertilisation of folk with, or caring for those with it

Research by many leading companies shows that folk disabled in one area make the most of what they can do, with great focus & determination

& that 'able-bodied' folk often take for granted & even carelessly destroy their health, yes?

What say you?

Ian

 

[Eudaimonist]

Those like Arthur Caplan who claim that Nazi ideology did not draw on Darwinism should watch this clip from a 1930s Nazi propaganda film justifying forced sterilization.

Near the beginning of the clip the narrator warns that modern society is transgressing against a fundamental law in preserving the unfit.

Just what law is he talking about?

I don't know. Could you give a good translation of the narrator's exact words?

BTW, do you think there is no link between Christianity and Nazism?

This Nazi soldier buckle reads: "God with us".

Wow, what did I just prove? Anything?



eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Sojourner<><]

Maybe not formally but at that time Darwinism had so permeated the thoughts of intellectuals that I don't think you can separate the two. Even Americans were becoming Social Darwinists.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Maybe not formally but at that time Darwinism had so permeated the thoughts of intellectuals that I don't think you can separate the two. Even Americans were becoming Social Darwinists.

Of course. I have little doubt of that. It's not like evolution was a big secret.

Christianity had permeated many minds as well.

But I think it is worth pointing out that the idea that the "unfit" might be some kind of drain on society, and even on lineage, existed well before Darwin's ideas.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Sojourner<><]

Of course. I have little doubt of that. It's not like evolution was a big secret.

Christianity had permeated many minds as well.

But I think it is worth pointing out that the idea that the "unfit" might be some kind of drain on society, and even on lineage, existed well before Darwin's ideas.


eudaimonia,

Mark

You're probably right about that. Darwinism might have only affirmed and reinforced that kind of thinking.

 

[The Nihilist]

You're probably right about that. Darwinism might have only affirmed and reinforced that kind of thinking.

In the same way that christianity affirmed and reinforced hating the jews?

 

[Sojourner<><]

In the same way that christianity affirmed and reinforced hating the jews?

For some, I would say yes, their private interpretations could have given them partial justification for what they did. But then I think that those interpretations were based on bad logic, placing the judgments of God into the hands of men.

 

[The Nihilist]

For some, I would say yes, their private interpretations could have given them partial justification for what they did. But then I think that those interpretations were based on bad logic, placing the judgments of God into the hands of men.

If that rationalization will work for christianity, it will work for Darwinism

 

[quatona]

Enough to keep you busy for a while

 

[Mling]

Of course Nazi-ism drew from social Darwinism. And (though there is a bit of debate about this), Kurt Gurstein, who assisted in the development of Zyklon-B (cyanide gas) did so as part of a water purification system in the Hygiene department, and only joined the SS to be a spy for God.

And Alfred Nobel didn't want explosives to be used for warfare, and the TV was invented as a teaching aid, not for entertainment.

Let's just stick to Nazi-ism for a bit, though. Sure, they used social darwinism to guide their decisions of *who* to kill.

What about *how* to kill? That's straight from the Industrial Revolution. All sleek, sterile efficiency.

Ideas get corrupted. It happens. It says more about the corrupter than about the original idea.

 

[Sojourner<><]

If that rationalization will work for christianity, it will work for Darwinism

I don't see how. After really thinking through my own faith, I've found plenty of reason to conclude that the holocaust was an evil act. But after thinking through Darwinism, it doesn't really even seem to concern itself with good or evil, and I can definately see how someone could use it to justify their actions.

To be brutally honest, it does seem to follow that our advancements in medicine do actually upset the process of natural selection. It may be saving lives now, but it could also be causing more health problems for the human race in the long run. I just prefer to put a little faith in our ability circumvent those problems through more advancement in technology.

 

[keith99]

C.S. Lewis, a Christian made a comment about Hitler and his master race theories vrs. his practice. It went somethign like.

It seems that aside from some wild nights with storm troopers and frauliens the only thnig Hitler did as far as creating a master race seems more to have been killing off his best people.

Sorry, Lewis said it much better.

 

[Robby]

Pathetic.

 

[JGL53]

I accept the fact of evolution.

I think the obvious fact is that Hitler and the Nazis were murderous scum that had to be stopped.

The idea that there is some connection between the two is ridiculous.

OTOH, the connection between Christianity and, e.g., the Inquisition, the Crusades, decades of gang murder in N. Ireland, and the KKK - that seems rather clear.

Maybe it would be best if Christians didn't play the "connection" game.

Ya think?

 

[Xaoc]

Correlation does not imply causation. The Nazi's used Darwinism, it's true. But they also used the Bible. Countless murderers have claimed "God told me to", or "the Bible says to kill abortion doctors". That doesn't make any of it true. By saying Darwinism is responsible for Nazism, you're saying that Jesus is responsible for millions of deaths, and going a bit farther, that by extension Jodie Foster was "responsible" for the attempt on Ronald Reagan's life. The simple fact is that one's actions rest on their shoulders, no one else's.

 

[variant]

I don't see how. After really thinking through my own faith, I've found plenty of reason to conclude that the holocaust was an evil act. But after thinking through Darwinism, it doesn't really even seem to concern itself with good or evil, and I can definately see how someone could use it to justify their actions.

Biology is not theology. Evolutionary theory makes no prescriptive judgments as to right and wrong it just says what IS.

You can't really argue against the truth because you don't like the consequences of how people use that truth to their own twisted means.

For instance, Atomic theory is not incorrect because people twisted it to make weapons.

To be brutally honest, it does seem to follow that our advancements in medicine do actually upset the process of natural selection. It may be saving lives now, but it could also be causing more health problems for the human race in the long run. I just prefer to put a little faith in our ability circumvent those problems through more advancement in technology.

For your information the eugenics movement was hopelessly flawed even if you accepted its aims.

Hitlers "master race" essentially consisted of lowering the diversity in his population by weeding out people who didn't fit a specific arbitrary mold (which harms genetic populations). This went along with killing the mentally ill, or the enfeebled, rapist and the like. As with most eugenic experiments this does almost nothing to reduce their prevalence in the population.

This is because killing people with genetic problems like downs syndrome doesn’t reduce the cause of downs in the population. The syndrome manifests itself because of a non-disjunction genetic aberration that occurs in the mothers egg cells.

Science has yet to progress to the point where we could predict people’s likelihood of having such problems, so in the 1940's eugenics was junk science.

So, the brutality essentially accomplished nothing.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

I don't see how. After really thinking through my own faith, I've found plenty of reason to conclude that the holocaust was an evil act. But after thinking through Darwinism, it doesn't really even seem to concern itself with good or evil, and I can definately see how someone could use it to justify their actions.

So there you have it--Darwinism doesn't concern itself with good or bad, so it can't be held morally accountable to Nazi crimes. Unless we're going to start denigrating gravity for allowing people to be pushed to their deaths.

 

[Sojourner<><]

So there you have it--Darwinism doesn't concern itself with good or bad, so it can't be held morally accountable to Nazi crimes. Unless we're going to start denigrating gravity for allowing people to be pushed to their deaths.

That would just be silly. But even though Darwinism doesn't concern itself with good or evil, it can erode away at certain ethical systems of thought in a society.

 

[ArnautDaniel]

Watch This, says John West @ http://.evolutionnews.org

The http://YouTube.com link hasn't printed here - I'll try to find & edit it in later



Those like Arthur Caplan who claim that Nazi ideology did not draw on Darwinism should watch this clip from a 1930s Nazi propaganda film justifying forced sterilization.

Near the beginning of the clip the narrator warns that modern society is transgressing against a fundamental law in preserving the unfit.

Just what law is he talking about? (Hint: You find it mentioned repeatedly in The Origin of Species and The Descent of Man.)

"Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed" features parallel readings of Hitler's notorious Mein Kampf & those 2 ill-advised Darwin books

Darwinism is a mere philosophy that rather clearly misinterprets & stubbornly ignores obvious overwhelming evidence of Intelligent Design reported by hundreds of MSc/PhD scientists, from microbiology to astronomy



True ID science is careful observing/testing all evidence

• 14 minutes ago
• - 3 days left to answer @ Yahoo Answers

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question...5021358AAahZj5


If link doesn't work - @ busy times of day etc - cut URL to 'index'

My name there is WonderWye & it's in Arts & Humanities: Philosophy OK?


Additional Details


You Tube link doesn't come up, so see clip @ http://evolutionnews.org

It openly advocates exterminating sick folk on the grounds of 'crime against natural selection'

Yahoo "Impressive Depressives" to see that many famous writers, artists, musicians, poets & generally creative people, inc Mozart, Bach, Handel, Boticelli, Pepys, Napoleon, Churchill etc, etc were bi-polar, aka manic depressives: the 'genius illness'

So am I: Spike Milligan founded The Manic Depressive Fellowship & wrote "How To Cope With Depression"

I was in Sefton Mental Health Support Group, chosen to present WRAP - Wellness & Recovery Action Plan - to a UK-wide conference of 'inter-disciplinary cross-fertilisation of folk with, or caring for those with it

Research by many leading companies shows that folk disabled in one area make the most of what they can do, with great focus & determination

& that 'able-bodied' folk often take for granted & even carelessly destroy their health, yes?

What say you?

Ian

Argumentum ad Hitlerum


Did you know the Nazis liked music? They did, so music is evil.

Did you know the Nazis liked to wear clothes? They did, so clothes are evil.

Did you know the Nazis liked food? They did, so food is evil.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

That would just be silly. But even though Darwinism doesn't concern itself with good or evil, it can erode away at certain ethical systems of thought in a society.

Does that make it bad?