There is no Hell!

[Zecryphon]

What is so wrong with you people that you can't discuss anything with anyone without charges of heresy? You may not like it and you obviously don't but these forums ARE open now.

Use your God given gifts to witness and lead people to truth without condemnation. Is this how you normally witness to unbelievers?

Good grief! :o

"What is so wrong with you people that you can't discuss anything with anyone without charges of heresy?"

I thought you were done with this place. Well now that you're here, let me explain this to you. Christians believe in and worship a trinitarian God. You have posted scripture yourself, John 1:1, that refutes what MichaelTheeArchangel is claiming is true, that Jesus is not one with the Father but is a created being. To Christians that is heresy, and we call it like we see it. What's so wrong with you that you get a bee in your bonnet every time you see the word heresy?

"You may not like it and you obviously don't but these forums ARE open now."

Yep and censorship has no part in an open forum. You want us to obviously censor our speech. You would like it if we stopped using the word heretic. But that's not gonna happen. He is promoting a heretical belief, therefore he is a heretic.

"Use your God given gifts to witness and lead people to truth without condemnation. Is this how you normally witness to unbelievers?"

Depends. I've routinely told people I'm witnessing to, that by their own admission they are a sinner and are going to Hell. I suppose I shouldn't do that either, right? Cuz that's not loving?

"Good grief! "

I agree, it's just a word.

 

[Tavita]

"What is so wrong with you people that you can't discuss anything with anyone without charges of heresy?"

I thought you were done with this place. Well now that you're here, let me explain this to you. Christians believe in and worship a trinitarian God. You have posted scripture yourself, John 1:1, that refutes what MichaelTheeArchangel is claiming is true, that Jesus is not one with the Father but is a created being. To Christians that is heresy, and we call it like we see it. What's so wrong with you that you get a bee in your bonnet every time you see the word heresy?

LOL.. I knew you'd get in on the act.

Yes, I did post to Michael, and I'm trying to use scripture and Hebrew meanings to point out where he's wrong. Did you see me rave on about heresy to him? Instead of yelling 'heresy, heresy!', get into showing where they're wrong, from what you believe is the truth, and do it with some respect.

"You may not like it and you obviously don't but these forums ARE open now."

Yep and censorship has no part in an open forum. You want us to obviously censor our speech. You would like it if we stopped using the word heretic. But that's not gonna happen. He is promoting a heretical belief, therefore he is a heretic.

Exactly why I have the right to say that Michael has the right to say what he wants to say without the heresy hunters doing their war dance. If you have the right to free speech then so does everyone else, that's true.. but not just for you.

"Use your God given gifts to witness and lead people to truth without condemnation. Is this how you normally witness to unbelievers?"

Depends. I've routinely told people I'm witnessing to, that by their own admission they are a sinner and are going to Hell. I suppose I shouldn't do that either, right? Cuz that's not loving?

Exactly.

 

[Zecryphon]

LOL.. I knew you'd get in on the act.

Yes, I did post to Michael, and I'm trying to use scripture and Hebrew meanings to point out where he's wrong. Did you see me rave on about heresy to him? Instead of yelling 'heresy, heresy!', get into showing where they're wrong, from what you believe is the truth, and do it with some respect.
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Exactly why I have the right to say that Michael has the right to say what he wants to say without the heresy hunters doing their war dance. If you have the right to free speech then so does everyone else, that's true.. but not just for you.



Exactly.

"LOL.. I knew you'd get in on the act."

What can I say? I'm shameless. I can never pass up a good Tavita rant! LOL

"Yes, I did post to Michael, and I'm trying to use scripture and Hebrew meanings to point out where he's wrong. Did you see me rave on about heresy to him?"

No, that's not your style. You used scripture and that's fine. But why did you want to correct Michael in the first place if you truly have an open mind about this trinity thing? Shouldn't you have looked into his claims first and then have posted the scripture?

"Instead of yelling 'heresy, heresy!', get into showing where they're wrong, from what you believe is the truth, and do it with some respect."

Yeah let's talk about that. It seems you think Nadiine is the one going around yelling "heresy, heresy" when it seems that she was simply agreeing with another poster who said that Michael was a heretic and surprisingly it wasn't me! LOL So why did you do that? Why did you go after Nadiine for calling someone a heretic when she in fact never did?


Quote:
"You may not like it and you obviously don't but these forums ARE open now."

Yep and censorship has no part in an open forum. You want us to obviously censor our speech. You would like it if we stopped using the word heretic. But that's not gonna happen. He is promoting a heretical belief, therefore he is a heretic.

"Exactly why I have the right to say that Michael has the right to say what he wants to say without the heresy hunters doing their war dance."

Could you paint a more absurd and exaggerated picture of what has happened? No one is doing a war dance. That's a Native American ritual, Christians don't do that. Calling someone a heretic for promoting a heretical belief is not wrong.

"If you have the right to free speech then so does everyone else, that's true.. but not just for you."

Exactly, that's my point. We are free to call him a heretic and he is free to post heretical statements. What is ridiculous is you decrying calling someone a heretic when they clearly are, and rebuking your brothers and sisters in Christ for doing what they are commanded to do. That's what's ridiculous about this whole thing. When did you appoint yourself as the speech police in this forum? If you think the use of the word "heretic" and all it's deriviative forms are such a violation, report us and let the mods handle it.


Quote:
"Use your God given gifts to witness and lead people to truth without condemnation. Is this how you normally witness to unbelievers?"

Depends. I've routinely told people I'm witnessing to, that by their own admission they are a sinner and are going to Hell. I suppose I shouldn't do that either, right? Cuz that's not loving?
"Exactly. "

Law before grace my dear. Without the law, the grace just is not as sweet.

 

[heavensprings]

deleted post.

 

[GuardianShua]

great. A belief (a heretical one) of the jehovah Witnesses is being promoted here.

In Christian history, it was the Pagan Christians who distroyed the Judaeo Christians. Those who were beheaded and burned at the stake, were those who would not keep the Sunday Sabbath and accept Trinitarism. Who changed Gods time and laws? Who uses Gods name title "Holy Father?" Who sits in a temple of God as a god? Who is truly a heretic? Who can on ized the bible?

 

[GuardianShua]

This is a picture of the statue Jupiter giving a Trinitarian sign.


The statue was renamed Peter. http://www.remnantofgod.org/peter-jupiter.jpg I repeat, This Pagan statue of Jupiter was renamed Peter. Jupiter is giving the Trinitarian sign.

 

[Shiversblood]

Exactly, that's my point. We are free to call him a heretic and he is free to post heretical statements. What is ridiculous is you decrying calling someone a heretic when they clearly are, and rebuking your brothers and sisters in Christ for doing what they are commanded to do. That's what's ridiculous about this whole thing.

You say clearly they are a heretic but i'm not so sure that they clearly are.

 

[GuardianShua]

From about 167 BC the Hellenistic Jews were in control of Jerusalem. They were a secret society in control of the people during the life of Jesus.

 

[GuardianShua]

These quotes are from the Encyclopedia Americana,1961 edition.
"Words are frequently changed in an entirely arbitrary way, just for the sake of change, as is the case with taboo, and cant. The purpose is to deform the word in any possible way and render it unrecongnizable."
"Cant ,the secret language of a corporation or class of persons, such as criminals, hoboes, students, soldiers, railroaders, conspirators, and the like." This quote should have also included secret societies.
"Canopus. In Egyptian mythology, a water god, represented on vessels of a spherical shape." That is, the shape of a serpent.
"Cannibalism, Kan/i/bal/ism, a customary, socially approved practice, among certain barbarous peoples, of eating human flesh." "The fact that the older, learned term "anthropophagy" derives from the classic Greek anthropos (man) , and phagein (eat), suggests that from ancient times barbarous peoples were known to eat human flesh, or at least were accused of doing so."

Here is a list of proper names of some snakes.

Apostolepis: nick name, messenger snake.
Acanthophis: Adder's.
Canna, Pseudaspis: Mole snake.
Candidus, Bungarus.
Candoia: #1. Aspera, #2. Bibroni, #3. Carinata.
Caninus, Corallas: Emerald tree boa.
Cantherigerus, Alsophis.
Cantil, Agkistrodon bilineatus.
Canus, Tropidophis.
Cantori, Trimeresurus.
Canum, Gyalopion: Western hook-nosed.
It was the Vati can that can on ized the bible. The word "Vatican" is a compound word, but in what dictionary is that stated? Have you ever given any thought to the term "Social Engineering."

 

[cleverest]

You say clearly they are a heretic but i'm not so sure that they clearly are.

Every person is potentially a heretic to every other person.

"It doesn't even matter to a huge majority of believers though, because they all teach and believe "those people" get burned forever without purpose or respite, without no divine intention of being corrected and justly chastised for their wrongs (according to their works, with few or many stripes, ya know...scripture...) and ultimately as a goal to reconcile with God...and this includes all those deceived by such teachings to follow such heretics...God simply can't set the record straight to those people either, but instead relies SOLELY on imperfect humans to do it...if they aren't able to find and deliver those people by the "foolishness of their preaching"..well, tough luck, God no longer loves them...Let's just pretend to love them to garnish that twinge of pity that justifies are own corrupted half-baked version of "love", and we only have to entertain that feeling until judgment (since Christ bothers to mention all that fluffy stuff we might as well go along with it for awhile at least), then it's like taking out the garbage, we can forget about all those neighbors and "enemies" in heaven. God forbid we even TRY reconcile them with God while they are being judged and not only before they die in the dark blindness and ignorance which is sin....we wouldn't want to get our mighty holy hands dirty and then make our 'God IS love' end up HATING us by wiping the soot from their eyes and showing them the love that Christ showed the unlovable and wretched and ungodly of His generation!! That love is voided for them, can't all those heretics see this?!?! Eeeeewwwwwwww!!"

(BTW that's an example of "speaking as a fool", for those who read into things a wee bit too literal)

 

[Nadiine]

No, that's not your style. You used scripture and that's fine. But why did you want to correct Michael in the first place if you truly have an open mind about this trinity thing? Shouldn't you have looked into his claims first and then have posted the scripture?

"Instead of yelling 'heresy, heresy!', get into showing where they're wrong, from what you believe is the truth, and do it with some respect."

Yeah let's talk about that. It seems you think Nadiine is the one going around yelling "heresy, heresy" when it seems that she was simply agreeing with another poster who said that Michael was a heretic and surprisingly it wasn't me! LOL So why did you do that? Why did you go after Nadiine for calling someone a heretic when she in fact never did?


Quote:
"You may not like it and you obviously don't but these forums ARE open now."

Yep and censorship has no part in an open forum. You want us to obviously censor our speech. You would like it if we stopped using the word heretic. But that's not gonna happen. He is promoting a heretical belief, therefore he is a heretic.

"Exactly why I have the right to say that Michael has the right to say what he wants to say without the heresy hunters doing their war dance."

Could you paint a more absurd and exaggerated picture of what has happened? No one is doing a war dance. That's a Native American ritual, Christians don't do that. Calling someone a heretic for promoting a heretical belief is not wrong.

"If you have the right to free speech then so does everyone else, that's true.. but not just for you."

Exactly, that's my point. We are free to call him a heretic and he is free to post heretical statements. What is ridiculous is you decrying calling someone a heretic when they clearly are, and rebuking your brothers and sisters in Christ for doing what they are commanded to do. That's what's ridiculous about this whole thing. When did you appoint yourself as the speech police in this forum? If you think the use of the word "heretic" and all it's deriviative forms are such a violation, report us and let the mods handle it.


Quote:
"Use your God given gifts to witness and lead people to truth without condemnation. Is this how you normally witness to unbelievers?"

Depends. I've routinely told people I'm witnessing to, that by their own admission they are a sinner and are going to Hell. I suppose I shouldn't do that either, right? Cuz that's not loving?
"Exactly. "

Law before grace my dear. Without the law, the grace just is not as sweet.

Thanks for noticing I was wrongfully accused - I didn't REBUKE Michael, and I didn't call him a heretic.
I agreed with another poster (who was completely ignored by Tavita) to take the opportunity to pounce on me instead.
(not like it hurts me any... it's just the principle of what was done that needs to be clarified) --

How do you go from making FALSE allegations of someone, then blame them for being hurtful and condemnational by it when they never did that?

ps. this thread is about HELL, not the Trinity -- as my previous post said, it's one reason I didn't bother to start making a dissertation on the Trinity/Christ's Deity bcuz it DERAILS THE THREAD.

There are plenty of Trinity threads recently, go find one and read those posts - Jesus is God.

 

[Tavita]

Thanks for noticing I was wrongfully accused - I didn't REBUKE Michael, and I didn't call him a heretic.
I agreed with another poster (who was completely ignored by Tavita) to take the opportunity to pounce on me instead.
(not like it hurts me any... it's just the principle of what was done that needs to be clarified) --

How do you go from making FALSE allegations of someone, then blame them for being hurtful and condemnational by it when they never did that?

ps. this thread is about HELL, not the Trinity -- as my previous post said, it's one reason I didn't bother to start making a dissertation on the Trinity/Christ's Deity bcuz it DERAILS THE THREAD.

There are plenty of Trinity threads recently, go find one and read those posts - Jesus is God.

Okay, okay, I'm sorry for using your post Nadiine. I should have used FreeinChrist's instead. It would have helped if you hadn't jumped in and agreed with her and added your comments though, don't ya think?

 

[GuardianShua]

The Jehovah Witnesses are not heretics.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeinChrist
Great. A belief (a heretical one) of the Jehovah Witnesses is being promoted here.

In Christian history, it was the Pagan Christians who distroyed the Judaeo Christians. Those who were beheaded and burned at the stake, were those who would not keep the Sunday Sabbath and accept Trinitarism. Who changed Gods time and laws? Who uses Gods name title "Holy Father?" Who sits in a temple of God as a god? Who is truly a heretic? Who can on ized the bible?


Trinitarian and Hell doctrine is not an original teaching.


This is a picture of the statue Jupiter giving a Trinitarian sign.


The statue was renamed Peter. http://www.remnantofgod.org/peter-jupiter.jpg I repeat, This Pagan statue of Jupiter was renamed Peter. Jupiter is giving the Trinitarian sign.



The Hellenistic Pagan Jews hung Jesus on the cross as a heretic.


From about 167 BC the Hellenistic Jews were in control of Jerusalem. They were a secret society in control of the people during the life of Jesus.


A word study.


These quotes are from the Encyclopedia Americana,1961 edition.
"Words are frequently changed in an entirely arbitrary way, just for the sake of change, as is the case with taboo, and cant. The purpose is to deform the word in any possible way and render it unrecongnizable."
"Cant ,the secret language of a corporation or class of persons, such as criminals, hoboes, students, soldiers, railroaders, conspirators, and the like." This quote should have also included secret societies.
"Canopus. In Egyptian mythology, a water god, represented on vessels of a spherical shape." That is, the shape of a serpent.
"Cannibalism, Kan/i/bal/ism, a customary, socially approved practice, among certain barbarous peoples, of eating human flesh." "The fact that the older, learned term "anthropophagy" derives from the classic Greek anthropos (man) , and phagein (eat), suggests that from ancient times barbarous peoples were known to eat human flesh, or at least were accused of doing so."

Here is a list of proper names of some snakes.

Apostolepis: nick name, messenger snake.
Acanthophis: Adder's.
Canna, Pseudaspis: Mole snake.
Candidus, Bungarus.
Candoia: #1. Aspera, #2. Bibroni, #3. Carinata.
Caninus, Corallas: Emerald tree boa.
Cantherigerus, Alsophis.
Cantil, Agkistrodon bilineatus.
Canus, Tropidophis.
Cantori, Trimeresurus.
Canum, Gyalopion: Western hook-nosed.
It was the Vati can that can on ized the bible. The word "Vatican" is a compound word, but in what dictionary is that stated? Have you ever given any thought to the term "Social Engineering."

 

[sentipente]

When considering the bottom line of eternity with or without God... Does it really matter? You either spend eternity with Him or not (hell).

It matters for no other reason than the fact that to the extent that we misunderstand the truth about hell to that extent we also misunderstand the truth about the Creator. This is important because He has said that the essence of life eternal is in knowing Him.

 

[Nadiine]

Okay, okay, I'm sorry for using your post Nadiine. I should have used FreeinChrist's instead. It would have helped if you hadn't jumped in and agreed with her and added your comments though, don't ya think?

Well gee, I'm really sorry I had the audacity to participate in the thread & agree with somebody - maybe when I see you agree with Ben or James I'll comment that I wouldn't have to reply to you if you hadn't agreed w/ one of them...

I mean, this is open discussion and debate, isn't it?

 

[sentipente]

This is beginning to sound like hell.

 

[Nadiine]

This is beginning to sound like hell.

lol I agree with you there

 

[Zecryphon]

Well gee, I'm really sorry I had the audacity to participate in the thread & agree with somebody - maybe when I see you agree with Ben or James I'll comment that I wouldn't have to reply to you if you hadn't agreed w/ one of them...

I mean, this is open discussion and debate, isn't it?

Nope. I'm startin' to get the idea that the openness for discussion and debate only extends one way, to the liberals. If you're a conservative and try to be open in your discussions you get falsely accused of doing things you didn't do, or being unloving.

 

[SoundCard]

Obviously the concept of rebuking isn't very popular around here.

 

[Nadiine]

Nope. I'm startin' to get the idea that the openness for discussion and debate only extends one way, to the liberals. If you're a conservative and try to be open in your discussions you get falsely accused of doing things you didn't do, or being unloving.

I don't honestly know what's at the bottom of it; all I do know is that it doesn't intimidate me any to be silenced when I see Jesus' Deity being removed...
They can bark and howl all day long, I have no intentions on being silent for fear of reprimand.

And if rebuke is so horrible and unloving, then she shouldn't be doing it either I wouldn't think. (problem is, I hadn't rebuked anyone in the first place).