The Torah is still valid..

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

But, the sabbath is the sign of the Law. And if you keep that, you must reject Christ and keep the whole thing.

What? All the Apostles kept Shabbat...did they reject Him? The 2 are NOT mutually exclusive no matter what you have been taught

 

[Dave L]

Sorry you also are so mis-informed. So it is OK to steal and murder now? The 10 were actually re-enforced! Matthew 5:27-28

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Do you just say this? HOW do you DO that? The first 4 Commandments show how you love The Almighty, the last 6 show how you love your neighbor.

You are confusing the Ten Commandments (now abolished) with the Two Great Commandments that believers of all time lived by. And also live by today in the New Covenant.

 

[Dave L]

What? All the Apostles kept Shabbat...did they reject Him? The 2 are NOT mutually exclusive no matter what you have been taught

They did not. They tried to kill Paul for teaching against it.

"Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day- things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ." (Col 2:16)

 

[LoveofTruth]

Sorry you also are so mis-informed. So it is OK to steal and murder now? The 10 were actually re-enforced! Matthew 5:27-28

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Do you just say this? HOW do you DO that? The first 4 Commandments show how you love The Almighty, the last 6 show how you love your neighbor.

the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus makes us free from the law of sin and death. Love fulfills the law. If a person walks in God's love in their heart and in faith they are in a new and living way. Not in tables of stone.

But just read 2 Cor 3 it clearly shows that the law ( Ten Commandments, written in stone) are done away and abolished. And those who read the OT have a veil on thieir heart.

 

[LoveofTruth]

Sorry you also are so mis-informed. So it is OK to steal and murder now? The 10 were actually re-enforced! Matthew 5:27-28

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Do you just say this? HOW do you DO that? The first 4 Commandments show how you love The Almighty, the last 6 show how you love your neighbor.

The whole law was saying we should love God and our neighbour. But men are in sin and do not have such love. The law breaks men and exposes sin and leads them to Christ to be justified by faith. Then they are no longer under the law.

To tell a man who is bound in sin he must love God and his neighbour. He cannot do that until he is born again. But as he tries and fails he is exposed of his sin and hopefully will be humbled and beat his chest and not even look towards heaven and say have mercy on me a sinner. This man will then be in the right and have God dwell with him.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Yes and I think they had to offer animal sacrifice with EVERY sabbath as I remember.

There is no Temple. There was no Temple when it was instituted.

 

[LoveofTruth]

What? All the Apostles kept Shabbat...did they reject Him? The 2 are NOT mutually exclusive no matter what you have been taught

The early Jewish believers were slow in coming out of the old and into the new. They were in a time of reformation Hebrews 9. The Old covenant was fading away, decaying and ready to vainish Hebrews 8. And we see this all through Acts. They still struggled with the law and many aspects of it. Jesus said he had many things to say and to judge of them but they were not able to bear it at that time. Gradually God showed them the freedoms.

Paul became as under the law to those who were under the law and as without the law to those without the law. But he was always in the law of Christ , in the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus makes us free from the law of sin and death. Love fulfills the law. If a person walks in God's love in their heart and in faith they are in a new and living way. Not in tables of stone.

But just read 2 Cor 3 it clearly shows that the law ( Ten Commandments, written in stone) are done away and abolished. And those who read the OT have a veil on thieir heart.

It makes us free FROM THE CURSE. When you sin, is it OK now or do you have to repent? You are still blinded thinking the 2 are mutually exclusive...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The early Jewish believers were slow in coming out of the old and into the new. They were in a time of reformation Hebrews 9. The Old covenant was fading away, decaying and ready to vainish Hebrews 8. And we see this all through Acts. They still struggled with the law and many aspects of it. Jesus said he had many things to say and to judge of them but they were not able to bear it at that time. Gradually God showed them the freedoms.

Paul became as under the law to those who were under the law and as without the law to those without the law. But he was always in the law of Christ , in the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus.

So you are saying that those under the law of Christ are lawless? The new covenant is the law WITHIN our hearts...we follow because we WANT to

 

[LoveofTruth]

There is no Temple. There was no Temple when it was instituted.

I don't believe that would change it. It was forever under the covenenat.

A covenant is forever with God and men until they break the covenant. And all have broken the law.

But think of it this way

Four young men are walking along a road they see two large glass houses. On the sides of the houses it reads , "You must love me and my neighbour and do not throw stones."

The boys did not plan on throwing stones. And so they then were provoked and threw stones and broke the glass. 10 window frames each.

Now a little while passed and they all got saved and were born again. Now they were walking along the road and saw the same houses smashed and went to the owners and said sorry and showed their love to them by cleaning up the glass. The owner saw their love and was now able to take the signs down.

There was no more need for the sign with them. But he kept it in the back in case they went back into hard hearts.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The whole law was saying we should love God and our neighbour. But men are in sin and do not have such love.

that has never changed

 

[LoveofTruth]

It makes us free FROM THE CURSE. When you sin, is it OK now or do you have to repent? You are still blinded thinking the 2 are mutually exclusive...

No , not just the curse the entire Mosaic law and covenant. And Paul even says when some read the Old testament the veil is on the heart.

Paul is referring specifically to the ten commandments also.

 

[Anguspure]

..for whom it was originally intended for, i.e. the Jewish People.

Jesus says in Matthew 24 (NRSV) about the end times (which of course comes after Jesus' crucifixion)

“So when you see the desolating sacrilege standing in the holy place, as was spoken of by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), 16 then those in Judea must flee to the mountains; 17 the one on the housetop must not go down to take what is in the house; 18 the one in the field must not turn back to get a coat. 19 Woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing infants in those days! 20 Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a sabbath. 21 For at that time there will be great suffering, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. 22 And if those days had not been cut short, no one would be saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. 23 Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look! Here is the Messiah! or ‘There he is!’—do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and produce great signs and omens, to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25 Take note, I have told you beforehand. 26 So, if they say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out. If they say, ‘Look! He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever the corpse is, there the vultures will gather.

Jesus says the Sabbath is still valid.

Jesus fulfilled the Torah and so we look to Him and His guidance to fulfill the Law.
He is our Torah.
I read a bit of Torah teaching and I have noticed that anywhere that the Torah is looked towards for guidance (by the Rabbi), Christ could be inserted even more satisfactorily.
We are no longer the people of the Book, rather we are filled with the Spirit and are the people of Christ Jesus.

 

[LoveofTruth]

that has never changed

Loving God and your neighgbour has not changed. And only those who are in Christ in the law of the Spirit can have God's love shed abroad in their heart by the Holy Ghost. Now they walk in the Spirit not in the letter.

They do not seek to establish their own righteousness by trying to keep an outward law in stone.

And we can't mix the two together, law and grace. Read Galatians 3 and Romans 7.

We cannot be married to the law and married to Christ at the same time, that would be spiritual adultery. We cannot begin in the Spirit and receive the Spirit by the hearing of faith then seek to be made perfect by the law again.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

You are confusing the Ten Commandments (now abolished) with the Two Great Commandments that believers of all time lived by. And also live by today in the New Covenant.

I am not confusing anything! The 2 are a summary of the 10.

 

[Tomb523]

The Sabbath and marriage were instituted from the beginning. The 7th day? Genesis 2:3

Agreed, the 7th day. Is that my 7th or yours? Calendar wasn't the same as it is today. You labor for 6 days and rest on the 7th, but as the Church is no longer a country as was Israel, a single day is not established.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Loving God and your neighgbour has not changed. And only those who are in Christ in the law of the Spirit can have God's love shed abroad in their heart by the Holy Ghost. Now they walk in the Spirit not in the letter.

They do not seek to establish their own righteousness by trying to keep an outward law in stone.

And we can't mix the two together, law and grace. Read Galatians 3 and Romans 7.

We cannot be married to the law and married to Christ at the same time, that would be spiritual adultery. We cannot begin in the Spirit and receive the Spirit by the hearing of faith then seek to be made perfect by the law again.

You are saying they are mutually exclusive, which is not so. We follow because we love The Almighty...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Agreed, the 7th day. Is that my 7th or yours? Calendar wasn't the same as it is today. You labor for 6 days and rest on the 7th, but as the Church is no longer a country as was Israel, a single day is not established.

The Almighty's 7th day

 

[Dave L]

I am not confusing anything! The 2 are a summary of the 10.

Not true...The Ten HUNG from the Two. = the Two Preexisted them....

“On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” (Matthew 22:40)

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Now they were walking along the road and saw the same houses smashed and went to the owners and said sorry and showed their love to them by cleaning up the glass. The owner saw their love and was now able to take the signs down.

There was no more need for the sign with them. But he kept it in the back in case they went back into hard hearts.

That is just following the Commandments...