The single biggest problem with the education system.

[Caliban]

As I said, the system changed the rules, not the parents.

Why maintain vague language? What monolithic "system" are you thinking of and what is your evidence for any of this?

 

[timothyu]

Why maintain vague language? What monolithic "system" are you thinking of and what is your evidence for any of this?

I worked in that system where even the teachers were up against the new age mentality of the school physiologists and councillors encouraging the kids to be more self oriented. The damaged career professional blind leading the blind.

 

[Caliban]

I worked in that system where even the teachers were up against the new age mentality of the school physiologists and councillors encouraging the kids to be more self oriented. The blind leading the blind.

When you use language such as "New Age mentality" or "brainwashed," you leave too much open to interpretation/misinterpretation. Unspecificity does not contribute to successful dialogue and has the likelihood to exacerbate frustration in your readers. Of course as a teacher myself, I am going to point out the weakness of an argument when I see it. I do however, enjoy engaging with the forthright.

 

[timothyu]

Well as you promote yourself as a sceptic I can only hope you encourage your students to be likewise in questioning a system that seeks to muddle rather than clarify. Is there really a need to alter education to become adaptable to trends or was the original intention to teach basics of common tools to lead the way into the various fields of employment or discovery. How to behave in the system is not a craft. There is no growth with a monopolized mindset, only allegiance to someone else's system.The idea is not to teach the student to be like the teacher (often taught to be so by someone else) but to open their minds to who they may be in comparison and let them take the basic tools of RR & R to create what they may.. Perhaps the radical students of days gone by forced the system to get to the kids earlier to avoid future confrontations common to the past. Conformity I guess is the point of education today.

 

[Caliban]

Well as you promote yourself as a sceptic I can only hope you encourage your students to be likewise in questioning a system that seeks to muddle rather than clarify. Is there really a need to alter education to become adaptable to trends or was the original intention to teach basics of common tools to lead the way into the various fields of employment or discovery. How to behave in the system is not a craft.

Again..."to muddle rather than clarify..." How about doing some clarifying of your own. The educational system exists to supply the students with an opportunity to access the basic educational and academic skills required to live successfully in the modern world. Yes, critical thinking is part of this process. It is politically non-partisan and secular. Your criticisms seem overly vague and uninformed; maybe I'm wrong but, that is the my conclusion barring further explanation and evidence.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The system, not the parents, started teaching the kids 30 years ago about their rights, setting aside responsibility as the prime focus. That generation is producing a new generation based on those principles and people wonder why the apathy and avarice today.

I often sense that young people today are from a different planet, or a least from a different country (or maybe I'm just getting old).

 

[High Fidelity]

You don't pass exams by showing up for class.

I would agree that there is a difference in how it was done in the past versus now, though.

Beyond that, I think it's a shame people think higher education/college is necessary to become successful.

 

[timothyu]

I often sense that young people today are from a different planet, or a least from a different country (or maybe I'm just getting old).

Perhaps a different generation?

 

[ruthiesea]

I often sense that young people today are from a different planet, or a least from a different country (or maybe I'm just getting old).

Isn’t that what are parents said about us (that and that wasn’t really music to which we listened)?

 

[timothyu]

Isn’t that what are parents said about us (that and that wasn’t really music to which we listened)?

But if you go back 50-60 years, we were from a different planet and happily admitted so.

 

[Dave-W]

I would agree that there is a difference in how it was done in the past versus now, though.

Readin' and Writin' and 'Rithmatic; taught to the tune of a hickory stick....

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Here is a link to my states Common Core Standards for the grades I teach 11th and 12th. I think you will be surprised to discover how normal but rigorous they are.
English Language Arts Standards » Reading: Literature » Grade 11-12 | Common Core State Standards Initiative

But does the reading material itself present largely liberal ideas? What are some of the titles used?

 

[Dave-W]

If you're still in a rural area when your kids are in MS & HS they could go to Stanford OHS if they wanted to avoid waking up super early to do the commute with you. I went there & so did another girl on here. We both LOVED it and the education is incredible. Though if you do online school you have to be really involved in something besides school to have enough social interaction / other interests. For me that was music, for my friend who is here, she's a professional dancer.

Just a thought!!! There are free online schools too. They vary in quality. Stanford OHS is awesome bc of the variety of classes you can take, and the teachers are the GOAT.

Sounds like a very good idea Cimorene!

<aside> could you pm me? I have a prayer request for another teen that is may be just up your alley.

 

[Cimorene]

Sounds like a very good idea Cimorene!

<aside> could you pm me? I have a prayer request for another teen that is may be just up your alley.

Thx! Ok, I will. Just as a FYI / public disclosure I do sometimes PM w adults about a specific topic but I don't really PM with adults Idk IRL just to chat.

 

[RDKirk]

When I had classes in the Air Force, they graded the instructors on how many students passed the test. So all the instructors would interlace their lectures with, "SHOULD you see a question on the test which asks 'this', the right answer would be...."

I'm not sure that was the best way to train people either.

Depends on the kind of course.

It's proper to use the rate of successful course completions as a factor of instructor evaluation. The instructor is not there merely to consume oxygen but, in fact, to do a specific job: Train troops. If no troops are getting trained, clearly the instructor is the common denominator of all those failures.

When the need was mere memorization of a fact, yes, the instructor would explicitly point out which facts needed to be memorized. Not sure I see a problem with that.

In most cases, people in the military are in training programs that they have the capacity to pass. The intent and expectation is that they succeed in being trained.

In other words: The intent and expectation is an equal outcome, that everyone end up capable of passing the final examination, text, exercise, whatever that might be. Or combat.

Reaching an equal outcome with students that start out with varying capabilities means varying levels of instruction to get there. So students help each other study, help each other drill, help each other do what's necessary so that they all can succeed.

As they said in my day, "Cooperate and graduate." Or as scripture puts it:

Our desire is not that others might be relieved while you are hard pressed, but that there might be equality. At the present time your plenty will supply what they need, so that in turn their plenty will supply what you need.

The goal is equality, as it is written: “The one who gathered much did not have too much, and the one who gathered little did not have too little.”-- 2 Corinthians 8

The goal is that all get over the wall.

The last soldier is the strongest--who makes sure all others get over first.

 

[RDKirk]

Isn't the purpose of education to infuse the student with the right answers? Another problem with the system is that knowledge is parceled out in a niggardly manner. Much of what is to be learned can simply be told to the students, without the dog and pony show. What is happening is that they are teaching at the level of what they imagine the 'slowest' learner would be. So many sit in class bored to death (I was). Teaching must be a mix of classroom instruction and tutoring. Only then can the progress of each student be assured to the extent possible.

When I was in the first grade, there were about 50 students in the classroom--the teacher Mrs George had to teach both first and second grade.

My grandmother had already taught me how to read, which Mrs George figured out quickly (or she might have already known because she was a close friend of my mother's). So she had me helping some second-graders who were behind in their reading instead of me sitting through the reading hour with the other first-graders.

 

[timothyu]

So she had me helping some second-graders who were behind in their reading instead of me sitting through the reading hour with the other first-graders.

And in effect taught how to delegate tasks

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Depends on the kind of course.

It's proper to use the rate of successful course completions as a factor of instructor evaluation. The instructor is not there merely to consume oxygen but, in fact, to do a specific job: Train troops. If no troops are getting trained, clearly the instructor is the common denominator of all those failures.

When the need was mere memorization of a fact, yes, the instructor would explicitly point out which facts needed to be memorized. Not sure I see a problem with that.

In most cases, people in the military are in training programs that they have the capacity to pass. The intent and expectation is that they succeed in being trained.

In other words: The intent and expectation is an equal outcome, that everyone end up capable of passing the final examination, text, exercise, whatever that might be. Or combat.

Reaching an equal outcome with students that start out with varying capabilities means varying levels of instruction to get there. So students help each other study, help each other drill, help each other do what's necessary so that they all can succeed.

As they said in my day, "Cooperate and graduate." Or as scripture puts it:

Our desire is not that others might be relieved while you are hard pressed, but that there might be equality. At the present time your plenty will supply what they need, so that in turn their plenty will supply what you need.

The goal is equality, as it is written: “The one who gathered much did not have too much, and the one who gathered little did not have too little.”-- 2 Corinthians 8

The goal is that all get over the wall.

The last soldier is the strongest--who makes sure all others get over first.

We need the "pass/fail" grading system. In my grade school it was "satisfactory/unsatisfactory". We were also graded on our social development.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

When I was in the first grade, there were about 50 students in the classroom--the teacher Mrs George had to teach both first and second grade.

My grandmother had already taught me how to read, which Mrs George figured out quickly (or she might have already known because she was a close friend of my mother's). So she had me helping some second-graders who were behind in their reading instead of me sitting through the reading hour with the other first-graders.

I learned how to spell and to write some words from my older brother before I even went to school (it didn't help my penmanship however, which is still lousy).

 

[timothyu]

We need the "pass/fail" grading system.

Teach the world once again that the inmates do not run the asylum like they have done since that advent of the internet??