The Second Death

[Diamond7]

Could you show me?

This took place WHEN the vail was torn.

Mattheww 27:50 When Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, He yielded up His spirit. 51At that moment the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth quaked and the rocks were split. 52The tombs broke open, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised. 53 After Jesus’ resurrection, when they had come out of the tombs, they entered the holy city and appeared to many people.

When the Bible says: "many" I pay attention. 4183 polýs – many (high in number); multitudinous, plenteous, "much"; "great" in amount (extent).

 

[Diamond7]

So based on what you do, as recorded in the books, you name either goes into, and remains in the book of life, or not.

I believe our name was written in the book of life at the foundation of the world. We have no choice in that we have to choose. God will not or can not assume responsibility. There are two scriptures that talk about being bolted out of the book of life.

Psalm 69:28
May they be blotted out of the Book of Life and not listed with the righteous.

Revelation 3:5
Like them, he who overcomes will be dressed in white. And I will never blot out his name from the Book of Life, but I will confess his name before My Father and His angels.

Deuteronomy 30:19 I call heaven and earth as witnesses against you today that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing. Therefore choose life, so that you and your descendants may live,

Isaiah 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Jeremiah 1:12 The LORD said to me, “You have seen correctly, for I am watching to see that my word is fulfilled.”

 

[Diamond7]

Could these books be words from God, that people must be taught - like how we have the Bible today to teach us God's way?
Jeremiah 15:16

We have the word of God and we are given the Spirit of God to help us understand.

 

[CoreyD]

This took place WHEN the vail was torn.

Mattheww 27:50 When Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, He yielded up His spirit. 51At that moment the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth quaked and the rocks were split. 52The tombs broke open, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised. 53 After Jesus’ resurrection, when they had come out of the tombs, they entered the holy city and appeared to many people.

When the Bible says: "many" I pay attention. 4183 polýs – many (high in number); multitudinous, plenteous, "much"; "great" in amount (extent).

Sorry for being away so long.

Thank you so much, for the scripture.
Matthew 27:
50 And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice and yielded up his spirit.
51 And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split.
52 The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised,
53 and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many.

Let's look at this scripture closely.
#1
Comparing translations, on the Bible Hub website, I counted six (6) translations that inserted Jesus, in place of 'he' - αὐτός : autos: (1) self (emphatic) (2) he, she, it (used for the third pers. pron.) (3) the same.
Why do you suppose some Bible translators have taken it upon themselves to say that the verse is talking about "after the resurrection of Jesus"?

#2
In verse 53, the Greek word egersis (ἔγερσις) is used, which means rising, or rousing. Not resurrection.
The Greek word used by the Christian Greek writers when discussing resurrection is, anastasis (ἀνάστασις) - a standing up,a raising up, rising.
Of the thirty two (32) translations, on the site, only five (5) uses 'rising', while the other twenty seven (27) uses 'resurrection'.

#3
Still with verse 53. The Greek word used there is, emphanizó (ἐμφανίζω), which can mean to exhibit, appear (in person), or, to declare.
On the Bible Hub site, practically all the translators use appear. Three use show (exhibit).

With the above information, let's consider these points.

How could the verse be referring to after Jesus' resurrection, when Jesus was not resurrected till the third day?​

The verse could not be referring to Jesus, because that would mean that Matthew is relating something that happened two days subsequent to the earthquake. That would mean the insertion is wrong - misleading, or mistranslated.​

Could the verses be referring to the dead Saints being resurrected, and then entering the temple to be seen by all?​

For two (2) reasons, that would not be correct.​

Reason #1​

The verse can be read as:​

Greek exactly​

καὶ ἐξελθόντες ἐκ τῶν μνημείων μετὰ τὴν ἔγερσιν αὐτοῦ εἰσῆλθον εἰς τὴν ἁγίαν πόλιν καὶ ἐνεφανίσθησαν πολλοῖς.​

​

English (word for word)​

and having gone forth out of the tombs after the rising of him they entered into the holy city and declared to many​

​

English (made understandable) ​

(verse 53) and persons having gone forth out of the tombs after the rising of him, these persons entered into the holy city and declared to many (what they saw). Hence many people got to hear, (verse 52) that the bodies of many Saints had been raised up - that is, thrown out of their tombs, since the earthquake was so powerful that it split rocks, and tombs broke open.​

​

Reason #2​

The resurrection of the Saints would happen, not before Jesus was resurrected, but after.​

1 Thessalonians 4:​

16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.​

17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.​

​

1 Corinthians 15:22, 23​

For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.​

But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.​

​

Also, please consider Hebrews 9:24; Hebrews 10:19;​

So, if we are to keep in harmony with the scriptures, would it not be the case that a resurrection did not occur there and then, but rather, the bodies of many Saints were thrown from their tombs as these tombs were split open by the quake, and those who witnessed it, went into the temple, and declared what they saw?

 

[CoreyD]

We have the word of God and we are given the Spirit of God to help us understand.

Yes, we do, but the Jews did not have this,
Is it not true, there were instructions given by God, for each period of his dealings with his people?

 

[BNR32FAN]

There is no activity, planning, knowledge, or wisdom in Sheol - the grave - where you are going
Ecclesiastes 9:10

New King James Version
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going.

New American Standard Bible
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might; for there is no activity, planning, knowledge, or wisdom in Sheol where you are going.

The rich man in the story of Lazarus and the rich man was both active and had knowledge, he even made a plan to save his brothers but it just wasn’t possible to execute that plan.

 

[CoreyD]

The rich man in the story of Lazarus and the rich man was both active and had knowledge, he even made a plan to save his brothers but it just wasn’t possible to execute that plan.

There is a short article here.
Can you take a look at it, and tell me what you think of it, please. Thank you.

 

[BNR32FAN]

There is a short article here.
Can you take a look at it, and tell me what you think of it, please. Thank you.

I glanced at it, it’s basically saying that what Jesus said isn’t true. The thing is, the lake of fire isn’t in Sheol it’s in hell which is where Hades will be thrown into. Hades is the place of torment in Sheol as opposed to Abraham’s Bosom which is the place of paradise in Sheol. The residents of Hades are waiting to be thrown into the lake of fire on Judgement Day.

 

[BNR32FAN]

We are told Hebrew 12:8 I WILL REMEMBER THEIR SINS NO MORE.”

I think about this all the time. We are told: "Nothing is impossible for God" but we have to read this in context. There are LOTS of things impossible for God. He cannot lie, cheat, steal or be unfaithful or unJust. The list goes on and on for what God cannot do.

I don’t believe that passage means God will actually forget, it means He will not take into account our sins. If God were to forget He would cease to be omniscient and since He is also omnipresent He is constantly seeing everything take place at the same time.

 

[CoreyD]

I glanced at it, it’s basically saying that what Jesus said isn’t true.

That's what you saw? Honestly?
Thank you for your honest response.

What I saw, is that they said what is true. Which is, that Jesus used parables and illustrations, and they defined, or gave the definition for these, according to English dictionaries.

If you disagree with the dictionaries, can you be so kind, as to give me a source which defines parables and illustrations differently.
I don't think you disagree with the scripture they used, where Jesus directly stated why he used parables, so I may be missing what led you to your conclusion.

Would you mind explaining?

The thing is, the lake of fire isn’t in Sheol it’s in hell which is where Hades will be thrown into. Hades is the place of torment in Sheol as opposed to Abraham’s Bosom which is the place of paradise in Sheol. The residents of Hades are waiting to be thrown into the lake of fire on Judgement Day.

It's all well and goof for people to believe things, or have their own ideas about things BNR, but I am sure you wouldn't take something someone tells you as fact, just because they say it. Especially when they start their statement with "The thing is".
You would probably ask them what they have to show, to support their claim. Am I wrong?

 

[throughfiierytrial]

I understand, not everyone will see, because of their heart.

However, that still leaves a lot at us.
First, we need to humble ourselves. 1 Peter 5:6
We need to search for the truth, and once we find it - Matthew 7:13, 14, we need to put forth every effort to strive toward the goal of everlasting life. Luke 13:24
Then, we need to endure to the end. Matthew 24:13

God said, I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; Deuteronomy 30:19
So, the choice is ours.

That's a lot at us, wouldn't you agree?
However, I agree it depends on our heart, which God see, and only draws those with right hearts. John 6:44

MANY are called few are chosen sir.
Furthermore there are so many misunderstandings of Revelation that a new doctrine has evolved...false doctrine.

 

[BNR32FAN]

That's what you saw? Honestly?
Thank you for your honest response.

What I saw, is that they said what is true. Which is, that Jesus used parables and illustrations, and they defined, or gave the definition for these, according to English dictionaries.

If you disagree with the dictionaries, can you be so kind, as to give me a source which defines parables and illustrations differently.

Parables and illustrations are very different than an actual story. They contain obvious metaphors like “the kingdom of God is like a mustard seed” or “the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, some fell on the rocky soil, some fell among the thorns” etc etc. You can clearly see that these statements are symbolic of something, that they are not intended to be taken literally. Parables and illustrations also have an element of truth to them by explaining a similar analogy that can be useful in describing certain conditions, events or situations. Where is the symbolism is the story about Lazarus and the rich man? I don’t see anything in that story that indicates a symbolic metaphor. What it is, is a story that is intended to teach the expectations of God and the eternal consequences for failing to meet those expectations.

”Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭14‬:‭9‬-‭11‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

This statement in Revelation 14 is the exact same scenario that the rich man was encountering in Hades except this particular incident will take place in the lake of fire on Judgement Day. How many times did Jesus say the term “these will go into outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth”? Again this is descriptive of the rich man’s situation. The evidence that people are actively suffering in both Hades and the lake of fire is quite compelling.

 

[CoreyD]

Parables and illustrations are very different than an actual story. They contain obvious metaphors like “the kingdom of God is like a mustard seed” or “the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, some fell on the rocky soil, some fell among the thorns” etc etc. You can clearly see that these statements are symbolic of something, that they are not intended to be taken literally. Parables and illustrations also have an element of truth to them by explaining a similar analogy that can be useful in describing certain conditions, events or situations.

Thank you very much for that clear and precise explanation.

Where is the symbolism is the story about Lazarus and the rich man? I don’t see anything in that story that indicates a symbolic metaphor. What it is, is a story that is intended to teach the expectations of God and the eternal consequences for failing to meet those expectations.

Thank you for asking.
I don't know the real reason why you don't see anything in the illustration. God knows.
Perhaps the reason could be that the illustration was not intended for you. However, those for whom it was intended, got it. They knew what it was about. Luke 16:14, 15

That was not the only one they got either. Luke 20:19
Whether a person gets the sense of an illustration or not though, is not what validates it as an illustration. It's a matter of accepting what the scriptures tell us. Isn't it.
The scripture tell us plainly, "All these things Jesus said to the crowds in parables; indeed, he said nothing to them without a parable. This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet: “I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter what has been hidden since the foundation of the world.”" Matthew 13:34, 35; Mark 4:33, 34

His disciples became familiar with this, and so, they would always question him. Matthew 13:16
Like them, Jesus' followers in modern times, accept his illustrations as they are, and thus get the connection between the illustration, and the conditions, events or situations Jesus is directing attention to.


Luke 16:14, 15
The Pharisees, who were lovers of money, heard all of this and were scoffing at Jesus.
And He [Jesus] said to them, "You are those justifying themselves before men, but God knows your hearts; for that which is exalted among men is an abomination before God.

Luke 16:16
The Law and the prophets were until John. From that time the kingdom of God is proclaimed, and everyone forces * his way into it.
biázō – properly, to use power to forcibly seize, laying hold of something with positive aggressiveness. 971 /biázō ("to advance forcefully")

Luke 16:19-21
Jesus said, “There was a certain rich man who was splendidly clothed in purple and fine linen and who lived each day in luxury.
At his gate lay a poor man named Lazarus who was covered with sores.
As Lazarus lay there longing for scraps from the rich man’s table, the dogs would come and lick his open sores

Luke 16:22
“Finally, the poor man died and was carried by the angels to sit beside Abraham at the heavenly banquet. The rich man also died and was buried,

The conditions, and situations are there for those Jesus described:
Then Jesus said, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear.” Mark 4:9
He replied, “The knowledge of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. ...This is why I speak to them in parables: ‘Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.’ In them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled: ‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. Matthew 13:11-16
Luke 10:21, 22

”Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭14‬:‭9‬-‭11‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

You seem to e taking this as literal. May I ask why?
Why are you taking a highly symbolic book, which an angel of God who was sent to declare the message, clearly says, he δίδωμι αὐτός σημαίνω gave him in signs?

This statement in Revelation 14 is the exact same scenario that the rich man was encountering in Hades except this particular incident will take place in the lake of fire on Judgement Day. How many times did Jesus say the term “these will go into outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth”? Again this is descriptive of the rich man’s situation. The evidence that people are actively suffering in both Hades and the lake of fire is quite compelling.

I think you honestly believe this, but let me ask you - Did the angel say the lake of fire is symbolic of something?
I'm taking into consideration your very precise, and clear explanation:
Parables and illustrations are very different than an actual story. They contain obvious metaphors like “the kingdom of God is like a mustard seed” or “the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, some fell on the rocky soil, some fell among the thorns” etc etc. You can clearly see that these statements are symbolic of something, that they are not intended to be taken literally.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Thank you for asking.
I don't know the real reason why you don't see anything in the illustration. God knows.
Perhaps the reason could be that the illustration was not intended for you. However, those for whom it was intended, got it. They knew what it was about. Luke 16:14, 15

That was not the only one they got either. Luke 20:19

Luke 16 took place on a different day in a different place than Luke 20. You can’t apply what was said in Luke 20 to Luke 16 because it was to a completely different audience. Sincerely, no offense my friend but you seem to be applying several verses in this post to this particular passage in Luke 16 that are not related to it.

Whether a person gets the sense of an illustration or not though, is not what validates it as an illustration. It's a matter of accepting what the scriptures tell us. Isn't it.
The scripture tell us plainly, "All these things Jesus said to the crowds in parables; indeed, he said nothing to them without a parable. This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet: “I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter what has been hidden since the foundation of the world.”" Matthew 13:34, 35; Mark 4:33, 34

Again you’re applying these passages from Matthew 13 and Mark 4 that were spoken on a different day in a different place to a different audience than Luke 16. These verses from Matthew 13 and Mark 4 are not pertaining to what He said in Luke 16.

The conditions, and situations are there for those Jesus described:
Then Jesus said, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear.” Mark 4:9
He replied, “The knowledge of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. ...This is why I speak to them in parables: ‘Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.’ In them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled: ‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. Matthew 13:11-16
Luke 10:21, 22

Yes I know why Jesus often spoke in parables but He didn’t always speak in parables, He often told stories about actual people and events to use as examples for certain situations.

You seem to e taking this as literal. May I ask why?
Why are you taking a highly symbolic book, which an angel of God who was sent to declare the message, clearly says, he δίδωμι αὐτός σημαίνω gave him in signs?

What angel are you referring to here? Revelation 20 is a prophecy John witnessed

”I, John, your brother and fellow partaker in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance which are in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like the sound of a trumpet, saying, “Write in a book what you see, and send it to the seven churches: to Ephesus and to Smyrna and to Pergamum and to Thyatira and to Sardis and to Philadelphia and to Laodicea.” Then I turned to see the voice that was speaking with me. And having turned I saw seven golden lampstands; and in the middle of the lampstands I saw one like a son of man, clothed in a robe reaching to the feet, and girded across His chest with a golden sash. His head and His hair were white like white wool, like snow; and His eyes were like a flame of fire. His feet were like burnished bronze, when it has been made to glow in a furnace, and His voice was like the sound of many waters. In His right hand He held seven stars, and out of His mouth came a sharp two-edged sword; and His face was like the sun shining in its strength. When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades. Therefore write the things which you have seen, and the things which are, and the things which will take place after these things. As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭1‬:‭9‬-‭20‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬


”Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20‬:‭1‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

The “I” in this passage is John witnessing what will take place on Judgement Day. I’m not sure what angel you’re referring to.

I think you honestly believe this, but let me ask you - Did the angel say the lake of fire is symbolic of something?

There was no angel saying anything in Revelation 20. Verse 1 only says that John saw an angel holding the key to the abyss, he never said that the angel said anything in that chapter.

I'm taking into consideration your very precise, and clear explanation:
Parables and illustrations are very different than an actual story. They contain obvious metaphors like “the kingdom of God is like a mustard seed” or “the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, some fell on the rocky soil, some fell among the thorns” etc etc. You can clearly see that these statements are symbolic of something, that they are not intended to be taken literally.

Yes you never answered this question. Again sincerely no offense intended here but you don’t seem to understand what a parable is. Look at the examples Jesus was giving right before the author said Jesus was speaking in parables in Matthew 13 and Mark 4. Those are actual parables. The intended message had absolutely nothing to do with seeds fallen on the ground, that is what a parable is. It’s an analogy, the story of Lazarus and the rich man is not an analogy it’s an actual story that literally relates to the message. A parable doesn’t literally relate to the message it’s an indirect analogy. There’s no symbolic message in that story the actual story literally pertains to the message.

 

[CoreyD]

Luke 16 took place on a different day in a different place than Luke 20. You can’t apply what was said in Luke 20 to Luke 16 because it was to a completely different audience. Sincerely, no offense my friend but you seem to be applying several verses in this post to this particular passage in Luke 16 that are not related to it.

When did Jesus' ministry begin?
Did uou notice - If you read the entire book of Luke, you will see where his ministry began.
From that time, Jesus was using illustration, and he never stopped. He did not stop at verse 15, and then continue from verse 17.

Again you’re applying these passages from Matthew 13 and Mark 4 that were spoken on a different day in a different place to a different audience than Luke 16. These verses from Matthew 13 and Mark 4 are not pertaining to what He said in Luke 16.

Do these passages in Matthew and Mark tell us the truth - that "In fact, in his public ministry he never taught without using parables; but afterward, when he was alone with his disciples, he explained everything to them." Mark 4:34
Do you believe and accept that?

Yes I know why Jesus often spoke in parables but He didn’t always speak in parables, He often told stories about actual people and events to use as examples for certain situations.

Which scripture can I find that says Jesus didn’t always speak in parables, He often told stories about actual people?
Please, can you quote that scripture.

What angel are you referring to here? Revelation 20 is a prophecy John witnessed

”I, John, your brother and fellow partaker in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance which are in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like the sound of a trumpet, saying, “Write in a book what you see, and send it to the seven churches: to Ephesus and to Smyrna and to Pergamum and to Thyatira and to Sardis and to Philadelphia and to Laodicea.” Then I turned to see the voice that was speaking with me. And having turned I saw seven golden lampstands; and in the middle of the lampstands I saw one like a son of man, clothed in a robe reaching to the feet, and girded across His chest with a golden sash. His head and His hair were white like white wool, like snow; and His eyes were like a flame of fire. His feet were like burnished bronze, when it has been made to glow in a furnace, and His voice was like the sound of many waters. In His right hand He held seven stars, and out of His mouth came a sharp two-edged sword; and His face was like the sun shining in its strength. When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades. Therefore write the things which you have seen, and the things which are, and the things which will take place after these things. As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭1‬:‭9‬-‭20‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

”Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20‬:‭1‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

The “I” in this passage is John witnessing what will take place on Judgement Day. I’m not sure what angel you’re referring to.

There was no angel saying anything in Revelation 20. Verse 1 only says that John saw an angel holding the key to the abyss, he never said that the angel said anything in that chapter.

Revelation 1:1 - The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave to him, to show to his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel to his servant John:

Yes you never answered this question.

I'm sorry. What question?

Again sincerely no offense intended here but you don’t seem to understand what a parable is. Look at the examples Jesus was giving right before the author said Jesus was speaking in parables in Matthew 13 and Mark 4. Those are actual parables. The intended message had absolutely nothing to do with seeds fallen on the ground, that is what a parable is. It’s an analogy, the story of Lazarus and the rich man is not an analogy it’s an actual story that literally relates to the message. A parable doesn’t literally relate to the message it’s an indirect analogy. There’s no symbolic message in that story the actual story literally pertains to the message.

Who is giving the Revelation to John? Isn't it the angel?
So, does the angel not say the lake of fire is symbolic of something - the second death?
Revelation 20:14 - Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Do these passages in Matthew and Mark tell us the truth - that "In fact, in his public ministry he never taught without using parables; but afterward, when he was alone with his disciples, he explained everything to them." Mark 4:34
Do you believe and accept that?

No Matthew 13:33 is only referring to the crowds at that particular announcement it does not refer to every time He spoke in public to a crowd of people. Verse 36 makes this clear.

”All these things Jesus spoke to the crowds in parables, and He did not speak to them without a parable. This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet: “I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden since the foundation of the world.” Then He left the crowds and went into the house. And His disciples came to Him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field.”“
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭13‬:‭34‬-‭36‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Since verse 36 says then He left the crowds and went into the house that is a clear indication that verse 33 was referring to the crowds at that particular location not all crowds during His entire ministry. Also Jesus spoke the following statements among many others to a crowd of 5,000 people. Are these following statements parables?

”“Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. “Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. “Blessed are the gentle, for they shall inherit the earth. “Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied. “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy. “Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. “Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. “Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.“
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5‬:‭3‬-‭12‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

These are not parables they are simply literal declarations. So obviously we can conclude that Matthew 13:33 was not referring to Jesus’ entire ministry.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Revelation 1:1 - The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave to him, to show to his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel to his servant John:

John received this revelation in a vision that began back in chapter 4.

”After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven, and the first voice which I had heard, like the sound of a trumpet speaking with me, said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after these things.” Immediately I was in the Spirit; and behold, a throne was standing in heaven, and One sitting on the throne.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭4‬:‭1‬-‭2‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

”I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed me these things.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭22‬:‭8‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

So the angel didn’t tell John these things John actually saw them in a vision.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I'm sorry. What question?

Parables contain metaphors. Where are the metaphors in the story of Lazarus and the rich man? Can you please quote them?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Who is giving the Revelation to John? Isn't it the angel?
So, does the angel not say the lake of fire is symbolic of something - the second death?
Revelation 20:14 - Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

But that leaves out other information where they are tormented day and night the smoke of their torment goes up forever where they have no rest day or night.

 

[CoreyD]

No Matthew 13:33 is only referring to the crowds at that particular announcement it does not refer to every time He spoke in public to a crowd of people. Verse 36 makes this clear.

Are you saying the scripture is not true?

”All these things Jesus spoke to the crowds in parables, and He did not speak to them without a parable. This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet: “I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden since the foundation of the world.” Then He left the crowds and went into the house. And His disciples came to Him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field.”“
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭13‬:‭34‬-‭36‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Since verse 36 says then He left the crowds and went into the house that is a clear indication that verse 33 was referring to the crowds at that particular location not all crowds during His entire ministry. Also Jesus spoke the following statements among many others to a crowd of 5,000 people. Are these following statements parables?

Are you saying that Jesus went into the house to speak with another crowd? If so, where, and why do you say this?
Did the disciples not approach him in private?

”“Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. “Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. “Blessed are the gentle, for they shall inherit the earth. “Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied. “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy. “Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. “Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. “Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.“
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5‬:‭3‬-‭12‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

These are not parables they are simply literal declarations. So obviously we can conclude that Matthew 13:33 was not referring to Jesus’ entire ministry.

Whom was Jesus addressing in particular?
Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him, and he began to teach them. Matthew 5:1, 2

Was it not his disciples?
Matthew 5:

13 “You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.​

​

14 “You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven.​

​

These are parables also, aren't they?

​

John received this revelation in a vision that began back in chapter 4.

”After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven, and the first voice which I had heard, like the sound of a trumpet speaking with me, said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after these things.” Immediately I was in the Spirit; and behold, a throne was standing in heaven, and One sitting on the throne.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭4‬:‭1‬-‭2‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

”I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed me these things.“
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭22‬:‭8‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

So the angel didn’t tell John these things John actually saw them in a vision.

The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John Revelation 1:1

Can you please read John 1:9-19 and tell me if John is not there receiving a revelation, in vision, given by the angel sent by Jesus, who is speaking with him?

Parables contain metaphors. Where are the metaphors in the story of Lazarus and the rich man? Can you please quote them?

I did, in this post.

But that leaves out other information where they are tormented day and night the smoke of their torment goes up forever where they have no rest day or night.

How does it leave out that information?
The angel tells us what the lake of fire is - the second death. The second death. Does he need to repeat it three times? No.
He does not need to explain the "tormented day and night the smoke of their torment goes up forever where they have no rest day or night" meaning, and changing his words wont make it mean what meaning we formulate in our mind.

The lake of fire is still the second death.
Agreed?