The Return of My Apple Challenge

[Nathan Poe]

What do you think of people who have children, Tiberius? Do you think it's right? Despite the fact that they know their children are going to mess up?

Fortunately, I'm not so shallow as to have children for one single purpose -- which I know they will fail.

 

[AV1611VET]

Fortunately, I'm not so shallow as to have children for one single purpose -- which I know they will fail.

Was that a sentence?

 

[quatona]

Was that a sentence?

To me it looks like one. But then, I´m not a native English speaker.

 

[Catholicon]

He meant the children failing at the single purpose that the parents had the children for.

In this case: Adam & Eve failing at being custodians of the Garden of Eden, which was the reason God made them.

EPIC FAIL, ADAM & EVE!

 

[FishFace]

What do you think of people who have children, Tiberius? Do you think it's right? Despite the fact that they know their children are going to mess up?

Can human parents prevent their children from messing up? Nope, not entirely. Could God have? Well of course he could - he's GOD!

 

[Lord Emsworth]

What do you think of people who have children, Tiberius? Do you think it's right? Despite the fact that they know their children are going to mess up?

What do you - or would you do - if you noticed your children playing on the freeway?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

let me fix this...

1. God created the universe.
2. God gave it to Adam and Eve to have dominion over it.
3. The Serpent tricked them out of it.
4. God, who is all knowing, gave the world to Adam and Eve, knowing full well they would be incompetant guardians of the world.
5. God punishes Adam and Eve for doing something that God knew they would do (and he also knew that they couldn't avoid it, because then God's foresight about it would have been wrong, and God can't ever be wrong) and that God could have even prevented them from doing, which is very fair of him. And some people say that God even meant for them to mess it up - and God still punishes them for it!
6. This is a good and kind and loving and fair God who deserves our unconditional love, because he's never done anything to hurt us (despite setting into motion a series of events which God knew for a fact would require us to be punished with death and would also require his son to be Humanity's whipping boy).
7. Satan then offered it to Jesus as one of the three temptations in the wilderness.
8. Jesus declined it - (Matthew 4).
9. Jesus will come back to this earth and set up His Kindom.
10. Despite being an unspeakable evil that wants to jerk us around and ruin our lives, God lets Satan roam free on Earth wreaking his havoc despite God being able to defeat Satan at any time with a simple click of his fingers.
11. Satan will finally be defeated (when God gets bored with the show), and then God [the Father] will make a New Heaven and a New Earth for eternity.

So, a couple of questions...

Why did God give posession of the world to Adam and Eve, two people whom God KNEW would mess it up?
Why has God let Satan torment us for the last few thousand years?

Without the "satan/devil" how else can we be tried and tested for the next 1 million generations to come?

Hey, how come JESUS says in one place we will be tried/tested and in another place He would keep up from "trial/testing"? Never noticed that before.

http://www.scripture4all.org/

Reve 2:10 Nothing be thou fearing! which-things thou are being about to be suffering/emotioning. Behold! Is being about to be casting out ye, the Devil, into a prison, that ye may be being tried/peirasqhte<3985> (5686).
And Ye shall be having tribulation of days, ten. Be thou becoming! faithful until death and I shall be giving to thee the crown of the life.

Reve 3:10 That you keep the Word of the endurance of Me, also I shall be keeping thee out of the hour of the trial/peirasmou <3986>, of the one-being-about to be coming upon of the habited-house/oikoumenhV <3625>, whole, to try/peirasai <3985> (5658) the ones down-homing/katoikountaVupon of the land.

 

[tanzanos]

Without the "satan/devil" how else can we be tried and tested for the next 1 million generations to come?

Hey, how come JESUS says in one place we will be tried/tested and in another place He would keep up from "trial/testing"? Never noticed that before.

http://www.scripture4all.org/

Reve 2:10 Nothing be thou fearing! which-things thou are being about to be suffering/emotioning. Behold! Is being about to be casting out ye, the Devil, into a prison, that ye may be being tried/peirasqhte<3985> (5686).
And Ye shall be having tribulation of days, ten. Be thou becoming! faithful until death and I shall be giving to thee the crown of the life.

Reve 3:10 That you keep the Word of the endurance of Me, also I shall be keeping thee out of the hour of the trial/peirasmou <3986>, of the one-being-about to be coming upon of the habited-house/oikoumenhV <3625>, whole, to try/peirasai <3985> (5658) the ones down-homing/katoikountaVupon of the land.

HA!
God created the devil as an archangel (Lucifer); he obviously knew beforehand that Lucifer will revolt against him. Yet he goes ahead with his plan.
God forbade Adam and Eve from eating from the tree of knowledge. Knowledge is BAD?
Yes it is if you are a dictator and want to control the masses. The more ignorant they are the more easily they can be controlled.
This whole OT affair was either written by people on hallucinogens or was written for purely political reasons in order to control the populace. Either way it is to be avoided at all cost.

The OT can seriously damage your psyche!
Keep away from children. Do not store it in places where minors may have contact with it. Should be avoided by adults also unless said adults are historians or researchers.

 

[TheBear]

http://christianforums.com/t6793820-the-big-kahuna.html

 

[MattTheAgnostic]

I create an apple ex nihilo into the palm of your hand.

What evidence would you use to convince your friend I did this?

You can't convince anyone of anything silly.

 

[arnoldedward]

Simple question, this is meant to be an anology of something, presumably that just because we have no proof of God making everything we cant say he didnt do. But in order for your analogy to work you need to have no evidence and as you said many times, the bible is evidence, so your analogy is either faulty or the bible is bullcrap.

A++

 

[RangerJoe]

I create an apple ex nihilo into the palm of your hand.

What evidence would you use to convince your friend I did this?

This is a pointless arguement because things don't work that way.

I see what your doing however. Your trying to say that since God created the world and we only have Christian's words to go by then that miraculously proves everything.

Unfortunately, everyone in history has lied at one time or another. So technically, no one is truthful and no one really can be held "to their word" as personal motivations will affect the truth. So I give this post a big F.

Much like your science/biology grade, I imagine.

 

[AV1611VET]

This is a pointless arguement because things don't work that way.

I see what your doing however. Your trying to say that since God created the world and we only have Christian's words to go by then that miraculously proves everything.

Unfortunately, everyone in history has lied at one time or another. So technically, no one is truthful and no one really can be held "to their word" as personal motivations will affect the truth. So I give this post a big F.

Much like your science/biology grade, I imagine.

Excuse me, newbie? Do you know me? You're not too big on first impressions, are you?

Would you like to maybe answer it while you're at it?

And your remark that "we only have Christian's words to go by" isn't true. We have written Documentation that applies to everyone; whether they're Christian or not.

 

[ReverendDG]

Excuse me, newbie? Do you know me? You're not too big on first impressions, are you?

Would you like to maybe answer it while you're at it?

And your remark that "we only have Christian's words to go by" isn't true. We have written Documentation that applies to everyone; whether they're Christian or not.

ORLY? how exactly can we verify that the documentation is true? using what we use for any other document, namely comparing it to other documents and evidence we find in the world shows your document(s) to be factually false.

so yes he is right, we only have christians words to go by.
faith is the only way the bible would possibly be considered evidence of anything, its right up there with the koran and the vega, and any other "holy" text

 

[AV1611VET]

ORLY? how exactly can we verify that the documentation is true? using what we use for any other document, namely comparing it to other documents and evidence we find in the world shows your document(s) to be factually false.

QV please.​

 

[RangerJoe]

Excuse me, newbie? Do you know me? You're not too big on first impressions, are you?

Would you like to maybe answer it while you're at it?

And your remark that "we only have Christian's words to go by" isn't true. We have written Documentation that applies to everyone; whether they're Christian or not.

First impressions are what -you- make of them. This is also hardly the first time I've seen your gibberish. Your a practical champion at another site I know of.

Answer it? There is no technical answer because it's a hypothetical question.

And your either a liar or just a bit slow on the uptake. Christians wrote the bible.....*drumroll*......So it's the Christian's word versus everyone else.

Almost every other religion says that their written text is the inspired word of god and is the absolute truth. You say yours is because your book says so and that it's inspired by god.

This person over here says that it's actually the book -they- have thats the unerring word of God. They also say your wrong and will suffer for it.

The sad part is??? Your both members of the same faith.

If you'd really like to have a solid debate about a subject then by all means feel free. But simply because I have less posts than you doesn't mean I'm a n00b...but merely that I talk less.

By the way...I have a piece of paper here with about 300 signatures on it, along with personal account that I actually created everything. I did it last week. Prove me wrong?

 

[Lord Emsworth]

QV please.​

I am I the only one who sees the myopia in a KJVOer when he appeals to the three different languages (Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek) of the Bible, or, to the (fundie) notion that it was written over a period of 1500 years?

[...]

• Over a period of 1500 years.
  [...]
• In three different languages.

[...]

(BTW, most of your claims in that post are false, or simply eyewash, anyway.)

 

[ReverendDG]

QV please.​

and this answers my question how?
you have no proof that the history in the bible is even true

2. You would have to have a nation rise to status of superpower as a result of following your documentation.

sorry but theres no evidence that anything about israel is true, theres no evidence that the kingdom of solomon existed as it was in the bible
there is lots of evidence that the israelites sprang from palestine, and just took over cities.

3. And now the sockdolager: you would have to write said nation's history in advance, and fulfill it with 100% accuracy.

theres more evidence in the bible that the history in the bible was written after the fact, during the exile to babylon to give the israelites national pride about their own history
theres too many anachronisms in the ot for it to be anything but a made up history
unless of course you can show me evidence of camels back then?

1. Conscript 40 authors to write independently of each other

really? its funny but i don't get that impression, there were different groups sure, but there is no evidence that they all worked independently of each other, some of the books show signs of multiple authors within the same text, some look haphazardly edited.
another thing i find funny is the bible's "history" reads like mythology, it leaves out historical evidence to make the hebrews look like heroes, and everyone else look like villains. tell me AV were are the egyptians at after the red sea? historic documents say they controlled that part of the world at the time josiah conquered palastine, where were they?

Over a period of 1500 years.

Buddhism is about that old if not older, and they had all prier documents

On three different continents.

so what, they didn't do at the same time it was over the 1500 years!

In three different languages.

over 1500 years

Under conditions of war, peace, rebellion, loyalty, invasion.

over 1500 years, its amazing to keep your identity that long, but 10 tribes lost it in the exile

Under different vocations, such as kings, fig pickers, priests.

over 1500 years, with the texts before them, only claiming this.
the nt wasn't written by anyone in israel, some of the authors didn't have a clue where anything was, they knew about israel, and that was it

 

[arnoldedward]

I feel sad, he left me out.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Excuse me, newbie? Do you know me? You're not too big on first impressions, are you?

He seems to have you pegged, AV. Don't act like it takes all that much time and/or effort to figure you out.

Now, just accept your F and /thread like you always inevitably do.

Would you like to maybe answer it while you're at it?

He knows it's a meaningless question -- give the "newbie" credit for being a quick study.

And your remark that "we only have Christian's words to go by" isn't true. We have written Documentation that applies to everyone; whether they're Christian or not.

I'd love to see this documentation -- I hope it's more universally convincing than the Bible.