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The Restitution Of All Things A.K.A. Universalism
- Thread starter FineLinen
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My dear Hugs: getting glasses for the first time in 76 years upsets me LOL. Posting to a dog with a fancy sweater makes me cry, and news that some of my dearest friends are suffering nasty diseases makes me weep and pray! Outside of that, nothing is capable of blurring a vision of the Master who does all things well.
I know a few people in remote areas of our globe who see clearly what we see! Numbers matter zilch. The "little flock" prevails!
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needhugs
Flibbertyjibbet
HEY!!!!! doggies are going to be with us in heaven and you can't come over for tea if you don't love my dog lol
why did you put the "little flock" in quotation marks? who are you quoting?
is this really the narrow path that few find in this lifetime?
i have Christian friends... shouldn't i be upset for them? or are we just to assume they are all like Mark and don't WANT the truth?
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My dear Hugs: worry not about your Christian friends! Worry about nothing! The path is indeed narrow, a small group of 12 chosen ones selected by the Master of glory were so bewildered at times, BUT the Holy Ghost fell on them after the Risen Christ visited them in Pentecost. Wonderful things happen to bewildered saints when the Living Life appears, wonderful things indeed!
As for your fancy dog, I love the little rascal. She is the only animal that has managed to appear on this glorious theme of our Father's cherished purpose in Christ Jesus.
P.S. The "little flock" I believe are mentioned in the Revelation.
https://www.biblestudytools.com/luke/12-32-compare.html
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needhugs
Flibbertyjibbet
I'M BEWILDERED... i was just asking martin about souls being shown to be alive after death, and this guy answered and said basically that Revelation is a false book... have you EVER heard the like??? oh and PS... puppy loves you back, but then again, she loves everybody lolol
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There is no book in Canon that has caused more confusion among saints and sinners. F.L. believes we need an unction to grasp the fullness of what the Spirit is saying to the Churches. If you want absolute confusion among churchianity try St. Matthew 25 & the parable of the sheep & goats. You do know that both are clean animals, not one clean and another unclean: both clean!
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needhugs
Flibbertyjibbet
let me politely decline your kind offer of MORE CONFUSION hahaha
i'm hesitant to believe ANYTHING churchianity tells me!!! all their hellish doctrines have... well... PUT ME THRU HELL!!!!
GRRRR, i'm in a tizzy. i'm going to get a concordant version and that new testament translation that Clement suggested and read them cover to cover!!! no more traditions of men!!!!
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Go for it! The Concordant is good and so is our friend Clement.
“When a man or woman is truly honest (not just working at it) it is virtually impossible to insult them personally. There is nothing there to insult. Those who were truly ready for the kingdom were just such people. Their inner poverty of spirit and rigorous honesty had set them free. They were people who had nothing to be proud of.”
― Brennan Manning, The Ragamuffin Gospel: Good News for the Bedraggled, Beat-Up, and Burnt Out
“Our huffing and puffing to impress God, our scrambling for brownie points, our thrashing about trying to fix ourselves while hiding our pettiness and wallowing in guilt are nauseating to God and are a flat denial of the gospel of grace. Our approach to the Christian life is as absurd as the enthusiastic young man who had just received his plumber’s license and was taken to see Niagara Falls. He studied it for a minute and then said, “I think I can fix this. " ― Brennan Manning,
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needhugs
Flibbertyjibbet
do you want to hear something funny? lol i'm getting called on 'rounding numbers'... my husband is very cheap, and when i buy something, let's say it was $25... i will round it down to say 'oh about 20 bucks' lol... now i have TOLD my husband that i do this, so it's not like i'm getting away with a lie... he knows, it's just that the temptation to round the numbers in my favour is too great, even tho i know that he knows that i'm rounding them, coz I TOLD HIM lol so there must be some sort of issue there, that God wants to deal with, since i can't stop doing it haha
on the other hand, i have nothing to be proud of, so that's good right? hahaha
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You inform Mr. Cheap to cut you a little slack, this rounding of numbers must stop. Why must the rounding be in Hugs favour? Why not round up in his favour?
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“The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death” (1 Cor.- 15:26). One of the thoughts that gripped me that day in 1940, and held me almost spellbound in the half-opened door, was this: According to the Bible the first death would be all past for the church at the time of the second coming of Christ, and later it would be all past for the wicked and lost. The only death left will be the second death. Will the second death be destroyed, also? Or will it be the means through which death itself will be abolished (Heb.2:14,15)?
Many people do very careless thinking about death and its conquest. The writer used to believe, as many folks do, that death would be destroyed as soon as the act of dying stopped. How partial a viewpoint that is.
This entire present earthly scene is under the condemnation of death. Even our scientific definition of life confesses it: “Life is the sum total of the forces that oppose death,” it says. And everyone knows that life here and now can oppose death for only a brief time at best. “The path of glory leads but to the grave.”
One bad apple
In one of his books, Glenn Clark discusses the problem of why a rotten apple in a barrel of good ones will spoil the whole lot, but a good apple in a barrel of rotten ones is powerless to make the rotten ones sound. He says that the good apple has the stroke of death in it. When the stem was severed from the tree its source of life and health and growth was removed. Even a good apple is a dying thing.
He should have added that death was hovering near the apple while its stem was still fast to the tree. Just let the wind swing the apple against a limb near at hand and break the skin, immediately rot sets in. Let a bird pick a hole in it, or a worm enter its body, at once the forces of decay and death have gained an entrance, and the end is putrefaction. “In the midst of life we are in death.”
The first warning against disobedience, according to the Bible, is “In the day thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.” The words “thou shalt surely die,” are often translated “dying thou shalt die,” or “thou art dying to die.” That is, “dying” is a process, and “to die” is the final act or event in the process. When Adam sinned, it was life and vitality that he lost; it was death and dissolution that he received. The word “death” means vastly more than the act or event of dying; it means not only the state into which one passes in the act of dying but also the condition which makes such an event and such a state possible.
Death
For death is not only a condition or state which affects the physical body; it is primarily the state or condition of the spiritual life in which unregenerate men now live. Until men are made alive in Christ they are “dead in trespasses and sins,” here and now. It will be the condition or state of the lost “in the ages to come,” “having no hope, and without God in the world.” Anyone apart from God in Christ is “dead,” whether in this life, or in any other. “He that hath the Son hath life, and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life” (1 John 5:12). Physical (i.e., literal) death is only one of the results of a previous spiritual “death.” When Adam sinned, fellowship was broken between himself and God, “in Whom we live, and move, and have our being” (Acts 17:28). It was not merely his physical demise after 930 years that constituted his death, but his separation from God on the very day he sinned was the inner reality of his death. That separation with its fear, its alienation from God’s love and care and intimate fellowship, is the real death that is to be destroyed (Luke 15:24,32; Rom.-8:6,7; Eph.2:15; Col.2:13).
How Silly
How silly it is to teach, then, as the writer used to do, that when the act of dying is ended, death would be destroyed! He locked up the vast majority of mankind in eternal torment, blind to the fact that he was just holding them in death forever. In the economic realm, we use the term “freezing” to signify static continuance in financial immobility. So did the writer “freeze” the great majority of men in the death of eternal fire!
And when he changed his thinking, in order to get rid of such an awful God as eternal torment pictures, and accepted extermination, he did no better–so far as destroying death is concerned. If death is the absence of life–and that must be true of anything that ever had life and later on lost it–then extermination is only another method of decreeing eternal death on the vast majority of mankind. In the case of either “eternal torment” or “extermination,” death would reign forever!
Death Will Be Destroyed
Death will be destroyed by putting life in its place. That nullifies the objection made by many that the teaching of Reconciliation destroys the hope of everlasting life. They say that Jesus’ words in Matthew 25:46 make punishment and future life the same length: “And these [the wicked] shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal.” If the punishment of the wicked is only age-lasting, not everlasting, then the reward of the righteous is also age-lasting, and not everlasting. This is their argument, and so far as the above quotation is concerned they are correct. Now the promise of “eonian life” is a marvelous provision. It is the proclamation to all who believe, of the privilege of living in Christ in this present life, and living with Christ, reigning with Christ, and being like Christ, “in the ages to come” (Eph.2:7). During those eons when He is bringing the entire universe into harmony with God, the church will share with Christ in all that glorious activity. But the assurance of unending life is not in this offer, wonderful as it is. For the eons will end! Rather, the assurance of unending life lies in the promise that we shall be made immortal when Christ calls us into that fellowship of service with Himself. Our alienation and separation from God are already ended in this life, through Christ. But it is not until His second coming that immortality is conferred, through change for living saints, and through resurrection for dead saints. Immortality is life over which death has no power. So it embodies unlimited life.
Death Replaced With Life
The only way that death will ever be destroyed is to replace it with life. The only way to get rid of darkness is to obliterate it with light. The only way to get rid of error is to supplant it with truth. The only way to get rid of sorrow is to submerge it in joy. So, some glad day, “Death will be swallowed up in victory” (1 Cor.15:54)! And God will do this by destroying, for every being in the universe, all alienation and separation from God. But that can take place only when the Lord of life has proven Himself Lord over death! Not till then will the Son “deliver up the kingdom to God, even the Father.” When that joyous day comes, men will answer their own questions, “O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?” (1 Cor.15:55) by the triumphant shout, “Thanks be to God Who giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ” (1 Cor.15:57). “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ, shall all be made alive” (1 Cor.15:22).
By Dr. Loyal Hurley
Many people do very careless thinking about death and its conquest. The writer used to believe, as many folks do, that death would be destroyed as soon as the act of dying stopped. How partial a viewpoint that is.
This entire present earthly scene is under the condemnation of death. Even our scientific definition of life confesses it: “Life is the sum total of the forces that oppose death,” it says. And everyone knows that life here and now can oppose death for only a brief time at best. “The path of glory leads but to the grave.”
One bad apple
In one of his books, Glenn Clark discusses the problem of why a rotten apple in a barrel of good ones will spoil the whole lot, but a good apple in a barrel of rotten ones is powerless to make the rotten ones sound. He says that the good apple has the stroke of death in it. When the stem was severed from the tree its source of life and health and growth was removed. Even a good apple is a dying thing.
He should have added that death was hovering near the apple while its stem was still fast to the tree. Just let the wind swing the apple against a limb near at hand and break the skin, immediately rot sets in. Let a bird pick a hole in it, or a worm enter its body, at once the forces of decay and death have gained an entrance, and the end is putrefaction. “In the midst of life we are in death.”
The first warning against disobedience, according to the Bible, is “In the day thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.” The words “thou shalt surely die,” are often translated “dying thou shalt die,” or “thou art dying to die.” That is, “dying” is a process, and “to die” is the final act or event in the process. When Adam sinned, it was life and vitality that he lost; it was death and dissolution that he received. The word “death” means vastly more than the act or event of dying; it means not only the state into which one passes in the act of dying but also the condition which makes such an event and such a state possible.
Death
For death is not only a condition or state which affects the physical body; it is primarily the state or condition of the spiritual life in which unregenerate men now live. Until men are made alive in Christ they are “dead in trespasses and sins,” here and now. It will be the condition or state of the lost “in the ages to come,” “having no hope, and without God in the world.” Anyone apart from God in Christ is “dead,” whether in this life, or in any other. “He that hath the Son hath life, and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life” (1 John 5:12). Physical (i.e., literal) death is only one of the results of a previous spiritual “death.” When Adam sinned, fellowship was broken between himself and God, “in Whom we live, and move, and have our being” (Acts 17:28). It was not merely his physical demise after 930 years that constituted his death, but his separation from God on the very day he sinned was the inner reality of his death. That separation with its fear, its alienation from God’s love and care and intimate fellowship, is the real death that is to be destroyed (Luke 15:24,32; Rom.-8:6,7; Eph.2:15; Col.2:13).
How Silly
How silly it is to teach, then, as the writer used to do, that when the act of dying is ended, death would be destroyed! He locked up the vast majority of mankind in eternal torment, blind to the fact that he was just holding them in death forever. In the economic realm, we use the term “freezing” to signify static continuance in financial immobility. So did the writer “freeze” the great majority of men in the death of eternal fire!
And when he changed his thinking, in order to get rid of such an awful God as eternal torment pictures, and accepted extermination, he did no better–so far as destroying death is concerned. If death is the absence of life–and that must be true of anything that ever had life and later on lost it–then extermination is only another method of decreeing eternal death on the vast majority of mankind. In the case of either “eternal torment” or “extermination,” death would reign forever!
Death Will Be Destroyed
Death will be destroyed by putting life in its place. That nullifies the objection made by many that the teaching of Reconciliation destroys the hope of everlasting life. They say that Jesus’ words in Matthew 25:46 make punishment and future life the same length: “And these [the wicked] shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal.” If the punishment of the wicked is only age-lasting, not everlasting, then the reward of the righteous is also age-lasting, and not everlasting. This is their argument, and so far as the above quotation is concerned they are correct. Now the promise of “eonian life” is a marvelous provision. It is the proclamation to all who believe, of the privilege of living in Christ in this present life, and living with Christ, reigning with Christ, and being like Christ, “in the ages to come” (Eph.2:7). During those eons when He is bringing the entire universe into harmony with God, the church will share with Christ in all that glorious activity. But the assurance of unending life is not in this offer, wonderful as it is. For the eons will end! Rather, the assurance of unending life lies in the promise that we shall be made immortal when Christ calls us into that fellowship of service with Himself. Our alienation and separation from God are already ended in this life, through Christ. But it is not until His second coming that immortality is conferred, through change for living saints, and through resurrection for dead saints. Immortality is life over which death has no power. So it embodies unlimited life.
Death Replaced With Life
The only way that death will ever be destroyed is to replace it with life. The only way to get rid of darkness is to obliterate it with light. The only way to get rid of error is to supplant it with truth. The only way to get rid of sorrow is to submerge it in joy. So, some glad day, “Death will be swallowed up in victory” (1 Cor.15:54)! And God will do this by destroying, for every being in the universe, all alienation and separation from God. But that can take place only when the Lord of life has proven Himself Lord over death! Not till then will the Son “deliver up the kingdom to God, even the Father.” When that joyous day comes, men will answer their own questions, “O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?” (1 Cor.15:55) by the triumphant shout, “Thanks be to God Who giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ” (1 Cor.15:57). “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ, shall all be made alive” (1 Cor.15:22).
By Dr. Loyal Hurley
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- Jul 10, 2016
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This is from a recent post on the forum here:
Checkout the orthodox universalism majority in the early church (and a hope for universalism majority in the present day church):
https://www.christianforums.com/thr...niversalism-since-early-church-times.8042013/
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unfund...017/04/indeed-many-universalism-early-church/
If you think the Bible & the early church & the modern church are all wrong, you will have to prove it.
If you think Love Omnipotent's love is finite & expires like a carton of milk so He can torture most of His creatures called human beings in fire with immortal worms eating them for all the endless trillions X trillions X trillions of eons, forever and ever and ever, you will have to prove it.
https://forum.evangelicaluniversalist.com/t/universalism-is-the-new-christian-orthodoxy/6153
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https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/sickening
While we consider this vile/ loathsome dogma of twisted minds and Scriptures, jump up a couple of posts and let us sing together Oh love of God.
While we consider this vile/ loathsome dogma of twisted minds and Scriptures, jump up a couple of posts and let us sing together Oh love of God.
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God is love
These are the things of God through Christ
Love worketh no evil
Love thinketh no evil
Love suffereth long
Love is kind
Love envieth not
Love vaunteth not itself
Love is not puffed up
Love does not behave unseemly
Love seeketh not her own
Love is not easily provoked
Love thinketh no evil
Love rejoices NOT in iniquity
Love rejoices in the truth
Love beareth all things
Love believeth all things
Love hopeth all things
Love endureth all things
Love never faileth
God is Spirit
These things are of God through Christ
The FRUIT of the Spirit is love
The FRUIT of the Spirit is joy
The FRUIT of the Spirit is peace
The FRUIT of the Spirit longsuffering
The FRUIT of the Spirit is gentleness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is goodness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is faith
The FRUIT of the Spirit is meekness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is temperance
Can anyone really believe all this and still hold to the view that God who is agape love will eternally torment even one of His creation or annihilate even one of His creation.
He that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out does not have an expiration date.
These are the things of God through Christ
Love worketh no evil
Love thinketh no evil
Love suffereth long
Love is kind
Love envieth not
Love vaunteth not itself
Love is not puffed up
Love does not behave unseemly
Love seeketh not her own
Love is not easily provoked
Love thinketh no evil
Love rejoices NOT in iniquity
Love rejoices in the truth
Love beareth all things
Love believeth all things
Love hopeth all things
Love endureth all things
Love never faileth
God is Spirit
These things are of God through Christ
The FRUIT of the Spirit is love
The FRUIT of the Spirit is joy
The FRUIT of the Spirit is peace
The FRUIT of the Spirit longsuffering
The FRUIT of the Spirit is gentleness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is goodness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is faith
The FRUIT of the Spirit is meekness
The FRUIT of the Spirit is temperance
Can anyone really believe all this and still hold to the view that God who is agape love will eternally torment even one of His creation or annihilate even one of His creation.
He that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out does not have an expiration date.
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My brother Pneuma: The Scapegoat has a ring of Glory to Him. In fact, He is clothed in glory and is leading the entire wretched & broken wrecks of Adam 1 home to Abba. May His great consuming glory break more fully upon all of us!
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