The human conscience is sovereign, so to speak, so far be it from me to tell you what to think. Everyone can interpret revelation as they see fit. But we're discussing different modes of understanding the faith here and of course most of us would prefer a unity in Christian beliefs, even as some doctrines are more important than others. And I'm hearing objections to the concept of infallibility while some posters such as yourself effectively depend on one of the same mechanisms for knowing the truth as that doctrine claims-that God has led you to it. I'm basically defending the RCC position, as you're defending yours.What do i care what others think? You believe that Jesus changes bread into human flesh that you can eat. I dressage but do you care?
Thats wrong. Just because someone isnt catholic doesnt mean they belong to the same church. With respect, get real.No, I am lumping Protestants together based on their aversion to tradition, their Sola Scriptura, and their overwhelming divisions. There are lots of non-Catholics who are not Protestants. Please read more carefully.
Thats wrong. Just because someone isnt catholic doesnt mean they belong to the same church. With respect, get real.
One group didnt split 30,000 times though. Thats false.Sorry to burst your bubble, but when one group stays together and another group splits 30,000 times, the first group possesses more unity than the second.
I never said all non-Catholics belong to the same church; that is a silly red herring. Given your apparent inability to comprehend simple arguments this may well be my last post to you.
One group didnt split 30,000 times though. Thats false.
They didnt split from one group.How many Protestant denominations do you think there are? Estimates differ, but the point I was making holds with each different estimate.
My point was that the argument you are using is a Catholic myth at best and probably should be recognized as a trick with numbers as well.My comparison is not arbitrary, it is based on self-identification. Those who self-identify as Catholics are relatively united; those who self-identify as Protestants are relatively divided. My argument certainly falls to pieces if Catholics are Protestants. Luckily that is an absurdly false idea.
So what? These are different churches with different histories. There is no validity to talking as though they are branches of schisms of the same denomination.How many Protestant denominations do you think there are? Estimates differ, but the point I was making holds with each different estimate.
Be aware that the study you are referring to which listed 30,000 (or whatever) number of denominations also listed approximately 300 different Roman Catholic Churches! That's not 300 different Catholic-type denominations or different rites within the Church, but 300 or so separate Roman Catholic Churches. That is not unity such as you have been claiming.
The fact that it lists 300 separate "Catholic" denominations should be raising a whole parade of red flags for you. Rather than trying to continue to make hay, you should be questioning their whack statistics. ALL of them.300 vs. 30,000? Sure it is. That is 100x more unity.
The fact that it lists 300 separate "Catholic" denominations should be raising a whole parade of red flags for you. Rather than trying to continue to make hay, you should be questioning their whack statistics. ALL of them.
No, I'm claiming it's evidence that they're using bad statistical methodology, which renders ALL their findings suspect.Lol, no, the point is that no one seems to be following the argument. All I have been offered are red herrings, and the fact that I have made my case abundantly clear seems to indicate that folks just don't want to understand the argument.
There are various different sources that arrive at ~30,000 Protestant denominations, and no one thinks that things like the World Christian Encyclopedia are inherently unreliable. If their criteria yields 300 Catholic denominations my point still holds just fine, unless you are claiming that 300 and 30,000 are pretty much the same?
No, I'm claiming it's evidence that they're using bad statistical methodology, which renders ALL their findings suspect.
Well, you are still comparing ONE DENOMINATION to thousands of others, so of course the figures are not going to be equal.300 vs. 30,000? Sure it is. That is 100x more unity.
300 divisions seems like an awful lot.Well, you are still comparing ONE DENOMINATION to thousands of others, so of course the figures are not going to be equal.
But I do not see 300 different and competing Roman Catholic Church jurisdictions as representing "Unity," and I have to wonder about an argument that says it does or that there even is such a thing as "more unity." "More unity" is an oxymoron, literally meaning "not united."
and I have to wonder about an argument that says it does or that there even is such a thing as "more unity." "More unity" is an oxymoron, literally meaning "not united."
Kinda like being a little pregnant or a lot pregnant, I suppose. But even if we were to accept your premise that to be sorta united means to be actually united, it is evident from the sources you yourself chose to use to prove it that this isn't the case with Catholicism. There are, by the way, all sorts of Protestant denominations that are not split into 300 different varieties.No, there is more unity and less unity.
Kinda like being a little pregnant or a lot pregnant, I suppose. But even if we were to accept your premise that to be sorta united means to be actually united, it is evident from the sources you yourself chose to use to prove it that this isn't the case with Catholicism. There are, by the way, all sorts of Protestant denominations that are not split into 300 different varieties.
And that is not something shameful; it is just what the findings of the research that you used to make your case showed.
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