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Hey, you too!It has been asserted that Jesus brings division. Enjoy your gift of division
Nor is Jesus teaching that the division he brings is based upon the baptism of the Holy Spirit. But do tell me which baptism it is that He is talking about in scripture?Jesus separates unbelievers from believers. That scripture is not saying Jesus causes the divisions in church.
Again, Jesus is talking about Israel, he was referring to dividing those who believe in Him from those who dont. This verse has nothing to do with dividing the Church. He knew many Jews would not believe in Him, thats what he means by causing division. THIS IS NOT TALKING ABOUT DIVIDING THE CHURCH HOWEVER.Nor is Jesus teaching that the division he brings is based upon the baptism of the Holy Spirit. But do tell me which baptism it is that He is talking about in scripture?
LUK 12:50 I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how I am constrained until it is accomplished! 51 Do you think that I have come to give peace on earth? No, I tell you, but rather division; 52 for henceforth in one house there will be five divided, three against two and two against three;
Wow! Jesus made a "prediction," eh? Is that all it was? You make Him sound like a cheap New Age psychic.
Mark 16---"And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new languages; they will pick up snakes; if they should drink anything deadly, it will never harm them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will get well.”
The PROPHECY of the Lord Jesus Christ was fulfilled in the 1st century, and it's still being fulfilled today for "those who believe"! Thank God!!!!!
We who deny that the WoF is teaching from the scriptures proper theology, and that the Spirit is NOT with them in their heresies, are NOT denying the Holy Spirit, and we do indeed see many of the gifts still in operation, but some limited to just the Apostles of Christ!What has changed in this whole thread? The Holy Spirt gift deniers are still denying, and those of us enjoying ALL of the gifts of the Spirit will continue to enjoy them!
hard to take theology from that passage, as iys in the disputed longer ending of Mark, and that account reads more like looking back at what once happened with those Apostles!Wow! Jesus made a "prediction," eh? Is that all it was? You make Him sound like a cheap New Age psychic.
Mark 16---"And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new languages; they will pick up snakes; if they should drink anything deadly, it will never harm them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will get well.”
The PROPHECY of the Lord Jesus Christ was fulfilled in the 1st century, and it's still being fulfilled today for "those who believe"! Thank God!!!!!
Jesus referred to even in ones own family, there shall be saved and lost, so the division will come about due to how one views Him! Paul commands us to seek to keep the unity of the Spirit within the Body of Christ, not to pray for division!Again, Jesus is talking about Israel, he was referring to dividing those who believe in Him from those who dont. This verse has nothing to do with dividing the Church. He knew many Jews would not believe in Him, thats what he means by causing division. THIS IS NOT TALKING ABOUT DIVIDING THE CHURCH HOWEVER.
These other posters seem to believe that division in church is a good thing, but that's not what i read from the apostle Paul's words.Jesus referred to even in ones own family, there shall be saved and lost, so the division will come about due to how one views Him! Paul commands us to seek to keep the unity of the Spirit within the Body of Christ, not to pray for division!
The part of the Charismatic Movement that has really caused division and problems have been mainly the WoF/Health and wealth/prosperity churches, as they have claimed additional revelations and claim to be speaking for God directly! The main stream Charismatics are wrong in much of their theology, but it does not rise to the outright heresy within those other groups!Cessationism has been the predominant position of the church since the time of the church fathers, immediately after the apostolic age. The church wasn't split on the issue of cessationism until the Pentecostal/charismatic movement started at the beginning of the 20th century and wrongly claimed that the 'sign gifts' had been restored. Since then it has split the church right down the middle. In my area there have been a number of churches that have literally been torn apart thanks to infiltration by the charismatic movement.
They seem to believe that we are the ones causing it to happen, due to us being spiritually ignorant, as we are denying the WoF teachers are teaching correct doctrines and practices, as we are to them modern day Pharisees denying the Holy Spirit!These other posters seem to believe that division in church is a good thing, but that's not what i read from the apostle Paul's words.
You never answered the only question I asked. What baptism is Jesus talking about which causes division?Again, Jesus is talking about Israel, he was referring to dividing those who believe in Him from those who dont. This verse has nothing to do with dividing the Church. He knew many Jews would not believe in Him, thats what he means by causing division. THIS IS NOT TALKING ABOUT DIVIDING THE CHURCH HOWEVER.
It's not disputed in my Bible!hard to take theology from that passage, as iys in the disputed longer ending of Mark, and that account reads more like looking back at what once happened with those Apostles!
its not the baptism, its Him! How one responds to Him will be the cause of any division!You never answered the only question I asked. What baptism is Jesus talking about which causes division?
I have noted the division among the churches who claim to have the gifts of teaching. Why are they all teaching different doctrines if they have the gift of teaching?They seem to believe that we are the ones causing it to happen, due to us being spiritually ignorant, as we are denying the WoF teachers are teaching correct doctrines and practices, as we are to them modern day Pharisees denying the Holy Spirit!
Isn’t it funny how it’s the fallible ‘infallible Bible’ when it’s convenient for them to continue to argue for doctrinal divisiveness ?It's not disputed in my Bible!
At least i keep things real. Im not living in a fantasy.Isn’t it funny how it’s the fallible ‘infallible Bible’ when it’s convenient for them to continue to argue for doctrinal divisiveness ?
Oh consistency, what a jewel thou are, to be found
In the doctrinally splintered church of today.
If I ask a question it is because it does matter. Just because it doesn't matter to you makes me feel you just fear something you believe being brought to the light IMO. As I said before, I just waste my time with you. I'd do better trying to nail snot to a fence post than trying to get you to nail down BIBLICALLY what you believe. byeIt doesnt matter really, because Jesus never said he would bring division to the church. The division He speaks of refers to Israel who rejected the Lord.
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