The New Revised Bibles, Fines, Prison and Closed Megachurches...?

[Targaryen]

when you speak about bigotry and hatred in the name of Christ, gee I wonder why?

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

when you speak about bigotry and hatred in the name of Christ, gee I wonder why?

This practice of calling people bigots and haters is becoming a known issue, an error and injustice. You do not know whether or not I am a bigot... you are judging in error. Please stop side tracking this thread. I know since the sixties in worldly culture lovers have been very popular and it is a sin that seems to cause no pain... but Jesus sees more and will have to judge in the end who can enter the light of life.

 

[Targaryen]

If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality.
-Archbishop Desmond Tutu

Sorry your attempt to spin yourself into a truly godly party doesn't fly with me.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality.
-Archbishop Desmond Tutu

Sorry your attempt to spin yourself into a truly godly party doesn't fly with me.

We have little choice in these situations. Prepare for them. And Jesus commanded us not to judge others. Romans 1-2 mentions salvation by faith from start to finish. And idolatry which is greed, and Roman style sin, also homosexuality, then not to judge them, for the judges are doing the same things.

From the Gospel getting married is the lesser good things to do, over dedicating your life to Jesus works. And it is a folly that people will be given and taken in marriage right up to the end as it was in the days of Noah. Looking ahead is foresight and is part of wisdom, the principal thing. I think this thread should be moved to Preppers.

Democracy really matters at a civil level, the most. Freedom of speech to centuries to gain, and is very important, must not to be lost. These are real justice matters. When it comes to minorities, the governors should be able to give them their needs and keep in the framework of democracy and free speech... meeting both parties needs. Like a two way street.

 

[Targaryen]

And those that wish to live a godly,sober Christian life in holy matrimony with their partner, just cause it might be of the same sex is sin, but this "neutral" condemnation isn't injustice or is Christian love.

Nope, sorry. You can try to couch it again and again in language that makes you seem more tolerant, but your OP basically said where you true intent lies.

Matthew 7:

15 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
16 You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles?
17 In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus you will know them by their fruits.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

And those that wish to live a godly,sober Christian life in holy matrimony with their partner, just cause it might be of the same sex is sin, but this "neutral" condemnation isn't injustice or is Christian love.

Nope, sorry. You can try to couch it again and again in language that makes you seem more tolerant, but your OP basically said where you true intent lies.

Matthew 7:

15 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
16 You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles?
17 In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus you will know them by their fruits.

Which prophet did I quote?

 

[Targaryen]

If you can't see that this passage can refer to anyone that promotes a message, then that's up to you.

 

[seashale76]

Getting back to my OP, the church has struggles in places like China and India, but what about us westerners, what do we do if there is persecution? Jesus said there would be and Peter also. "The time is coming when they will not tolerate sound doctrine."

Well then. I think America was doomed from the get go. They made up their own well enough, didn't they.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Well then. I think America was doomed from the get go. They made up their own well enough, didn't they.

Smart Alex style comment, the real question is, what are you protesting to?

The prophecies about end times are often of great hardship. Don't want to think about it?

When Jesus returns, it will have to battle the world's armies first.

I am not exactly sure which people will not tolerate sound doctrine, be it the west and or BRICKS?

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I have no doubt that homosexuals are aware that most of the rest of the world is not approving of their behavior.

Christians should be able to do better than simply reaffirming that.

I did not want to address them here.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

As with all things, there is some truth in it.

In the sense that Jesus doesn't condemn the homosexual anymore than He condemns the man who speaks a single idle word without a repentant heart. Anyone who speaks otherwise, is an abomination.

But .... The Bible also says that you should agree with your enemy quickly when you are in the way with him, unless he deliver you up to the court.

So that being said ... you don't have to SAY that being gay is good. If asked the question, you can answer, "I believe that my Lord Jesus is able and willing to forgive ALL sin." and leave it at that.

And keep in mind, preachers, that "The Gospel Truth" is not that gay people are going to hell. "The Gospel Truth" is that God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that the world might be saved through Him.

Preach and show the love of Jesus, and no prison will find you, at least for now.

yeah, it was not my intention to condemn anyone. I am persuaded by testimonies of homosexuals Near Death Experiences, and the meeting grand parents there and the seeing the light experience. But also ordinary lovers get warned in NDEs of a great danger. Like one English girl, who came through with a warning and a hope.

 

[Targaryen]

Smart Alex style comment, the real question is, what are you protesting to?

The prophecies about end times are often of great hardship. Don't want to think about it?

When Jesus returns, it will have to battle the world's armies first.

I am not exactly sure which people will not tolerate sound doctrine, be it the west and or BRICKS?

First of all it's Smart Alec, Alec.

Second of all, you do know these "prophecies" have always been proven wrong, time in and time out. Go read Paul's warning in 2 Thess 2:1-4

Thridly and finally, you don't have sound doctrine. You have fear, lies and hatred. That's not Christian.

 

[The Brown Brink]

I suggest the hypothesis of a Canada in which any Pastor, priest or professor suggesting Jesus would in the end condemn unrepentant fornicators, lovers, homosexuals and lesbians... was fined or imprisoned or fired leading to the closure of megachurches, churches, Bible colleges and missions. Further that the Bible without censure or omissions was banned. Christian activity in public would be limited and only in secret would true preaching take place. Christians especially pastors would lose their property in fines.

Christian businesses would close or compromise. Children would sometimes turn their parents into the authorities for true teaching, and be considered brave.

The result could be a great fall of preachers from pulpits to streets to prisons or to go abroad and some on missions considered illegal. Some listeners to preachings would be touched by the Holy Spirit and be unable but to confess their sins as witnesses to the reality of an unchanging Christ and immediately be fined.

If this happened and we were there, would you compromise, or be firm? Would another Jesus definition be good or okay? Could it still be church? Would it be worth going on a new Jesus for Africa mission? Would you worship new Jesus? Would you go to prison for the original revelation? What would one do if one still needed to overcome sins and be set free? Could you endure a homeless winter?

Where I come from, we could do with less preachers.

Around here, anyone can be a preacher.

Around here, all you have to do to be a preacher is memorize a few of the most hellish quotes in the Bible, and you'll get a following...

Yeah...
Around here, we could do with less preachers...

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

First of all it's Smart Alec, Alec.

Second of all, you do know these "prophecies" have always been proven wrong, time in and time out. Go read Paul's warning in 2 Thess 2:1-4

Thridly and finally, you don't have sound doctrine. You have fear, lies and hatred. That's not Christian.

Targaryen, you do not recall they are NT prophecies?

I hope your prophecies about my motives are proven wrong.

2Ti 4:1 I do fully testify, then, before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who is about to judge living and dead at his manifestation and his reign—
2Ti 4:2 preach the word; be earnest in season, out of season, convict, rebuke, exhort, in all long-suffering and teaching,
2Ti 4:3 for there shall be a season when the sound teaching they will not suffer, but according to their own desires to themselves they shall heap up teachers—itching in the hearing,
2Ti 4:4 and indeed, from the truth the hearing they shall turn away, and to the fables they shall be turned aside. YLT

Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, having been gathered together to make war with him who is sitting upon the horse, and with his army; YLT

Rev 21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
Rev 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. KJV

The Bible wording makes it look so hard for us to obtain eternal life, but I think this is misleading by error of the interpreter. God is merciful and loving, and many people see the light in their near death experiences.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Where I come from, we could do with less preachers.

Around here, anyone can be a preacher.

Around here, all you have to do to be a preacher is memorize a few of the most hellish quotes in the Bible, and you'll get a following...

Yeah...
Around here, we could do with less preachers...

Sorry about that Brown Brink. I do not know where you are. Fire and brimstone preaching is a thing of the past around here. Fear of God's goodness and judgement can make a person reverence God and learn wisdom. But not all are committed to God for reverence, others are won by His wonderful love. Others maybe by His wisdom and the wisdom of preaching. Some find Genesis to be for them the true basis. Some learn a commitment from their parents.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Jesus in Matthew's Gospel lists some unclean things in an order that appears to be from most harmful to least.

Mat 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: KJV

We are commanded by God and called to, as if, go on a journey to a perfect world and we need spend fifteen years in a capsule one fifth the size of an ocean cruiser together with twenty people and get on perfectly all that time. We cannot hurt each other, offend each other, judge by looks, judge each other, hate, get angry, cut, or in any way harm another person. This analogy means Heaven needs us to have the potential of perfection in our hearts, the Spirit of Christ.

Jesus' sacred blood can change us, move us to forgive, open our heart to receive Christ, edify us, clean us, heal wounds of the spirit, return pay us for the sins of those who offended us...! It is for all sinners, mine, and others, anyone. In Jesus' blood there is warmth, the compatible and no fear.

Rom 13:8 Let love be your only debt! If you love others, you have done all that the Law demands.
Rom 13:9 In the Law there are many commands, such as, "Be faithful in marriage. Do not murder. Do not steal. Do not want what belongs to others." But all of these are summed up in the command that says, "Love others as much as you love yourself."
Rom 13:10 No one who loves others will harm them. So love is all that the Law demands. CEV

As I see it, Lucifer as he fell grouped help for his cause, and they went from loving God to lusting after His wealth of power... They sought to use God's providence to overcome God. To make God lie, break His word and then make Him do as He is told and control Him more and more until He was no longer Himself or normally conscious, making Lucifer god. This is death in regards to God. So They were thrown out and eventually put in a place where there is no light, knowledge or water, none of the powers or pleasures of Heaven they abused and they were cut off from God. Also in God's anger fire was established there, it is Hell.

We only go to Hell if we use the good to do harm. If we seek to hurt another of have such a manner that hurts others. In the west in this age of lovers after the sexual revolution, people find that hard to accept. Fornicating is not so bad. Moses commanded:
Exo 22:16 Suppose a young woman has never been married and isn't engaged. If a man talks her into having sex, he must pay the bride price and marry her.
Exo 22:17 But if her father refuses to let her marry the man, the bride price must still be paid. CEV

I believe in Jesus, that He is good, all good, and can punish as above. He revised Moses law, which was right but without grace and had errors Jesus corrected. Moses was lax on divorce and hard on sinners. No one could obey it. We are instead saved by faith in Jesus and His grace, partly being His precious blood.

Love does no harm, this is not sexual love but from Greek "agape" and Hebrew "hesed". We are commanded not to be natural but perfect or holy. We have Christ to be like. And He comes in and saves us if we let Him. To the heart. To eternal light. It is up hill, to be like God, supernatural. Whether we are inclined to lust, to steal, or fornicate, or are homosexual, we all are commanded to be holy as He is holy, or perfect. In Him is light, love, empathy, compassion, justice balanced with mercy, grace, truth, sacrifice, living life to the full.

 

[The Brown Brink]

All those good behaviors you mentioned can be achieved by using good communication skills.
Shouldn't preachers preach about using good communication skills?

And all those bad things you mentioned can be avoided by using self-control.
Shouldn't preachers preach about using self-control?

From what we know about Jesus, we know He wants us to use good communication skills and self-control.

When preachers start talking about "lust" and "blood," Jesus often loses His audience...
The congregation's mind wanders right off topic.

 

[Truthfrees]

MOD HAT

moving to eschatology

 

[Adstar]

Weren't people more, like, very grateful to Him? I'm not sure if gratitude is the same as worship.

John 20: KJV
28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. {29} Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."

Thomas was not just being grateful here.. He declares Jesus his Lord and God..

 

[Lucian Hodoboc]

John 20: KJV
28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. {29} Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."

Thomas was not just being grateful here.. He declares Jesus his Lord and God..

How did you come to that conclusion? He doesn't say "You are My Lord and my God.". He could have meant it as an exclamation, like we say nowadays "My God!" when we see something that surprises us.