The Last Reformation

[ByTheSpirit]

Close enough for me.

You say potato I say watermelon... sounds about right

 

[ByTheSpirit]

To be honest..and “bythespirit“ you must be. You have not yet been a part of it..
You attended 1 day of a conference held by some who aernt adhering to the teaching but are more Bethnal Redding and Todd white type teaching..
That's not living it.. Or being a part of something.

Well one of those people I met with claimed to know Torben and had ministered with him several times. I mean whatever man, I know you are part of the group, but I gave it a look and it's not for me.

 

[Alithis]

A Great Deception: The New Apostolic Reformation | Christian Forums

No Aiki.. You have this utterly wrong ..
Sorry for your confusion .
Youv got the wrong group completely.

The last reformation is diametricly opposed to the new apostolic reformation.
And betal Redding ，vineyard etc or any of it.
Please do some research.

 

[Alithis]

Well one of those people I met with claimed to know Torben and had ministered with him several times. I mean whatever man, I know you are part of the group, but I gave it a look and it's not for me.

I noticed for now the cost became more then your ready to bear..but then it is so for all of us.
This is why I asked about Matt ch 6..
Do we truly believe the words of Jesus.

And bro ..you should know better. Just because one guy makes claims like that ..should we take him at his word when he preaches something quite different ?.. No we should question him openly.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I noticed for now the cost became more then your ready to bear..

Wow I cannot believe you would dare throw that out there like that. You know nothing about me other than the interactions we have online, completely unfounded personal remark. Uncalled for.

 

[Alithis]

Wow I cannot believe you would dare throw that out there like that. You know nothing about me other than the interactions we have online, completely unfounded personal remark. Uncalled for.

I'm referring to your public posts opposing going out and doing as a point of beginning obedience.(stating Paul didn't as an argument to support it )
I apologise if you thought I was referring to anything else.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I'm referring to your public posts opposing going out and doing as a point of beginning obedience.(stating Paul didn't as an argument to support it )
I apologise if you thought I was referring to anything else.

I said nothing of the sort, only that we must walk in obedience to the Holy Spirit. Sometimes that means we wait, he doesn't always send people right out of the gate. In fact that is the exception to the norm. Not all members of the church have the same calling or function. Not all are called to preach on the streets.

If that is your calling then God bless you and go in his grace. But it is irresponsible to claim every believer must do these things.

 

[mark kennedy]

Can I ask what videos you were watching?

The link in the OP lead me to a serious of them, Windsor Fire or some such. I didn't see anything that was unmistakably miraculous.

 

[Alithis]

I said nothing of the sort, only that we must walk in obedience to the Holy Spirit. Not all members of the church have the same calling or function. Not all are called to preach on the streets.

If that is your calling then God bless you and go in his grace. But it is irresponsible to claim every believer must do these things.

It's got nothing to do with preaching on the streets..that is a tool used to train a person..it got everything to do with the salvation of the lost and that is a ministry given to ALL believers. And Jesus taught practiced and showed by example ..how to do it.
Go heal the sick (in your lounge,at the supermarket，in your work place,anywhere you find the lost..) preach the Gospel..drive out devil's..etc

For the most part though (acknowledging the exception to the rule) people who don't do this on the streets (which simply means out in society where the unsave are)
Don't do it anywhere.

 

[aiki]

No Aiki.. You have this utterly wrong ..
Sorry for your confusion .
Youv got the wrong group completely.

The last reformation is diametricly opposed to the new apostolic reformation.
And betal Redding ，vineyard etc or any of it.
Please do some research.

I have done. And Torbin uses exactly the same sorts of tactics and tricks that hypnotists and magicians use to manipulate and command their targets. This is common to leaders of the NAR, too. Torbin also shares with the NAR the same hyper-charismaticism, and the same "God told me" stories typical of the leaders of the NAR. So, no, I haven't got the Last Reformation wrong. It is just another version of the same hucksterism and cultish false teaching found in the NAR.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I have done. And Torbin uses exactly the same sorts of tactics and tricks that hypnotists and magicians use to manipulate and command their targets. This is common to leaders of the NAR, too. Torbin also shares with the NAR the same hyper-charismaticism, and the same "God told me" stories typical of the leaders of the NAR. So, no, I haven't got the Last Reformation wrong. It is just another version of the same hucksterism and cultish false teaching found in the NAR.

Well if you are implying God doesn't speak to his children and lead them personally then you are wrong. Sorry to burst your bubble. This point of discussion has nothing to do with TLR, NAR, or any group but truth. God does speak to his children and he will often lead them to specific people, places, etc to accomplish his purposes.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

It's got nothing to do with preaching on the streets..that is a tool used to train a person..it got everything to do with the salvation of the lost and that is a ministry given to ALL believers. And Jesus taught practiced and showed by example ..how to do it.
Go heal the sick (in your lounge,at the supermarket，in your work place,anywhere you find the lost..) preach the Gospel..drive out devil's..etc

For the most part though (acknowledging the exception to the rule) people who don't do this on the streets (which simply means out in society where the unsave are)
Don't do it anywhere.

We'll just have to agree to disagree then

 

[aiki]

Well if you are implying God doesn't speak to his children and lead them personally then you are wrong. Sorry to burst your bubble. This point of discussion has nothing to do with TLR, NAR, or any group but truth. God does speak to his children and he will often lead them to specific people, places, etc to accomplish his purposes.

Bubble? What bubble? God speaks to His children all the time - in His word. He leads them with the principles, wisdom, truth and commands His word contains.

Inasmuch as you aren't the OP and don't, therefore, have the right to declare what this thread discussion is about, I shall ignore your attempt to do so above.

The leaders of the NAR and of TLR both rely on private revelations from God to justify their actions and teachings. Insofar as they do, they migrate from biblical Christianity into cultic manipulation.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Bubble? What bubble? God speaks to His children all the time - in His word. He leads them with the principles, wisdom, truth and commands His word contains.

Inasmuch as you aren't the OP and don't, therefore, have the right to declare what this thread discussion is about, I shall ignore your attempt to do so above.

The leaders of the NAR and of TLR both rely on private revelations from God to justify their actions and teachings. Insofar as they do, they migrate from biblical Christianity into cultic manipulation.

I was responding to your nonsense about God not speaking to people on a personal level, this has everything to do with the OP since you made the comparison of the TLR with NAR and others who believe "God told me so"

God does tell people to do things and no it is not just confined to the pages of scripture. I used to be of your mindset but man am I happy the Lord set me free from such a limited POV. Highly religious as well.

 

[Lucian Hodoboc]

The link in the OP lead me to a serious of them, Windsor Fire or some such. I didn't see anything that was unmistakably miraculous.

Literally 90% of the videos on that channel are about a guy named Doug and his wife and friends filming themselves healing people from pain on the streets. Sure, he preaches (talks in front of a camera for a few minutes) before showing the street miracles that he performs in most of his videos, but I don't understand how you missed all the videos containing the healings. You probably just watched the first few seconds and just saw him talking.

 

[Lucian Hodoboc]

Nope. You are just out of context.
Read Ephesians 4:11-12 carefully.

How am I out of context? I'm quoting a direct statement of Jesus'. You're supporting your claims with something that Paul observed Christ to have done. Christ gave some of His disciples certain powers. That's correct. Christ didn't walk around the world and give everyone powers like Santa Claus delivering gifts. But he did tell them in Matthew 28:29 to go out there and make disciples of their own. How does that invalidate the assumption that the disciples could hand over those powers to those new disciples that they made? And how does the fact that Christ gave some of the disciples certain powers invalidate Christ's promise that:

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father.

13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, that will I do.
?

 

[aiki]

I was responding to your nonsense about God not speaking to people on a personal level, this has everything to do with the OP since you made the comparison of the TLR with NAR and others who believe "God told me so"

God does tell people to do things and no it is not just confined to the pages of scripture. I used to be of your mindset but man am I happy the Lord set me free from such a limited POV. Highly religious as well.

Well, if by "God speaking to people" you mean a private, divine voice in their head directing them, then I would respond by saying you're the one offering nonsense. Not once in all of Scripture does this happen. And not once in all of Scripture are believers commanded to listen for such a voice, nor are they urged to expect it. This sort of "revelation," however, is rife in the NAR and the LR. It is the cultish vehicle through which all sorts of false teaching is justified. And foolish Christians gobble it up!

I don't think you're a man set free - except, perhaps, from sound doctrine. You may be happy but this by no means certifies you're on the right track. I know of many happy drunks who, with a smile on their face, are destroying themselves with alcohol.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Well, if by "God speaking to people" you mean a private, divine voice in their head directing them, then I would respond by saying you're the one offering nonsense. Not once in all of Scripture does this happen. And not once in all of Scripture are believers commanded to listen for such a voice, nor are they urged to expect it. This sort of "revelation" however is rife in the NAR and the LR. It is the cultish vehicle through which all sorts of false teaching is justified. And foolish Christians gobble it up!

I don't think you're a man set free - except, perhaps, from sound doctrine. You may be happy but this by no means certifies you're on the right track. I know of many happy drunks who, with a smile of their face, are destroying themselves with alcohol.

Really?

John 10:3 "My sheep hear my voice"
Acts 8:29 "The Spirit said to Philip"

That is just two times. You said not once.

 

[aiki]

Really?

John 10:3 "My sheep hear my voice"
Acts 8:29 "The Spirit said to Philip"

That is just two times. You said not once.

And where do these verses say, "a voice in your head"? That is a notion you must read into them. And, again, where are Christians commanded to pursue such a subjective leading or expect it?

 

[ByTheSpirit]

And where do these verses say, "a voice in your head"? That is a notion you must read into them. And, again, where are Christians commanded to pursue such a subjective leading or expect it?

I showed you wrong, its ok. No worries. God does indeed speak to people on a personal and intimate level, one which I pray you experience very soon yourself. And you will, whether you like it or not.