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The joys of counseling.

spencerian

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This whole thing stinks.
The past few days have been downright terrible.

My marriage (now divorce) counselor has told me to make an observation of the things my wife and I have experienced.

So I did. I wrote it down. So I know about 5 affairs, that were all my fault (according to her).
I speculate 15 or so in the past 5 years.

Everything was my fault. You know in the 11 years of marriage, she never said "I'm Sorry".

Now that I see how manipulating she is, and how unfaithful she is, it angers me. Right now I am hurt and angry.
 
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My heart goes out to you my friend. My hubby has had 8 affairs in as many years, plus a greater number of online cyber-affairs. I guess right now the big difference is that my dh recognizes it was HIS own decisions that caused him to stray, not my action or inaction.

:edirt because it was just bad advice:


I'm so very sorry that you are feeling this much hurt. I wish there was something to say to make that go away, but there just isn't, and that sucks. You have some very tough decisions to make in the next few weeks and months. Are you willing to do what God is going to require of you??
 
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libertybelle

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This whole thing stinks.
The past few days have been downright terrible.

My marriage (now divorce) counselor has told me to make an observation of the things my wife and I have experienced.

So I did. I wrote it down. So I know about 5 affairs, that were all my fault (according to her).
I speculate 15 or so in the past 5 years.

Everything was my fault. You know in the 11 years of marriage, she never said "I'm Sorry".

Now that I see how manipulating she is, and how unfaithful she is, it angers me. Right now I am hurt and angry.

I'm so sorry spencer :hug:. Try to keep hold of the truth. If you remained loyal you will so richly rewarded.

However this deeply hurts. My ex, I discovered was having multiple affairs while married for 11 years. It was in the last three years of marriage I started to see things for what they were. And I grieved something horrible.

By the second year I knew I was leaving. But it didn't change how or what I went through after going through the divorce. I was very angry for way about three years... it included during the separation, when divorced, and after the divorce was final.

Perhaps by seeing things as they are, spencer, will help you through the grieving process. And divorce is equal to death. It's a separation and must be treated as such. So the grieving process is very necessary.
 
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spencerian

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It was in the last three years of marriage I started to see things for what they were. And I grieved something horrible.

By the second year I knew I was leaving. But it didn't change how or what I went through after going through the divorce

That describes the last 3 years of my marriage. I kept hoping she would change. I thought if I did things better, faster, with more affection it would make her come to her senses.

And I do have some blame. I didn't want to go the xtra mile sometimes. I didn't want to PUSH her to go to counseling.

But I don't know how much blame I can take for this. My counselor said it wasn't my fault. He believes her to have a mental disorder.
 
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ShainaBrina

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There's really no point in trying to figure out who is to blame. All we can do is take responsibility for our own part and move on.

After my divorce, I called my husband and apologized and asked for forgiveness for my part in the break down of our marriage, even though he was abusive and had numerous affairs etc. He isn't a believer and so was kind of confused by this... but it was something I felt I needed to do for me. It helped in my own recovery.
 
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ido

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This whole thing stinks.
The past few days have been downright terrible.

My marriage (now divorce) counselor has told me to make an observation of the things my wife and I have experienced.

So I did. I wrote it down. So I know about 5 affairs, that were all my fault (according to her).
I speculate 15 or so in the past 5 years.

Everything was my fault. You know in the 11 years of marriage, she never said "I'm Sorry".

Now that I see how manipulating she is, and how unfaithful she is, it angers me. Right now I am hurt and angry.

My ex was emotionally/verbally abusive and unfaithful with at least 3 women for sure and I suspect a fourth one. Yet, he will still point the finger at me for ending our marriage. I accept the fact that it will always be my fault in his eyes. It's the only way he can live with himself for the choices HE made.

I made a personal resolve to forgive him even though he didn't ask for it...and I asked him to forgive me (he refused). I made peace with it and moved past it b/c I can't control his thoughts or actions - only my own. It helped tremendously in the healing process - I gave over a lot of pain and grief to God when I forgave him and asked forgiveness.
 
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eatenbylocusts

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That describes the last 3 years of my marriage. I kept hoping she would change. I thought if I did things better, faster, with more affection it would make her come to her senses.

And I do have some blame. I didn't want to go the xtra mile sometimes. I didn't want to PUSH her to go to counseling.

But I don't know how much blame I can take for this. My counselor said it wasn't my fault. He believes her to have a mental disorder.

When I hear people say it's a bad sign when someone doesn't admit to some fault in the ending of a marriage I have to remind myself that they never lived with my ex. My main fault was getting married to him in the first place. I ignored red flags, didn't listen to my mom and friends, and naively believed I was in God's will because he told me he had accepted Christ as his saviour. I wasn't perfect. I refused to have sex with him after he called me foul names and I'm pretty sure I yelled at him after he broke a promise to not be gone for hours without calling me when I had dinner waiting.

Anyway-I got so much peace when I realized that I didn't need to figure out why he did certain things. They weren't logical and therefore there was no figuring it out.

I wish all the cheating people would end up marrying each other so those of us who want to honor our vows and have a good marriage could have a better chance.
 
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iambren

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When I hear people say it's a bad sign when someone doesn't admit to some fault in the ending of a marriage I have to remind myself that they never lived with my ex. My main fault was getting married to him in the first place. I ignored red flags, didn't listen to my mom and friends, and naively believed I was in God's will because he told me he had accepted Christ as his saviour. I wasn't perfect. I refused to have sex with him after he called me foul names and I'm pretty sure I yelled at him after he broke a promise to not be gone for hours without calling me when I had dinner waiting.

Anyway-I got so much peace when I realized that I didn't need to figure out why he did certain things. They weren't logical and therefore there was no figuring it out.

I wish all the cheating people would end up marrying each other so those of us who want to honor our vows and have a good marriage could have a better chance.

Beautifully written and are my own sentiments about my exwife who decided to eviscerate the heart/soul/sex from our marriage 6 months in. I too would analyze what did I do to cause all this, for years! Then when it was falling apart people wanted to "help" by making ME guilty. You hear "there's always two sides to every story" or "there's always blame to go around on both sides" or women especially would say "well you have to be doing something to make her that way, you have to love her as Christ loved the church, and you're arrogant if you don't admit it!!!". Wow, thanks I'm glad I came to you for encouragement.
Probably most of the time blame can be found on both sides. But it's lazy thinking to assume that ALL marital problems are both at fault. Sometimes just one of them has an issue and that's that!
 
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spencerian

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You hear "there's always two sides to every story" or "there's always blame to go around on both sides" or women especially would say "well you have to be doing something to make her that way, you have to love her as Christ loved the church

No offense to the ladies here, but that's all I heard. I must be doing something wrong. Even my mother told me that!

The plain truth is no matter what I did, it was wrong! Everything I did was to appease her. How can you make a person happy that just can't be happy?
 
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FaithfulWife

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I don't want to be beat up here so please be gentle--but may I point out something?

My ex had more than 13 affairs that I can prove: 4-5 physical sexual affairs and the rest were online cybersex email affairs with webcam or illicit email. Most likely there were FAR MORE that I can't prove, but 13 is plenty. He was verbally abusive, mentally abusive, emotionally abusive and physically abused me and my pets. He was not a Christian. If anyone has "the right" to put the blame on their ex for a divorce, it would be me.

Here's the issue, as I see it. He behaved poorly and this is a fact, but it is also equally true that in response to his bad choices and onslaught of abuse in every possible way that * I * made choices that were sinful and which ARE my problem. I have a perfect example too. After probably a year of telling me that the affair I suspected was all in my head and I was paranoid, I received a receipt in the mail from a SUPER fancy hotel for Mr. and Mrs. (LastName) and an undergarment (not mine) saying that they hoped we enjoyed our stay! Obviously *I* had not been the one accompanying him, and now I had solid proof that it wasn't just "all in my head" so I went to his office and slapped him across the face.

Now...all of you may be thinking, "WELL good heavens that's understandable. He had it coming!" (which I believe he did :p) but the abuse and infidelity does not excuse me from my choice to use physical violence against him. I am responsible for that.

And that is what people mean when they say "...it's a bad sign when someone doesn't admit to some fault in the ending of a marriage." You all can point fingers and blame all you want--I'm not here to judge you. But in your next relationship nothing will change if you don't STOP looking at the piece of toothpick in your ex's eye and put your focus onto the piece of wood in your own eye! As an example, when my ex and I divorced, I did go to about 1.5 years of anger management voluntarily so that I could learn how to express my anger more appropriately and in a more godly manner. I don't care WHAT my spouse does, *I* am the one responsible for my response even in anger.

The fact is that my ex was really, REALLY, REALLY far from perfect, but that does not alleviate me from my personal responsibility or from the consequences of my choices. I screamed at him. I said things deliberately to hurt him. I judged him disrespectfully. I called him names. I did not keep up with letting him know that I liked and respected him (probably because he behaved in unlikable and unrespectable ways). I did not want to meet his emotional needs because he was hurting me.

Does this make sense? His HORRID behavior does not release me to behave badly back. So I do take responsibility for my part of the divorce and although I do not think the percentage of responsibility was even close to equal, that doesn't matter one bit. I am responsible for what I did and chose to do. Now, would you still like to continue to point fingers at your ex and blame, or would you like to humbly take a look at yourself and consider what maybe you did do? Just because you ex chose to sin does not mean you are "entitled" to sin back. Your ex is not here. You are! So let's start with YOU and keep the focus, not on "What they did" because you can't change that. You CAN change you! Work on your own self and become a more godly person and become the man or woman that G-d INTENDED for you to be!
 
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libertybelle

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I don't want to be beat up here so please be gentle--but may I point out something?

My ex had more than 13 affairs that I can prove: 4-5 physical sexual affairs and the rest were online cybersex email affairs with webcam or illicit email. Most likely there were FAR MORE that I can't prove, but 13 is plenty. He was verbally abusive, mentally abusive, emotionally abusive and physically abused me and my pets. He was not a Christian. If anyone has "the right" to put the blame on their ex for a divorce, it would be me.

Does blame need to be administered faith?

Here's the issue, as I see it. He behaved poorly and this is a fact, but it is also equally true that in response to his bad choices and onslaught of abuse in every possible way that * I * made choices that were sinful and which ARE my problem. I have a perfect example too. After probably a year of telling me that the affair I suspected was all in my head and I was paranoid, I received a receipt in the mail from a SUPER fancy hotel for Mr. and Mrs. (LastName) and an undergarment (not mine) saying that they hoped we enjoyed our stay! Obviously *I* had not been the one accompanying him, and now I had solid proof that it wasn't just "all in my head" so I went to his office and slapped him across the face.

I can relate to this faith. I too was just as sinful as my ex. I would challenge him physically and fight with him. It was very bad on both ends. Even though I was provoked and knew it wasn't right it took a very wise Christian counselor to explain "Battered Women Syndrome" and it took years to reverse the effects that had been caused.

It was at this time I was challenged to allow the Lord to show me how He seen me. I also was challenged to make the Lord my husband and God my father. It was the first deepest spiritual growth I expereinced in my 11 year relationship. The second growth spurt came after I was able to acheive what was presented and put into pracitce.

Now...all of you may be thinking, "WELL good heavens that's understandable. He had it coming!" (which I believe he did :p) but the abuse and infidelity does not excuse me from my choice to use physical violence against him. I am responsible for that.

Yes you are faith. Again though it's an amazing thing how the mind works. And how we react is very important. Be angry but do not sin, and love the sinner but hate the sin are two cornerstone verses I dealt with mentally. However I still went crazy.

And that is what people mean when they say "...it's a bad sign when someone doesn't admit to some fault in the ending of a marriage." You all can point fingers and blame all you want--I'm not here to judge you. But in your next relationship nothing will change if you don't STOP looking at the piece of toothpick in your ex's eye and put your focus onto the piece of wood in your own eye! As an example, when my ex and I divorced, I did go to about 1.5 years of anger management voluntarily so that I could learn how to express my anger more appropriately and in a more godly manner. I don't care WHAT my spouse does, *I* am the one responsible for my response even in anger.

This is fantastic. I dealt with my part of the issues in a different way, but overall it was the same effect. Now as my children are of age I tell them the exacts of what I did. When they were little I said nothing about what took place. Eventually they began to see their dad in other relationships and by the time they were 12 had questions.

Even then I did not talk bad about the man but encouraged them to see the "good" in him. This became harder as they moved into their teen years. He talked horrible about me, but I remained silent.

The fact is that my ex was really, REALLY, REALLY far from perfect, but that does not alleviate me from my personal responsibility or from the consequences of my choices. I screamed at him. I said things deliberately to hurt him. I judged him disrespectfully. I called him names. I did not keep up with letting him know that I liked and respected him (probably because he behaved in unlikable and unrespectable ways). I did not want to meet his emotional needs because he was hurting me.

Again I too did these things, after the first three years of my marriage. The things I had to confess and overcome while still dealing with his unsolicited affairs left me like a yo-yo. It took a lot of time and he became furious with me claiming the counceling was changing me... insisting I stop.

The counceling was teaching me not to be an enabler. So many things I had done I learned to quit. This included the yelling, screaming, and physical abuse... not to mention all the things I felt I "had to do".

Does this make sense? His HORRID behavior does not release me to behave badly back. So I do take responsibility for my part of the divorce and although I do not think the percentage of responsibility was even close to equal, that doesn't matter one bit. I am responsible for what I did and chose to do. Now, would you still like to continue to point fingers at your ex and blame, or would you like to humbly take a look at yourself and consider what maybe you did do? Just because you ex chose to sin does not mean you are "entitled" to sin back. Your ex is not here. You are! So let's start with YOU and keep the focus, not on "What they did" because you can't change that. You CAN change you! Work on your own self and become a more godly person and become the man or woman that G-d INTENDED for you to be!

My ex claimed to be a Christian. And who am I to say he wasn't, for only God knows the heart of man. He attended church every Sunday and practiced his lifestyle Monday through Saturday.

Early in a divorce it is hurtful and harmful to tell the person on either side they had something to do with the breakdown and breakup. Time will allow that to be revealed and perhaps the door will be opened to let you share.

There are those who relish in the using of children and prior situations that twist, distort, and manipulate. This is one area I get angry at... truely angry at. To drag children into the problem and try to make them the solution or pawn or benifactor of the sickness between the parents not only harms them but scars them for life.

Exortation is not only necessary and maditory for the body of Christ but it should be carefully and prayerfully thought out. The door should always be opened by the Holy Spirit. Anything outside of that is our own will.

Divorce is hard no matter what the circumstance. It is common for much anger, blame, and so forth. It must be grieved just like a death is grieved.
Both people need confimation and acceptance.

Time will eventually allow them to seperate the beginning emotions and detach themselves in such a way that the Holy Spirit can reveal their part in the relationship.
 
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