The Double Message of Eternal Security.

[Rajni]

You are starting to skip questions so read the following very carefully,

You are evading the part that allows you no excuse to cop out. I said you don't have to depend on mans wisdom, simply tell us the problem you have with the sheep and goats scripture. See, you haven't given a reason you cannot do that. No doubt you will come up with one, but I would like to hear it, as it helps make my point.

No problems here. Let it go, Kenny... Let it go...

*sits back and waits for yet another post about how everyone's copping out*

 

[stuart lawrence]

I already answered, I don't do that so I've not given it any thought.

I guess that means you aren't going to answer the question?

I figured.

There's only two reasons you won't answer.
1) you understand little of the Christian gospel and what righteousness requires
2) you want to evade answering questions you are uncomfortable answering.

Your question is simple to answer, however, debate must be both ways, not one way.
And frankly, I don't believe anyone on these websites would fail to understand what is required under a law of righteousness to attain heaven. In my view, anyone who didn't understand shouldn't be attempting to discuss Christian theology on the internet!

You say I quote the letter of Scripture without understanding. Your attack is against me and not against the belief here. You focus your attack on me because your argument in Scripture is weak. For one, where did I quote the letter with no understanding? Prove your case with Scripture!

Actually, your reference to the "letter of the Law" is in reference to the Old Testament Law and not all Law.

“who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was,” (2 Corinthians 3:6-7).​

No. You shown your version of the gospel that is not taught in Scripture. Jude 1:4 condemns turning God's grace into a license for immorality.



And I have shown you with Scripture that Paul was talking about the Old Law as a Pharisee in Romans 7. We are told to serve in newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter. We are told that we fulfill that righteous aspect or part of the Old Law by walking after the Spirit.


...

 

[Kenny'sID]

Do you honestly think that hides the fact you aren't holding up well at all in this? An answer to the question would have been more productive.

 

[Kenny'sID]

No problems here. Let it go, Kenny... Let it go...

*sits back and waits for yet another post about how everyone's copping out*

Not a problem, just wanted to make sure you didn't miss part of my post. I want all to see you were questioned and fell apart and there were no mistakes that caused that.

Just being thorough. And no, everyone is not copping out, that's just another attempt to spin things into looking like it me that's the problem because you know where the problem really lies. More tricky stuff, but that's fine, what is happening here is good for others to see.

 

[stuart lawrence]

I wouldn't know, I just told you I'm not, nor do I know anyone here that is doing that. I think there are some Jews that do, but aside from that, the accusation is merely something OSASr's often pretend their opponents do to make them look bad. It's a devious trick, but not something that surprises me coming from people who go to heaven no matter what they do.

I'm not under the law, not unless you mean God counting us as righteous if we accept and do the requirements God has set before us.

Do me a favor, read the scripture in Mathew on the Sheep an the Goats as a for instance, then tell me if you feel we need to take care of the poor in oerder to make it to heaven? And if so, does that mean you are under the law, because you are doing the works Jesus himself teaches us we must?

I think everyone can see now you run away from answering questions put to you.
You show love to others because of the free salvation you already have, not in order to make it to heaven!
BTW
The goats do good works, as Jesus said the Pharisees did! But those good deeds won't get them into heaven will they
And good works definitely does not incorporate reeling pat statements from your head that have no bearing on the reality of your own life. Doing good works/ showing love to others does not include crushing people with demands you yourself do not even try to obey

 

[Kenny'sID]

There's only two reasons you won't answer.
1) you understand little of the Christian gospel and what righteousness requires
2) you want to evade answering questions you are uncomfortable answering.

Your question is simple to answer, however, debate must be both ways, not one way.
And frankly, I don't believe anyone on these websites would fail to understand what is required under a law of righteousness to attain heaven. In my view, anyone who didn't understand shouldn't be attempting to discuss Christian theology on the internet!

More excuses. Keep em coming...whether you realize it or not, you're speaking volumes with your actions, and lack thereof.

 

[stuart lawrence]

More excuses. Keep em coming...whether you realize it or not, you're speaking volumes with your actions, and lack thereof.

It is you who runs from answering questions, while accusing others of the same

 

[Kenny'sID]

The goats do good works, as Jesus said the Pharisees did!

Show me where in the Sheep/goats scripture, the goats did any good works? Or are you just flat out making things up now? But again, that's fine keep it up, it's good to let others see how you work.

Anyway, please answer the question this time.

 

[Kenny'sID]

It is you who runs from answering questions, while accusing others of the same

I know I answered so it's going in one and out the other ear here, but fine with me, you keep repeating that so others will go back and see what actually happend there.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Show me where in the Sheep/goats scripture, the goats did any good works? Or are you just flat out making things up now? But again, that's fine keep it up, it's good to let others see how you work.

Anyway, please answer the question this time.

Oh I answered it. Do you believe Pharisees were sheep?

You show love to others because of the free salvation you have, not in order to make it to heaven as you put it

The works God requires are done out of love and gratitude for a free salvation, God does not want works done with the view they will better enable you to attain heaven.

Have a read of Romans ch4.
It speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works

 

[stuart lawrence]

I know I answered so it's going in one and out the other ear here, but fine with me, you keep repeating that so others will go back and see what actually happens there.

The only answer you gave was, you couldn't answer!

 

[Kenny'sID]

The only answer you gave was, you couldn't answer!

Is that really what I said or did I say I don't know because I don't do what you suggested I did. I think you know what I said.

Be aware of how you start twisting things when your end of this starts falling apart...it might help you understand if you have to move to dishonest means to discredit your opponent, you must not have much of a point in your argument.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Is that really what I said or did I say I don't know because I don't do what you suggested I did. I think you know what I said.

Be aware of how you start twisting things when your end of this starts falling apart...it might help you understand if you have to move to dishonest means to discredit your opponent, you must not have much of a point in your argument.

You said you didn't know the answer, therefore you couldn't answer the question.
As you have responded to no questions put to you, how can you claim someone elses end starts falling apart!
At least I answered your question.
Simply asking questions while not answering any put to you does not show you have good understanding of a subject!

 

[Kenny'sID]

Oh I answered it. Do you believe Pharisees were sheep?

You show love to others because of the free salvation you have, not in order to make it to heaven as you put it

The works God requires are done out of love and gratitude for a free salvation, God does not want works done with the view they will better enable you to attain heaven.

Have a read of Romans ch4.
It speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works

What are you talking about, there is no mention of Pharisees in that parable.

Again, you didn't answer the question. There were NO good works done in that scripture, the very point of the whole thing (sheep did em and went to heaven and Goats did not and didn't go to heaven, simple), yet you claim there was good works done by the goats and when I ask you to show me you don't answer. then you try to twist it into something else altogether with your "pharisees" business, lol!

Mercy!

 

[stuart lawrence]

What are you talking about, there is no mention of Pharisees in that parable.

Again, you didn't answer the question. There were NO good works done in that scripture, the very point of the whole thing (sheep did em and went to heaven and Goats did not and didn't go to heaven, simple), yet you claim there was good works done by the goats and when I ask you to show me you don't answer. then you try to twist it into something else altogether with your "pharisees" business, lol!

Mercy!

As you are unable to answer questions put to you, I guess you have to deflect any way you can
The Pharisees did good works that everyone could see.
Would you describe them as sheep or goats?
Are you saying no good works are done by goats?
Many do good works that mean nothing, for they do them to impress others

 

[Kenny'sID]

You said you didn't know the answer, therefore you couldn't answer the question.
As you have responded to no questions put to you, how can you claim someone elses end starts falling apart!
At least I answered your question.
Simply asking questions while not answering any put to you does not show you have good understanding of a subject!

You've created your excuse to not answer my questions, and that's completely exopected when you see yourself on the losing end. So that's something you need to deal with. You are only talking to yourself when you keep bringing it up.

 

[stuart lawrence]

You've created your excuse to not answer my questions, and that's completely exopected when you see yourself on the losing end. So that's something you need to deal with. You are only talking to yourself when you keep bringing it up.

How can anyone be on the losing end with someone who cannot respond to questions put.
Good attempt at deflecting g from your inability to answer questions put to you

 

[Kenny'sID]

As you are unable to answer questions put to you, I guess you have to deflect any way you can
The Pharisees did good works that everyone could see.
Would you describe them as sheep or goats?
Are you saying no good works are done by goats?
Many do good works that mean nothing, for they do them to impress others

Forget it, Man. You're trying to twist that scripture into something it is not and I won't have a part in it.

This is exactly what OSAS is based on, and continued twisting of the scripture is necessary to defend it.

 

[stuart lawrence]

You've created your excuse to not answer my questions, and that's completely exopected when you see yourself on the losing end. So that's something you need to deal with. You are only talking to yourself when you keep bringing it up.

Here's another question

Sin is the transgression of the law 1john3:4

Therefore if you observe the law you don't commit sin, if you fail to observe the law you do commit sin.
Paul states:
Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law
Rom3:20

Do you agree with Paul?

 

[stuart lawrence]

Forget it, Man. You're trying to twist that scripture into something it is not and I won't have a part in it.

This is exactly what OSAS is based on, and continued twisting of the scripture is necessary to defend it.

I'm not twisting anything. And I haven't mentioned OSAS

But i grow weary of chatting to someone who appears unable to answer simple questions put to them. They only seem able to criticise the person they are supposed to be debating with, nothing more