The Colorado Springs Quandary

[rjs330]

Yes, we have a preference for people within 'our group'. And yes, it's a human preference. An instinct. It's entirely natural as you imply. So the obverse is obviously that to the same extent we don't prefer people who are not in 'our group'. Which is the only point I have been making. But imply that that will naturally and obviously include different ethnic groups and swords are drawn. 'What? You calling me a racist!'

Well like I said that's only partially what you've said. You also said everyone was racist.

I quoted you. So we agree on one thing and disagree on the other. It's all good. No need to continue.

 

[Aldebaran]

Right. Except that was an extreme example. And the subtleties of that tendency in normal everyday life get lost in the background noise. To the point where it's not obvious. The subconscious still ticks over in the same way. It can do nothing else. And if it's two young guys in the middle of the night in the middle of nowhere then it's easy to see how it works. No-one is going to say that you are biased against young people wandering around camp sites. But imagine if they looked Middle Eastern. Does that change the reason the tendency works? And if it was a bar? During the day?

It still works the same way but to a much lesser extent. You don't obviously look for a weapon for example. But you are biased against them in a very subtle way just because they are different.

If it's so very subtle, then it doesn't sound like much more of an issue than anything else in life. People have tendencies, and different people have differing tendencies. Events in life shape them, as to conscious choices, and none of them are going to be perfect by anyone's standards.

 

[Bradskii]

If it's so very subtle, then it doesn't sound like much more of an issue than anything else in life. People have tendencies, and different people have differing tendencies. Events in life shape them, as to conscious choices, and none of them are going to be perfect by anyone's standards.

Yeah, for sure. See my last post where I linked to a paper where it was specifically stated that exposure to certain out-groups can lessen our subconscious (and automatic) distrust of them.

From a personal opinion, that happened to me in regard to other ethnic groups (and to gays as well). I grew up pretty much racist and homophobic in a small very conservative society. I didn't know any Indians, Africans, Chinese etc or anyone who was, or more likely admitted to being gay. There were jokes, caual and derogatory stereotypes, including programes on tv that would be embarrasing to admit watching now. But move to the Big City and I was exposed to all of these groups. In a positive way. And years later, returning home on ocassion, I was horrified by the casual racism that I had been part of.

 

[Aldebaran]

Yeah, for sure. See my last post where I linked to a paper where it was specifically stated that exposure to certain out-groups can lessen our subconscious (and automatic) distrust of them.

From a personal opinion, that happened to me in regard to other ethnic groups (and to gays as well). I grew up pretty much racist and homophobic in a small very conservative society. I didn't know any Indians, Africans, Chinese etc or anyone who was, or more likely admitted to being gay. There were jokes, caual and derogatory stereotypes, including programes on tv that would be embarrasing to admit watching now. But move to the Big City and I was exposed to all of these groups. In a positive way. And years later, returning home on ocassion, I was horrified by the casual racism that I had been part of.

One must be careful of the things they become desensitized to. If you had spent more time around mobsters, you would become more accepting of their lifestyle as well. Killing people to send a message, or doing whatever else it takes to maintain power in a certain area becomes more acceptable when you see it enough times. That's why it's important to not expose yourself to things that are wrong, even if those who shape your environment accept and promote them.
Even soldiers in the military become desensitized to violence after awhile, especially after experiencing combat. Same goes for police officers who see things most people never have to see. In fact, they have to desensitize themselves to it or they'd go crazy. But for police and military, it's necessary for doing the job.
And yes, I could become desensitized to the gay lifestyle, and then transsexuality, and even overt sexual fetishes to the point of flaunting it out in the street in front of children in a parade. After that, I could even start believing what those people could tell me about "Minor attracted persons" and become desensitized to that idea as well---IF I allowed myself to be around such people and propaganda. That's why it's important to stay away from it. Because.....
Some things are evil, and we need to recognize it so that we don't get deceived into accepting/promoting it.

Our entire society has become desensitized to all sorts of sexual deviancy because it's introduced incrementally, and with convincing propaganda. Even suicide is starting to be promoted. Those who are ready to be desensitized to that idea will begin accepting that as well, and will promote it. There is really no limit as to what people can become desensitized to.

 

[Bradskii]

One must be careful of the things they become desensitized to. If you had spent more time around mobsters, you would become more accepting of their lifestyle as well. Killing people to send a message, or doing whatever else it takes to maintain power in a certain area becomes more acceptable when you see it enough times. That's why it's important to not expose yourself to things that are wrong, even if those who shape your environment accept and promote them.
Even soldiers in the military become desensitized to violence after awhile, especially after experiencing combat. Same goes for police officers who see things most people never have to see. In fact, they have to desensitize themselves to it or they'd go crazy. But for police and military, it's necessary for doing the job.
And yes, I could become desensitized to the gay lifestyle, and then transsexuality, and even overt sexual fetishes to the point of flaunting it out in the street in front of children in a parade. After that, I could even start believing what those people could tell me about "Minor attracted persons" and become desensitized to that idea as well---IF I allowed myself to be around such people and propaganda. That's why it's important to stay away from it. Because.....
Some things are evil, and we need to recognize it so that we don't get deceived into accepting/promoting it.

Our entire society has become desensitized to all sorts of sexual deviancy because it's introduced incrementally, and with convincing propaganda. Even suicide is starting to be promoted. Those who are ready to be desensitized to that idea will begin accepting that as well, and will promote it. There is really no limit as to what people can become desensitized to.

You made some good points there. But I would say that there is always an internal discussion going on about becoming more accepting of something. And that discussion generally heads away from 'I was told that this was wrong' to 'I can't see any reason why it's wrong'. It certainly was that way in my personal example. I certainly didn't reach a conclusion that 'lots of people are doing this, therefore it must be ok'.

There was that internal chat that I had which revolved around the fact that the people I met weren't the people that were described to me when I had no personal knowledge of them.

And yes, one can become desensitized to some things. Most things, I guess. So the shock at first seeing two guys walking hand in hand dissapears when you see it often enough and you realise that it's causing no harm. But if someone was walking down a suburban street in the same gear as they'd wear in a gay parade, then it would always turn heads. Context is everything. Plus a healthy dose of common sense.

 

[rambot]

My child is really getting in to rennaissance LARPING.

Ugh. I know. Not really my scene..but she loves it and so do the others. Old lady in our church introduced her to it.


I fail to see how that is less damaging than drag shows. Which is to say, not damaging.

 

[rjs330]

But if someone was walking down a suburban street in the same gear as they'd wear in a gay parade, then it would always turn heads. Context is everything. Plus a healthy dose of common sense.

Yet if people did that we'd bexome desensitized to that too. Being desensitized isn't always a good thing.

 

[rjs330]

My child is really getting in to rennaissance LARPING.

Ugh. I know. Not really my scene..but she loves it and so do the others. Old lady in our church introduced her to it.


I fail to see how that is less damaging than drag shows. Which is to say, not damaging.

Have you been to many drag shows?

 

[Bradskii]

Yet if people did that we'd bexome desensitized to that too. Being desensitized isn't always a good thing.

I live near the beach. There's no problem in girls (or boys) walking along the front wearing what they'd wear on the beach (although the girls would wear the top half of their beach wear). Across the road? Yeah, no problem. Half a block away? Starts to look odd. Up to where I live? It would turn heads, although if I'm out the front washing the car, I've seen it happen (and it turns my head...). But nobody wanders around town in beach wear.

People often dress outrageously in places where it's not expected to purposely create a reaction. If there's no reaction...it doesn't happen. If it does and it causes no real offence, then...ho hum.

 

[FireDragon76]

The only stories of children in strip clubs had to do with the warped thinking of a strip club owner and their own kid, and the Metaverse, and lack of controls in the app that allows 13 year olds to go to virtual strip clubs.

Are you blaming the Metaverse on the "Left"? Or is it a technology that allows more than what most are aware of and too free of controls and limits?

I see the repeated use of "grooming", too, and that is pretty pathetic and a dog whistle for he Left as pedophiles. Reminder, Qanon theories aren't allowed here. There are plenty of pedophiles that vote or are Republican.

I don't believe non-binary is a thing, yet am more left than right.

I have also discouraged members from throwing around the word "cult" - as in the 'cult of Trump'. It is an insulting to all it is directed at. It implies the "Left" has a beehive mind. It doesn't. It is very diverse, much more than the right imo.

Try presenting your views without the dog whistles and insulting terms, which show more of your bias than anything else.

The whole thing about drag shows = grooming screams of moral panic, like the Satanic Panic of the 1980's that turned out to be alot of hot air, the stories of blood libel against Jews in the middle ages, or the witch hunts centuries ago in the early modern period. They are all about persecuting a vulnerable minority group due to psychological insecurities within the dominant group in society.

 

[Landon Caeli]

My child is really getting in to rennaissance LARPING.

Ugh. I know. Not really my scene..but she loves it and so do the others. Old lady in our church introduced her to it.


I fail to see how that is less damaging than drag shows. Which is to say, not damaging.

My daughter goes to the Renaissance festivals too. I went last year, with optimism, which was quickly replaced with a desire to leave as soon as possible. Lol.

...For some, I think it actually is a kind of fetish.

 

[rambot]

Have you been to many drag shows?

Have you?

 

[rambot]

My daughter goes to the Renaissance festivals too. I went last year, with optimism, which was quickly replaced with a desire to leave as soon as possible. Lol.

...For some, I think it actually is a kind of fetish.

You think? I just think it's people really passionate about something....that I could really not give a couple of poops about. Like those guys who are OVERLY devoted and obsessed with their own sports teams.

 

[Pommer]

You think? I just think it's people really passionate about something....that I could really not give a couple of poops about. Like those guys who are OVERLY devoted and obsessed with their own sports teams.

No, the men who shave themselves and apply colors and sport an individual letter to form a team name for their $25,000/season tickets is totally different, (and therefore “acceptable”), because…