The Colorado Springs Quandary

[Ana the Ist]

A chink in the armor of the weird cult-like ideology of the left has been revealed...and though some people might find it funny....I'd advise against laughing.

Inside Club Q: Drag queens, dancing, tolerance shattered by gunfire. Then, heroes stepped in

An investigation into the mass shooting is underway and a suspect has been arrested, but authorities have yet to identify a motive in the attack.

www.google.com

This is obviously the event I'm talking about, and there are enough articles about it that I would hope that everyone can be an adult and not demand evidence for every single thing that I'm about to say. The vast majority of this post is easily found with a quick Google search.


Person shows up at nightclub for the gay community, starts shooting, and is subdued by some brave people present after killing several people and wounding many more.


Before any details about the shooter emerge.....political narratives go into overdrive. If you read or watch CNN, you'll hear the idea that Republicans are to blame for a lot of the "anti-gay" rhetoric they've been associated with. Laws like the "Don't Say Gay" bill in Florida have been offered as examples of this. The conclusion that this was a hate crime against the gay community has been jumped to. Oddly, this has also been used as a justification for the plans of the Education Department to teach children all sorts of sexual materials and gender ideology at a very young age in public schools.

If you, dear reader, can forgive me one instance of patting myself on the back....I actually saw this coming long ago. I said that this was a dangerous thing to teach to children, and that people would kill over this, because they don't want their children to be exposed to such materials so young....and since it's associated with the grooming tactics of pedophiles....and people won't want their society to enable pedophilia.

The reaction on the left wasn't to proceed with caution....but instead, they doubled down by bringing drag queens to school and schoolchildren to strip clubs. Even the gay community started pushing back on this with groups like "gays against grooming". Social media was still under the control of the authoritarian left....and they began silencing and banning people for using the term "groomer" and anyone else who had a large following that opposed this practice.

The shooting was both predictable and avoidable imo....nevertheless, the interesting part just recently happened.

The shooter came out as non-binary and uses "they/them" pronouns.

Now, in the cult-like orthodoxy of the new left....to even question the validity of this claim is bigoted and transphobic. If you believe that non-binary is a thing, then you must believe this person is non-binary as they claim and use the preferred pronouns this person chooses.

To do otherwise would make you as much of a bigot as everyone else that has been called a bigot for resisting such claims for the past several years. I've had such accusations of bigotry thrown at me....so I would suggest that you will get over it. Thankfully, Twitter is no longer under the control of the authoritarian left....so while you might have been upset about losing this control over language, perhaps now you can find an upside to free speech.

If you want to claim that this situation presents some sort of unique exception to the rule....I'll point out that it doesn't. The rule is quite simple and that all such claims are to be accepted as truth....otherwise, you are claiming that people who change their gender identity might be lying....and this creates a problem with calling people bigots and transphobic. There's actually a clip going viral as CNN hosts can be seen rolling their eyes at having to use "they/them" pronouns....as they clearly don't believe the claim, but it is heresy to say such things in their new cult.

Thoughts?

 

[FreeinChrist]

...

The reaction on the left wasn't to proceed with caution....but instead, they doubled down by bringing drag queens to school and schoolchildren to strip clubs. Even the gay community started pushing back on this with groups like "gays against grooming". Social media was still under the control of the authoritarian left....and they began silencing and banning people for using the term "groomer" and anyone else who had a large following that opposed this practice.....

The only stories of children in strip clubs had to do with the warped thinking of a strip club owner and their own kid, and the Metaverse, and lack of controls in the app that allows 13 year olds to go to virtual strip clubs.

Are you blaming the Metaverse on the "Left"? Or is it a technology that allows more than what most are aware of and too free of controls and limits?

I see the repeated use of "grooming", too, and that is pretty pathetic and a dog whistle for he Left as pedophiles. Reminder, Qanon theories aren't allowed here. There are plenty of pedophiles that vote or are Republican.

Now, in the cult-like orthodoxy of the new left....to even question the validity of this claim is bigoted and transphobic. If you believe that non-binary is a thing, then you must believe this person is non-binary as they claim and use the preferred pronouns this person chooses.

I don't believe non-binary is a thing, yet am more left than right.

I have also discouraged members from throwing around the word "cult" - as in the 'cult of Trump'. It is an insulting to all it is directed at. It implies the "Left" has a beehive mind. It doesn't. It is very diverse, much more than the right imo.

Try presenting your views without the dog whistles and insulting terms, which show more of your bias than anything else.

 

[JosephZ]

From what I've seen, there is no evidence that the shooter ever went by anything other than he/him prior to the attack, so given it was the defense attorneys who announced this, it feels very cynical to say the least. Maybe they are going to try and go with the "gender identity is mental illness" defense or that since "they" is one of "them" it's not a hate crime? I don't know.

The shooter's neighbors said he never went by anything other than he/him. A former friend said that the shooter frequently used a homophobic slur for gay men. The shooter's Instagram account has a post showing an LGBTQ Pride flag burning and he called himself "Your boy" in a video that was made just last year. His mother referred to her son as "he" and "him" on Facebook up until the night he murdered five people.

It just seems a little too convenient to me that his attorneys are claiming their client is nonbinary after he kills five people in a gay bar.

 

[Ana the Ist]

The only stories of children in strip clubs had to do with the warped thinking of a strip club owner and their own kid, and the Metaverse, and lack of controls in the app that allows 13 year olds to go to virtual strip clubs.

[/QUOTE]

Any performance where the "entertainer" or "performer" removes clothing can be called a stripper (one need not be nude) any club that hires such performers can be called a strip club (again, it need not be nude). If this were a different forum, I could post multiple videos of children at events with drag queens removing parts of clothing and dancing.

I really didn't think we needed to split hairs on semantics here.

I see the repeated use of "grooming", too, and that is pretty pathetic and a dog whistle for he Left as pedophiles. Reminder, Qanon theories aren't allowed here. There are plenty of pedophiles that vote or are Republican.

I have never heard of this term being associated with Qanon. I got the term from RAINN who lists a lot of warnings signs and behaviors considered grooming.

I've posted the link multiple times but I'm not above posting it again.

Grooming: Know the Warning Signs | RAINN

One tool common to those who sexually abuse kids and teens is grooming: manipulative behaviors that the abuser uses to gain access to a potential victim, coerce them to agree to the abuse, and reduce the risk of being caught. Though grooming can take many different forms, it often follows a...

www.rainn.org

There's actually multiple grooming techniques that teachers are being accused of like keeping certain conversations about sexuality and gender secret from parents. The one that has gained most attention though is described on the website as...

• Desensitization to touch and discussion of sexual topics: Abusers will often start to touch a victim in ways that appear harmless, such as hugging, wrestling and tickling, and later escalate to increasingly more sexual contact, such as massages or showering together. Abusers may also show the victim inappropriate contentography or discuss sexual topics with them, to introduce the idea of sexual contact.

The relevant parts are highlighted. I have abided by forum rules and not called anyone a groomer....I merely have brought up how the topic has been used in the recent past and why.

I don't believe non-binary is a thing, yet am more left than right.

That's interesting....you don't respect "they/them" pronouns?

I have also discouraged members from throwing around the word "cult" - as in the 'cult of Trump'. It is an insulting to all it is directed at. It implies the "Left" has a beehive mind. It doesn't. It is very diverse, much more than the right imo.

Again, I find that interesting. Your beliefs about non-binary people will get you censored or banned from many left controlled spaces.

Try presenting your views without the dog whistles and insulting terms, which show more of your bias than anything else.

I don't know of any dog whistles I've used....as you can see, experts on child grooming consider exposing children to sexual content at a very young age, especially from a position of trust and authority especially when trying to hide it from parents.....a common child grooming technique.


I've asked multiple posters who support this for a valid reason why they support it....I've never received an answer.


I hate to be the one to point it out, but the sexualizing of children is a common feature in cults. People who support this without any explanation for why appear to be engaged in a cult-like belief system.


Is there a word that you would prefer instead of cult that refers to the rapid adoption of a set of beliefs not previously held, merely because friends and family adopted these beliefs, and the demonization of any who disagree along with the threat of being ostracized (aka canceled) for those who disagree with the orthodoxy?

 

[rambot]

I hate to be the one to point it out, but the sexualizing of children is a common feature in cults. People who support this without any explanation for why appear to be engaged in a cult-like belief system.

I hate to point out that heterosexual groomers are ALSO sexualizing children.

The shooter came out as non-binary and uses "they/them" pronouns.

Perchance did you see the interview with the dad? Don't think that "self loathing" is not reason enough to be angry and deranged enough to do something THAT awful.

 

[rjs330]

From what I've seen, there is no evidence that the shooter ever went by anything other than he/him prior to the attack, so given it was the defense attorneys who announced this, it feels very cynical to say the least. Maybe they are going to try and go with the "gender identity is mental illness" defense or that since "they" is one of "them" it's not a hate crime? I don't know.

The shooter's neighbors said he never went by anything other than he/him. A former friend said that the shooter frequently used a homophobic slur for gay men. The shooter's Instagram account has a post showing an LGBTQ Pride flag burning and he called himself "Your boy" in a video that was made just last year. His mother referred to her son as "he" and "him" on Facebook up until the night he murdered five people.

It just seems a little too convenient to me that his attorneys are claiming their client is nonbinary after he kills five people in a gay bar.

The interesting thing here is that we have been told that we are not allowed to question a person's gender choice. We must immediately accept what a person says. If they want to identify as whatever we should immediately and without question start using the pronouns that they want. Otherwise we are considered bigoted and phobic. Now suddenly we must consider a person's possible motives for doing so? We were not allowed to consider a prisoners motive when they wanted to identify as she/her. Now you want to question this person? Are we now allowed to start questioning peoples motives regarding their choices on their gender?

 

[JosephZ]

The interesting thing here is that we have been told that we are not allowed to question a person's gender choice. We must immediately accept what a person says. If they want to identify as whatever we should immediately and without question start using the pronouns that they want. Otherwise we are considered bigoted and phobic. Now suddenly we must consider a person's possible motives for doing so? We were not allowed to consider a prisoners motive when they wanted to identify as she/her. Now you want to question this person? Are we now allowed to start questioning peoples motives regarding their choices on their gender?

I'm questioning the attorneys claim that the shooter is nonbinary. The shooter hasn't made any statements one way or the other about his gender since the shooting. Prior to the shooting he did refer to himself as a boy and his mother used the pronouns he/him to identify her son just hours before the shooting.

 

[rambot]

The interesting thing here is that we have been told that we are not allowed to question a person's gender choice. We must immediately accept what a person says. If they want to identify as whatever we should immediately and without question start using the pronouns that they want. Otherwise we are considered bigoted and phobic. Now suddenly we must consider a person's possible motives for doing so? We were not allowed to consider a prisoners motive when they wanted to identify as she/her. Now you want to question this person? Are we now allowed to start questioning peoples motives regarding their choices on their gender?

Since gender is a social construct, it's pretty meaningless anyways. So why make a big fuss?

 

[FreeinChrist]

Any performance where the "entertainer" or "performer" removes clothing can be called a stripper (one need not be nude) any club that hires such performers can be called a strip club (again, it need not be nude). If this were a different forum, I could post multiple videos of children at events with drag queens removing parts of clothing and dancing.

I really didn't think we needed to split hairs on semantics here.

You are being VERY disingenuous here!
A strip club is a place (nightclub) where performers take their clothing off in a sexually exciting manner. Check the dictionaries.

If it was simply a performer taking off any clothing then many TV shows in the family hour or earlier are strip shows.
No need to be hyperbolic!

I have never heard of this term being associated with Qanon. I got the term from RAINN who lists a lot of warnings signs and behaviors considered grooming.

So you know nothing of Q and the pedophile accusations?

That's interesting....you don't respect "they/them" pronouns?



Again, I find that interesting. Your beliefs about non-binary people will get you censored or banned from many left controlled spaces.

No. Many on the left do not buy into it. I won't be rude about it though.

The Left is far more diverse than the right.

I don't know of any dog whistles I've used....as you can see, experts on child grooming consider exposing children to sexual content at a very young age, especially from a position of trust and authority especially when trying to hide it from parents.....a common child grooming technique.

I know a great deal about grooming as I had involvement with Child Protective Services with my job and have attended many a conference on child abuse and neglect. I have been learning about this for decades.

Their are pundits on the right who are careless in how they talk about the Left and grooming. Take a harder look at the right, and conservatives and child sexual abuse. It is shocking.

I hate to be the one to point it out, but the sexualizing of children is a common feature in cults. People who support this without any explanation for why appear to be engaged in a cult-like belief system.


Is there a word that you would prefer instead of cult that refers to the rapid adoption of a set of beliefs not previously held, merely because friends and family adopted these beliefs, and the demonization of any who disagree along with the threat of being ostracized (aka canceled) for those who disagree with the orthodoxy?

In actual cults, yes, sexualizing children is common and disgusting. But you are playing games with the term above and sexualization. According to you, any performance where a clothing item is removed is a strip performance. Is that also sexualizing a child?

How about this - at 1:22:

So was Milton Berle sexualizing kids?

How about this - Jerry Lewis starts off in boxers and a T shirt, then go to 1:40:

It's from the 1950s - was it sexualizing kids?

Be careful throwing the word cult around.

 

[Bradskii]

It might be worth noting that some people have immediately jumped on board with what this thug's solicitors have been saying. That he might well be 'non-binary' implying that it can't have been a hate crime (which, in Colorado, is a separate crime from the one of murder, not an enhancement of the seriousness of the murder). And those people are saying that if he is gay, then hey, it's nothing to do with gays being denigrated by religious folk. Effectively, 'if he's gay it's therefore nothing to do with us.

So if it turns out he's straight..?

 

[rjs330]

I'm questioning the attorneys claim that the shooter is nonbinary. The shooter hasn't made any statements one way or the other about his gender since the shooting. Prior to the shooting he did refer to himself as a boy and his mother used the pronouns he/him to identify her son just hours before the shooting.

You wouldn't expect the guy speak himself do you? I'm sure his attorney has told him to say nothing about anything.

 

[rjs330]

Since gender is a social construct, it's pretty meaningless anyways. So why make a big fuss?

Comon man. It's you guys that make the big fuss over people questioning someone's motivation for gender requests. That's what this is about. How dare we question such a thing. People can be whatever they want we are told. How dare we question that. We must accept it immediately. But now you want to question it?

The fuss has always been you guys telling us we can't say anythingz even about criminals prison. Now you want to?
I think that says something.

 

[rjs330]

It might be worth noting that some people have immediately jumped on board with what this thug's solicitors have been saying. That he might well be 'non-binary' implying that it can't have been a hate crime (which, in Colorado, is a separate crime from the one of murder, not an enhancement of the seriousness of the murder). And those people are saying that if he is gay, then hey, it's nothing to do with gays being denigrated by religious folk. Effectively, 'if he's gay it's therefore nothing to do with us.

So if it turns out he's straight..?

I guess you'll go back to blaming Christians for it.

 

[Bradskii]

I guess you'll go back to blaming Christians for it.

I'll be blaming everyone who is derogatory to gay people. And those who want to use a get-out-of-jail card by claiming some thug was himself gay will find it's no longer valid.

 

[JosephZ]

You wouldn't expect the guy speak himself do you? I'm sure his attorney has told him to say nothing about anything.

He spoke for himself at his first hearing.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I hate to point out that heterosexual groomers are ALSO sexualizing children.

Why would you hate to point that out? Of course they are....

If they had the gall to suggest making it a part of children's education in public school starting in 1st grade....I'd be against that as well.

I'm not supposed to use the word "cult" here....but the whole reason that we don't hear about a push for heterosexual early childhood sex education is they don't have a "group" of "people" who all "think alike" protecting them from any sort of criticism.

There is however, such a group of people, who refuse to acknowledge any criticism of the LGBT community as valid so they've been more successful at getting away with this.

Perchance did you see the interview with the dad? Don't think that "self loathing" is not reason enough to be angry and deranged enough to do something THAT awful.

Nope....didn't see any interview with the "dad". Whose dad are we talking about? The shooter? Is he the one who is going to take the blame for this shooting?


I mean, without actually seeing the interview, would it be inappropriate to guess that's he's....

1. White.
2. Male (in the classical sense, he was born with a penis)
3. Heterosexual.

???

I know this is a wild guess, but if the "group of people who think exactly the same" on the left intends to blame anyone, my guess is that this guy has to fit the profile of who it's appropriate to blame for everything these days.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I'll be blaming everyone who is derogatory to gay people.

That's wild. I just had a discussion with you about blaming people for the results of a policy they literally voted for....and you acted as if that was some spurious connection that was unreasonable to make.


Now you want to blame literally everyone who has ever said anything negative about a gay person as if they are somehow floating above us beyond the reach of any fault whatsoever.


Sorry....not buying it.

 

[Ana the Ist]

It might be worth noting that some people have immediately jumped on board with what this thug's solicitors have been saying. That he might well be 'non-binary' implying that it can't have been a hate crime (which, in Colorado, is a separate crime from the one of murder, not an enhancement of the seriousness of the murder). And those people are saying that if he is gay, then hey, it's nothing to do with gays being denigrated by religious folk. Effectively, 'if he's gay it's therefore nothing to do with us.

So if it turns out he's straight..?

The shooter's pronouns are "they/them". You are misgendering this person and being transphobic. You are participating in the erasure of non-binary people lol.

Since you blame everyone who is derogatory towards this community....are you blaming yourself as well? You were told what their correct pronouns are in the OP.

 

[Bradskii]

Now you want to blame literally everyone who has ever said anything negative about a gay person as if they are somehow floating above us beyond the reach of any fault.

Being derogatory to someone for just being gay? Yeah, I have, I do and I will take people to task for that. So should we all. Yourself included.

 

[Bradskii]

The shooter's pronouns are "they/them". You are misgendering this person and being transphobic. You are participating in the erasure of non-binary people lol.

Lol?

Anyway, that's his solicitor's claim. If it's genuine then he might get off the additional charge of a hate crime. Although specifically targetting gay people would seem to me to fulfill the necessary criteria, whether he is gay himself or not. But he can call himself anything he wants, as can anyone else. What I would call him wouldn't be allowed in this forum.