The Chosen

[Hammster]

I did read it and explained how the line does work, especially allowing for metaphoric language and the context of the scene. However, you did say that line wasn't in the NT, this is blasphemous

The actual concept isn’t even in the NT. That’s what makes it blasphemy.

 

[doctorwho29]

The actual concept isn’t even in the NT. That’s what makes it blasphemy.

It is there! He fulfilled the Law. It was manifested in Him. It even more or less died with Him.

 

[doctorwho29]

Anyway, this is getting silly and stressful. I've made my case. You made yours. Good day

 

[grasping the after wind]

It is there! He fulfilled the Law. It was manifested in Him. It even more or less died with Him.

"I am the Law" is not equivalent to "I fulfil the law " or "The law is manifest in Me". It can mean any number of other things and can be taken in any number of ways but why insert it when there is no need to do so since quoting the actual things Jesus said would fulfill the needs of the narrative? The Law surely has not died it remains intact in every jot and title, according to Jesus anyway. Unlike some of the others, I don't think it is necessarily blasphemous to misquote Jesus. if it is because one has a view of His message that one cannot express by using what He actually said. I just think it is a mistake to do so. Now if one is misquoting Jesus because one wishes to change His message into something it is not, that is blasphemy. I surely can't tell what someone's motivation is when purposely misquoting Jesus, but I don't need to know that to disapprove of it being done.

 

[timothyu]

His statement merely meant what He said all along.. He is the will of God.

 

[atpollard]

“I am the law of Moses”. That’s not even close to correct.

John 8:58 [NASB95] Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."

• Jesus is GOD, whose finger wrote the Law on the Tablets.

John 5:38-39 [NASB95] "You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent. You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;"

• Scripture (including the Law of Moses) points to Jesus.

Mark 2:27-28 [NASB95] Jesus said to them, "The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath."

• Jesus proclaims himself "Lord" over even the Sabbath (greater than the commandment).

Matthew 5:27-28 [NASB95] "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart."

• Jesus is the Law in a way that even the Law is not: The letter of the Law says "you may" and Jesus, the true Law, says "You may not".

 

[atpollard]

That is seriously overthinking it. Do you know how many people are being saved because of this show?

None. TV Shows do not save people ... The HOLY SPIRIT guides people to JESUS CHRIST, who saves people.
[just sayin']

 

[atpollard]

The actual concept isn’t even in the NT. That’s what makes it blasphemy.

Not being in the NT makes it "extra-Biblical", but that is not automatically "blasphemy".

[Could you define "blasphemy" as you understand the term to clarify?]

 

[timothyu]

None. TV Shows do not save people ... The HOLY SPIRIT guides people to JESUS CHRIST, who saves people.
[just sayin']

True, but because the show is not preachy but humanizes the movement and people can visually and emotionally relate to the lessons, it does cause pause and perhaps a chance for the door to be opened to accepting prompting of the HS.

 

[atpollard]

True, but because the show is not preachy but humanizes the movement and people can visually and emotionally relate to the lessons, it does cause pause and perhaps a chance for the door to be opened to accepting prompting of the HS.

I agree.
I just don't want to run into the ditch of TOO MUCH synergism and start to think that WE are saving anyone.

God may use means, but always "Soli Deo Gloria!"

 

[timothyu]

I just don't want to run into the ditch of TOO MUCH synergism and start to think that WE are saving anyone.

That is why we are to sow seeds, but not determine how they shall grow. That was never the job of the sower. This tv show in spite of the odd error which makes it human, is one of the best sowers ever produced for tv or movies.

 

[Hammster]

It is there! He fulfilled the Law. It was manifested in Him. It even more or less died with Him.

Where do you see that it was manifested in Him? You can’t just make these things up that sound good and say “see?”

 

[Hammster]

John 8:58 [NASB95] Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."

• Jesus is GOD, whose finger wrote the Law on the Tablets.

John 5:38-39 [NASB95] "You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent. You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;"

• Scripture (including the Law of Moses) points to Jesus.

Mark 2:27-28 [NASB95] Jesus said to them, "The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath."

• Jesus proclaims himself "Lord" over even the Sabbath (greater than the commandment).

Matthew 5:27-28 [NASB95] "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart."

• Jesus is the Law in a way that even the Law is not: The letter of the Law says "you may" and Jesus, the true Law, says "You may not".

Not a single scripture says He’s the law of Moses. It’s not even implied.

 

[Hammster]

Not being in the NT makes it "extra-Biblical", but that is not automatically "blasphemy".

[Could you define "blasphemy" as you understand the term to clarify?]

I never said that it was automatic. The issue is that something is being said about Jesus that isn’t biblical. My issue is less about whether Jesus said it as it is whether it’s a biblical concept. If it is not, then it’s attributing some to Christ that isn’t true.

 

[Hammster]

True, but because the show is not preachy but humanizes the movement and people can visually and emotionally relate to the lessons, it does cause pause and perhaps a chance for the door to be opened to accepting prompting of the HS.

That argument can be made about the golden calf.

 

[atpollard]

Not a single scripture says He’s the law of Moses. It’s not even implied.

Got it ... you want a verbatim quote and nothing less.
Nope, I don't have one.
I just think that your criteria is unnecessarily restrictive.

 

[Hammster]

Got it ... you want a verbatim quote and nothing less.
Nope, I don't have one.
I just think that your criteria is unnecessarily restrictive.

Why the straw man?

 

[doctorwho29]

None. TV Shows do not save people ... The HOLY SPIRIT guides people to JESUS CHRIST, who saves people.
[just sayin']

Obviously, but this a tool the Holy Spirit uses to save people. Lots of people

 

[doctorwho29]

Where do you see that it was manifested in Him? You can’t just make these things up that sound good and say “see?”

Manifested by Him fulfilling it. That is obvious.

Anyway, I'm done here, at least with this topic

 

[atpollard]

Why the straw man?

There was no “straw man”.
I offered 4 verses with exegesis explaining how Jesus was “the Law” from a metaphorical, spiritual and typological perspective and you responded with the equivalent of “taint so” by merely repeating your demand for specific verbiage:

Not a single scripture says He’s the law of Moses.

So I acknowledged that I could not find your required specific verbiage in the Bible.