The Book of Enoch?

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

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It wasn't removed, it was never there. It's bogus.

Jipsah said:

It wasn't removed, it was never there. It's bogus.

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That’s the thing though, it existed Before The Torah. It’s A Pre Flood Book.

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

That’s the thing though, it existed Before The Torah. It’s A Pre Flood Book.

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The Epic of Gilgamesh predates the Torah as well. Should we consider it holy writ, or part of the Bible?

Jipsah said:

The Epic of Gilgamesh predates the Torah as well. Should we consider it holy writ, or part of the Bible?

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The difference is that The Book of Enoch Is Holy Scripture.

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

The difference is that The Book of Enoch Is Holy Scripture.

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So remind me again, how much pure, unadulterated, observable falsehood can a writing contain and still be considered Holy Scripture? How much leaven does it take to leaven that lump? How much stuff like "the sun going north" can you swallow? Especially when the lie is preceded by the assurance that it came direct from the mouth of a "holy angel"? I don't know but what the Epic of Gilgamesh has as much truth in it as "Enoch" does (and it doesn't have much.)

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

The difference is that The Book of Enoch Is Holy Scripture.

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It may be part of the Ethiopian canon, but there are different levels of canon. The Gospels are obviously at the highest tier, followed by Acts and the Epistles then there is the Pentateuch, the Psalms, the Prophets and the books of History, and then you have the lowest tier where Revelations is found along with a few other books which don't quite make the grade. Enoch probably sits below that.

Check it out, the Early Church Fathers, Justin Martyr, Athenagoras, Commodianus and Eusebius all taught that demons originate from the giants, just like the Book of Enoch. I wonder why the Church disregarded the early church fathers? http://ancients.thebookofenoch.info/

To see the things described in the book of Enoch from a Biblical perspective, look in the 1st chapter of Romans.

Romans 1: (18-32)

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; 19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. 28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; 29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

In verses 20, 21, and 22, a reference to "they" occurs and hence Paul is referring to those at the "creation of the world". The end result of "them" is stated in verse 26. A picture is now drawn through the remaining scripture and it can be seen the awful things that transpired during early earth. More specifically we can see in verse 23 the connection to the time of Genesis 1:26

Genesis 1:26 26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

We see the things described in the book of Enoch here and man made in the image of God was changed into those things described, birds, four footed beast, animals, etc.

If we also go over to Genesis 6 we can also see when these things took place.

Genesis 6: (1-4) (KJV) 1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, 2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. 3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. 4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

When look at verse 3 we see it is referring to the time that the life of man was shrunk to 120. This would have to when he lost his right to the tree of life. We can also see that the giants existed “”in those days “, but it is after that when the sons of God and the daughters of men cam together. That would then be after mans fall and before the flood.

Lets camp here for a minute and take a look atGenesis 6. I want to show who or what really is the offspring of this notorious union. If you look at verse 4 see that end result of this union is that children of God or men for that matter resulted and that are said to be mighty.

If we go on to Genesis 10 Nimrod is said to be mighty in two places and is said to be the founder of the kingdom of Babel.

Genesis 10: (8-10) (KJV) 8 And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth. 9 He was a mighty hunter before the Lord: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord. 10 And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.

If we look at Genesis 11 we see the builders of the tower of Babel are the children of men. Now the mighty ones, these children of men are the ones of this notorious offspring.

Genesis 11: (1-9) (KJV) 1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech. 2 And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there. 3 And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter. 4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth. 5 And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded. 6 And the Lord said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do. 7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech. 8 So the Lord scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city. 9 Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the Lord did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the Lord scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth.

If you continue through the bible and track this line, the line of Ham you will see that these are the giants through the bible. I wouldn't lump everybody together and say all are a product of them.

SummaScriptura said:

Check it out, the Early Church Fathers, Justin Martyr, Athenagoras, Commodianus and Eusebius all taught that demons originate from the giants, just like the Book of Enoch. I wonder why the Church disregarded the early church fathers? http://ancients.thebookofenoch.info/

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Probably because "Enoch" is chockabloc with utter hogwash.

This is a video I made about The Son Of Man References in The Book of Enoch:

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

This is a video I made about The Son Of Man References in The Book of Enoch:

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Wow! Thanks for the video. There is something very important with this. I've looked at this my self and there is significance to the creation when Christ is refereed to as the Son of man. I really think there was a world here before ours and He was a big part of it.

Proverbs 8: (22-32)(KJV) 22 The Lord possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. 23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. 24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water. 25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: 26 While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. 27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: 28 When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep: 29 When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth: 30 Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him; 31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men. 32 Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.

Notice the word "habitable". Where is the inhabitable part? Is this in the center of the earth? Is this why when he went 3 day in the heart of the earth (Mathew 12:40) he was called Son of man? Probably so.

I also think that this is why in Genesis 1 it is made clear that man is to be "upon the earth" and "over all the earth" and not below the earth or under the earth, etc.

Things transpired in the inhabitable parts of the earth that probably was not so nice.

These are some videos I made about Early Church Writers referring to The Book of Enoch and Ancient Writers referring to Fallen Angels mating with human women to create giants:

jaybird88 said:

thats the problem, scripture tells us very little about Enoch other than the one sentence. its obvious Enoch was very important so why the silence on him?
if no man goes to heaven and comes back whats the deal with Moses and Elijah on the mountain with Jesus?
you also have another issue, look at the generations of Adam in Gen 5, they all live 700 to 900 years, all of them but one, Enoch at 365. just a coincidence and nothing to think about im sure.
Enoch didnt die, he was taken. remember Elijah, he didnt die he was taken and also came back to lead the way for Jesus. another coincidence.
Jesus also does not say man does not go to heaven and come back, He says no man goes there, comes back, but one who descended the Son of man.
i dont know exactly what that means but i think its deeper then what your saying.

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It is speaking of ascension to the throne of God in heaven prepared for "The Son Of Man".
Enoch saw it and described it. It is prepared for God the Word, who will sit there in His created new man flesh, which is Kinsman (brother) to Adam flesh. He was always there hidden, with God, was God, who made all things, who was to come in flesh and ransom Adam's kingdom back, and rule it and restore all things the father of the Adam race sold into sin and corruption.
Jesus was in Heaven as the Son of Man with the Father, not seen, hidden, and in John He is revealed as come in flesh. He descended, He is there, even while wearing the flesh Kinsman garment which He put on so as to be "brother", and so have the authority, the right, and the Power to ascend to that prepared throne read Isaiah 59).
The chapters in Enoch about it correlate to His taking His power to Himself and reigning, in the Book of Revelation.

jaybird88 said:

Jesus has the rod now?

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No. He gets it when He takes His great power unto Himself, and reigns. It was hidden with other temple treasures in the time of Jeremiah.
Maybe I already answered you. Jacob refers to it in his last blessing before dying, and in Ezekiel, we see the returned King of Righteousness passing the "elect" -all the gathered seed of Jacob- under the rod of God and separating the righteous from the damned unrepentant seed of Jacob. The righteous then enter the kingdom of God on earth, to live the thousand years along with the sheep gentiles.

GUANO said:

You guys have literally no idea what is going on in that book lol...

I agree it's inspired but it's not a place to find facts about the earth, the moon and the stars.

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Well, since the angels took Enoch on a complete tour of the entire cosmos, and showed him everything about the orbits of the sun, moon, and stars, then you are saying you just can't believe it, yourself, but the facts are there, in Enoch, and carefully noted.

yeshuasavedme said:

We've [persons in our family] been studying both books for several years along with regular Bible study, and find they compliment and add to understanding the entire Torah, prophets, and the Gospels.
In many, many places, they shed light on what was obscure, not only in Torah and the prophets, but in world history as it pertains to those areas around the middle east and in areas close by...
And this portion sheds light on who Job was:
Book of Jasher, chapter 67:
24 And the king sent and called his two counsellors Reuel the Midianite and Job the Uzite, and they came and sat before the king.
Job, from Uz, was a counselor to Pharaoh as well as Reuel, the future father-in-law to Moses, in the days that Balaam counseled Pharaoh to drown the Hebrews' sons at birth....
They both left Pharaoh's court at the time that decision was made, and returned to their own lands, where they were chiefs, and which lands were allies of Egypt.
Job then, was a friend of Reuel, and it stands to reason that Moses added his story to the writings which the Tribes of Israel kept...


The most interesting thing about Reuel leaving the court of Egypt is that he took the "Rod of God" that Adam had been given to reign with, over earth, as high King and High Priest [but he sold earth into sin, at the fall, and could not continue, by reason of death, to be "firstborn"...] , and which rod was passed down through the sons who received the blessing of the office of firstborn -not meaning the ones born first, but the ones who had the blessing of the office of high king and high priest, which Patriarchal office for earth's tribes would be preserved through Abraham's seed after Abraham got it from "Melche-Tzedek", which means "King of Righteousness". He was the priest of the Most High God.

We learn in Jasher that one who gave that blessing to Abraham, in Genesis 14, was Shem, who blessed Abraham with that blessing in Genesis 14. That office and blessing of firstborn was passed through Isaac, to Jacob, to Levi... and John the Baptist was of that tribe and probably in line to be High Priest, but that office was corrupted and sold in political moves in the days of the Maccabees; but John baptized Jesus unto "Righteousness", and the Holy Spirit anointed Him for that office. He holds the Title to it and will return to reign as High Priest and High King of earth. He inherits the Rod of God that God gave to Adam, and which came down to Jacob, from Moses, and Jacob gave it to Joseph...but the Tribe of Levi got it back when Moses took it out of the Garden of Reuel, by a miracle.
Reuel took it from Egypt when he left, and Moses did miracles with that Rod, in that office, while he lived, and was Anointed for that office.
~~~~
Aaron was baptized into the office of high priest, and his firstborn sons were to hold that office until Messiah came....whose Rod it is.

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jaybird88 said:

Jesus has the rod now?

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Good question.

According to Revelation, Jesus is shown as a chief-Shepherd, and didn't shepherds carry a long wooden staff to help lead the flocks?

Exodus 12:11
And thus shall ye eat it; with your loins girded, your shoes on your feet, and your staff<4731> in your hand; and ye shall eat it in haste: it is the LORD'S passover.
Isaiah 40:11
He will feed His flock like a shepherd;
He will gather the lambs with His arm, And carry them in His bosom,
And gently lead those who are with young.

Matthew 2:6
And thou Bethlehem, land of Judah, not being inferior-most are in the ones-leading of Judea. For out of thee shall be going-forth one-leading, Who shall be Shepherding<4165> the People of Me, the Israel.

4464. rhabdos hrab'-dos from the base of 4474;
a stick or wand (as a cudgel, a cane or a baton of royalty):--rod, sceptre, staff.

Revelation 12:5
And she brought forth a Son, a male, Who is about to be Shepherding<4165> all the Nations in iron rod/staff<4464>.
And is caught-away the Child of her toward the God, and toward the throne of Him.

Revelation 7:17
That the Lamb-kin in midst of the throne shall be Shepherding<4165> them and shall be way leading them upon life springs of waters
and God shall be out-rubbing every tear out of the eyes of them.

Avraham‎ׁ The Jewish Shepherd

GUANO said:

No. It's not. I can personally prove that the stars, sun and moon don't go into portals...

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They follow the paths God commanded for them in the beginning. Those paths are ordinances of heaven.
They bring in the seasons and keep perfect records of the ordained times .

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith said:

Or, It Was Found At Qumran, but was Suppressed :

THE HIDDEN ARAMAIC ENOCH SCROLL

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I think it was and was suppressed, because it establishes that the Messiah is Yeshua, and has come.
Also, the Essenes kept a lot of books for which we are thankful, but they had obviously that portion, because they wrote about "who" that son of man is, and they made him out to be the ruler of the Essenes.
I have the books, translated, but shipped them to our new home in FL, and would have to search Internet on my phone for that book they wrote.

Don't know why this was a messed up post.