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Paul went on to say:
"I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all..." (I Corinthians 14:18)
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What do YOU believe "That which is perfect" is in reference to?whether you agree with Doc's understanding "of that which is Perfect' or not, you are in error as well.
Note what was said...We are CALLED to be perfect...none of us has achieved perfection yet, and will not until we are with Christ. Even John Wesley said his term, Christian Perfection, did not mean Christians are perfect...it's about having the ability to choose to not sin...something we didn't have before God saved us...
Spiritually, we all struggle, on a daily basis...we're faced with temptation...we go through personal trials...these things test our faith, cause doubt at times...sometimes we stumble and fall into sin...I'm sorry, but that is not perfect.
And especially, in regards to the verse in the OP...that which is perfect is the second coming of Christ, and the resurrection of believers...it's easy enough to figure out by keeping with the context of 1 Corinthians.
Your another one who just doesnt get the two levels of life. Flesh and spiritual. We struggle day to day with our fleshy sins AND YET we are spiritually perfected (done deal) and made clean and spotless by the blood of Christ.
You just dont believe scripture do you?
10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
You say we are called to be perfect. Scripture says we've been perfected.
I choose to believe scripture, no offence.
Not at all.IF YOU KNOW PAUL'S CITIZENSHIP AND SCHOLARSHIP, HIS ABILITY TO SPEAK MULTIPLE LANGUAGES....you would know what he meant by this.
Exactly. Because this form of tongues is "speaking to God": (which is a 'good' thing)It should be noted, however, that Acts records that everyone in a nearby crowd was able to understand what the Apostles were saying at Pentecost, whereas glossolalia as usually practised today is unintelligible to everybody including the speaker (1 Cor 14:2; 14:13-18).
No one is denying that. We're talking about a specific passage here.the Glorification.
but there are MANY references to perfect and perfection in Scripture....
I know! Sad isn't it? Why would anyone want to counter what God says to desire?Doc has been trying to counter so-called "gifts':
Heh..And you wonder why ih8s8n is offended? We hear this constatntly,i've seen first-hand what people say are the "gifts"....blathering and rolling around and daring to say "Thus saith the Lord....",
Misrepresentation is also disgraceful.DISGRACEFUL.
I'm sure that's what you believe.Doc has been trying to emphasize FAITH IN GOD. but the Pentes and Charismaniacs will have none of it. they love the flesh.
sunlover1 said:Heh..And you wonder why ih8s8n is offended?
Exactly. Because this form of tongues is "speaking to God": (which is a 'good' thing)
For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God.
I am glad to hear you're not "offended" and you're right, I should have used a different word.sunlover1: I do need to head out of state for several hours shortly, but I just wanted to note that I'm not the least bit "offended". Christians ought to be dead to themselves and alive for Christ. With such being the case, any "offense" on my part would only be self-centered. Anyhow, I'll dive back into this thread later this afternoon.
Take care.
Yes, silence always is on these threads.P.S. I trust that you and others will note how Dr.Strangelove conveniently avoided all that I posted in my last response to him. His silence (read avoidance of uncomfortable truths) certainly is deafening
?Oh my goodness.....
Right. I know this... and it's obviously not some known language or you WOULDThe whole point is that if your gonna speak in church you need to speak to THE PEOPLE otherwise you don't edify ANYONE.
I understand this. NO ONE knows... and this tells us it's not some known language.If your publically speaking and no one understands you then only GOD KNOWS what yer saying. You know the phrase 'God knows'??? As in...NO-ONE KNOWS! Your not seaking to anyone.
Speaking to God IS good.ITS NOT GOOD.
LOLZ! (**groan**)
P.S. I trust that you and others will note how Dr.Strangelove conveniently avoided all that I posted in my last response to him. His silence (read avoidance of uncomfortable truths) certainly is deafening.
Not at all.
Paul is not speaking of "learned things" He is speaking of "Spiritual gifts"
This is clear from the get go.
Learning languages is no "Sign"Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers
Exactly. Because this form of tongues is "speaking to God": (which is a 'good' thing)
For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God.
sunlover1: I do need to head out of state for several hours shortly, but I just wanted to note that I'm not the least bit "offended". Christians ought to be dead to themselves and alive for Christ. With such being the case, any "offense" on my part would only be self-centered. Anyhow, I'll dive back into this thread later this afternoon.
Take care.
P.S. I trust that you and others will note how Dr.Strangelove conveniently avoided all that I posted in my last response to him. His silence (read avoidance of uncomfortable truths) certainly is deafening.
Language that is most obvious and easy to be understood is the most proper for public devotion and other religious exercises.
Right. I know this... and it's obviously not some known language or you WOULD be speaking to "the people"
I understand this. NO ONE knows... and this tells us it's not some known language.
Speaking to God IS good.
Speaking in tongues to God audibly where other's hear is what is not good here.
Because even though the tongue speaker blesses God and edifies himself..
he's not edifying the church.. And when we're at church we're to use our
gifts to edify each other.
Oooh. This is a VERY good point too that I never thought of before. Not only is speaking a foreign language no good when there is none around that understands you but ALSO speaking the same language but using complicated words instead of simple easily understood language would cause un-needed confusion to the brethren and would not edify.
Happens all too often on forums when people are trying to show off using their online thesaurus.
Good one COJ.
It would be an 'unknown language' if no-one in the congregation knew the language....UNKNOWN TO THEM! Obviously. But you don't want to see what any logical person (including famous orthodox scholars) see's in those passages coz you wanna justify yerself goin' >>> fah fah gishmeld gusumptifyyyyying hup hup hup onnnnnnnn....
Yeah. By praying to Him. In private. In a language you understand. Not in Babbleonian.
You still dont get it. When Paul says your edifying yourself ONLY. It's like saying you are SELFISH. It's NOT GOOD. Did your parents ever say to you 'you only think about yourself'? Did you think...'oh thats good, I'm thinking about myself! Hooray!'
And he's talking about a language that the listeners don't understand. No man PRESENT. There is no teaching Pro-GIBBERISH in the Bible!
Do u think tongues have ceased?
And to edify (build up) is a good thing and something we're called to do.when paul said he prays in tongues, more than pall, does the text indicate, it was only in meetings?
however, he spoke of those who interp...
27 If any speak in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn, and let someone interpret.
Do u think tongues have ceased?
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