Stupid question but.....exactly what is "crossdressing?"

[BlackSabb]

Hey all fellow CF goers. Now, before you jump to conclusions, I'm happy being a man, have no desire to be a woman or dress/live as a woman and don't have a gay bone in my body.

I do have a reason for asking this question so please bear with me for a moment. Is crossdressing the act of emulating a woman in physical appearance? Or is it specifically dressing in any clothing typically associated with the opposite gender? If crossdressing is defined as dressing in any garment typically associated with the opposite gender, does it make a difference if it's just one article of clothing or more than one? And does it matter if it's for outward show or inward comfort?

Now here is why I ask. I have said this before on CF and I'll happily state it again. For years, I've had troubles with circulation in my lower legs. Problems with excessive cold, cramping, restlessness and soreness. I went to a rheumatologist many years ago who told me that my conditon was genetic and that it would slowly get worse-which is did which is why I eventually saw a rheumatologist. So apart from eating healthy and keeping fit, there is nothing much I could really do.

My wife eventually suggested various tights for me. Not those medical ones (which require a specific medical condition but not my one) but just ordinary womens' tights. And basically in 2 categories-support tights and warm opaque tights. I can say that I have found them helpful and just got so used to wearing them. To me now, it's really nothing for me to put on a pair either at the end of a day at work or at the beginning if I'm not at work. Ironically, my own wife doesn't own a single pair!! She dislikes them herself. And here's the funny part. On those rare occasions she wears a pair to complete a more formal outfit, she just raids my drawer!

I am a little confused as I've read so many definitions of crossdressing. With some people saying that it's dressing to emulate a woman, whilst others saying it's wearing anything associated with the opposite gender, regardless whether it's just one article or many or whether it's for public show or private reasons. So exactly what is "crossdressing?" Because I have to admit, I'm not comfortable with this label.

On another note, there are heaps of unisex sporting and athletic skins/tights avaliable today. The big downfall of those for me are that they don't have an enclosed foot which I really need-especially when it's very cold. Otherwise I'd just wear those and avoid the entire issue of potential crossdressing.

Thanking you for your courteous replies.

 

[andreha]

Hey BlackSabb

There are all kinds of definitions for what exactly constitutes cross dressing. One thing is for sure though - someone who judges you for wearing clothes for medical/health reasons is someone you should not take seriously. There's a big difference between wearing "women's" clothing for perverted reasons, and doing it for genuinely sound reasons. Someone who judges you for it is in dire need of repenance before the Lord.

 

[BlackSabb]

Hey BlackSabb

There are all kinds of definitions for what exactly constitutes cross dressing. One thing is for sure though - someone who judges you for wearing clothes for medical/health reasons is someone you should not take seriously. There's a big difference between wearing "women's" clothing for perverted reasons, and doing it for genuinely sound reasons. Someone who judges you for it is in dire need of repenance before the Lord.

Hey thanks for the (only) reply. Gee, I've been ignored as if I posted a thread about how I have fantasies about donkeys. Yes, different people have different definitons of crossdressing. I've always been self conscious of that term "crossdressing" even though I have no desire whatsover to emulate a woman in any way.

It's pretty obvious by the lack of replies what people are thinking. I'm obviously not normal and acceptable to others. The silence is deafening. Maybe one day when I throw all my hard rock music and throw away the tights my wife bought me and pour all the Scotch down the sink will I be accepted as a regular and normal Christian believing male.

One day;

 

[the.Sheepdog]

Sabb, If you have a circulation problem as do I, those lady tights wont really help much. You really do need to get the overly expensive medical torture hose that helps circulation.

It is uncomfortable for a reason and the maybe more comfortable wife hose just wont do the same job.

and that wouldnt mean you were cross dressing anyway. Now if you add to the hose with a top, skirt, makeup and some cute red pumps then you might be in trouble!

 

[contango]

It's pretty obvious by the lack of replies what people are thinking. I'm obviously not normal and acceptable to others. The silence is deafening. Maybe one day when I throw all my hard rock music and throw away the tights my wife bought me and pour all the Scotch down the sink will I be accepted as a regular and normal Christian believing male.

One day;

Or alternatively that people didn't see your post? I only just saw it myself.

As others have already said I don't see that wearing something normally considered to be feminine clothing to address a specific medical issue would count as "cross dressing". It comes back to the whole question of why you're doing it.

If you were wearing women's clothing for your own sexual pleasures that would fall into the "cross dressing" thing. Since you're not I'd say what you're describing isn't cross dressing.

Not sure what rock music and Scotch have to do with the question.

 

[BlackSabb]

Sabb, If you have a circulation problem as do I, those lady tights wont really help much. You really do need to get the overly expensive medical torture hose that helps circulation.

It is uncomfortable for a reason and the maybe more comfortable wife hose just wont do the same job.

The proper medical support hose are for those with venous insufficiency-faulty venous valves that are not transporting enough lymphatic fluid. I have a completely different problem. Over constriction of peripheral arteries in the cold causing excessive cold and cramping. It's not even the same blood vessels that I have the problem with!

And as someone else said, what do rock music and Scotch have to do with anything? Well, it's just more things that alienate me from the Christian community. I don't belong in either the Christian or secular community so I'm someone who doesn't fit in anywhere. One day maybe I'll conform to everyones expectation of me and maybe then I might be accepted.

 

[FaithPrevails]

I thought I might toss in a female POV for you.

By definition, cross-dressing is wearing clothes made for the opposite sex. However, psychologically-speaking, you would have to be adopting the manners/sexual role of a woman for you to be considered a cross-dresser in the transvestite sense of the term. It is clear from your post that you are not doing it for that reason.

If the hose help, then wear them. If neither you nor your wife take issue with it, then don't worry about what other people might think.

 

[BlackSabb]

I thought I might toss in a female POV for you.

By definition, cross-dressing is wearing clothes made for the opposite sex. However, psychologically-speaking, you would have to be adopting the manners/sexual role of a woman for you to be considered a cross-dresser in the transvestite sense of the term. It is clear from your post that you are not doing it for that reason.

If the hose help, then wear them. If neither you nor your wife take issue with it, then don't worry about what other people might think.

Hey thanks for that! I really appreciated that response. I don't really understand why I felt the need to ask this, as it's a matter between my wife and I and it affects nobody else. But I've been harassed about every other aspect of my life when I've shared with Christians. I am condemned because I love classic hard rock-especially for my favourite band Black Sabbath. I've been condemned because I enjoy a drink (not drunkeness) and have heaps of Scotch and liqueurs. I've been even insulted for being a guy that loves cats. One female pastor told me I was "weird"-I kid you not!

All I could think of lately how an aberration I am, with the things I that like. If I am abnormal and "weird" and sinful and not a proper Christian because I love my hard rock, Scotch and fluffy feline creatures, I shudder to think how totally perverted I am in the eyes of everyone for wearing what my wife initiated and suggested. This is why I posted. My mind lately has been going over and over and over about all the times people put me down for these other things. I have been putting myself down thinking how much worse I am if I continue to wear tights when my legs are a bit sore and restless and cold.

Anyway, thanks for your responses. I do care about the opinions of others to my detriment. I wish I didn't, but that's who I am.

 

[FaithPrevails]

I can totally understand caring too much about what others think. I think the criticism comes from the "what we put into ourselves is what comes out of us" mindset. There can often be a fine line between wordly influence and spiritual influence and sometimes we cross that line without even realizing we're doing it and are living too much of a wordly life.

I believe things like secular music or alcohol are OK in moderation - as long as they are not stumbling blocks to our walk with Christ. When things begin to get in the way of our relationship with Him, that's when we need to re-evaluate our priorities, IMO.

If you keep that as your focus, rather than the opinions of others, then it will be easier to remind yourself that anyone being critical (which is different than holding a brother or sister in Christ accountable) needs to remove the log from their own eye.

 

[BlackSabb]

I can totally understand caring too much about what others think. I think the criticism comes from the "what we put into ourselves is what comes out of us" mindset. There can often be a fine line between wordly influence and spiritual influence and sometimes we cross that line without even realizing we're doing it and are living too much of a wordly life.

I believe things like secular music or alcohol are OK in moderation - as long as they are not stumbling blocks to our walk with Christ. When things begin to get in the way of our relationship with Him, that's when we need to re-evaluate our priorities, IMO.

If you keep that as your focus, rather than the opinions of others, then it will be easier to remind yourself that anyone being critical (which is different than holding a brother or sister in Christ accountable) needs to remove the log from their own eye.

Hey thanks again. The funny thing is that for the last couple of years, I have barely listened to any music or had a drink. Believe it or not, it's not been by deliberate choice or conviction, but because of depression. These days, it's an enormous effort for me to play some music or have a drink or be with friends or make phone calls and keep in contact with others. Because of chronic depression which makes you not want to do anything but your job and that's about it.

I even bought a large remote control helicopter for a bargain on ebay and it's been in the box unopened for over a year now. Again, I just can't muster up the effort to open it, charge it and fly it.

But I still carry around all the criticisms of years past even though I barely engage in any of the same activities. I know it sounds odd, but it's true. I have the username "BlackSabb" but haven't listened to a single piece of music for ages. Same with everything else.

 

[FaithPrevails]

Are you seeing a counselor for your depression?

My husband and I were talking the other day about how 1 negative comment can have the emotional power to wipe out 10 positive ones and the amount of time it can take to let go of the negative ones.

It's definitely not easy. Try googling the term "negative self-speak". There are some great resources for helping people turn around the lies that we've taught ourselves to believe over the years.

 

[BlackSabb]

Are you seeing a counselor for your depression?

My husband and I were talking the other day about how 1 negative comment can have the emotional power to wipe out 10 positive ones and the amount of time it can take to let go of the negative ones.

It's definitely not easy. Try googling the term "negative self-speak". There are some great resources for helping people turn around the lies that we've taught ourselves to believe over the years.

Yes, I've seen a professional counsellor. One piece of advice she gave me was to not wait until I "felt like" doing something enjoyable such as going out, listening to music, having friends over. She insisted I should regularly engage in enjoyable activities even if I don't feel like it, to get me into a routine. She said that it would be mechanical at first, but then I would eventually get back into the swing of things.

Alas, I have never been able to do that and just continue to wait until I "feel like" doing something-which never happens anymore.

 

[FaithPrevails]

No, depression has a way of stealing our joy. I know what a struggle even the simplest tasks can be when depressed. I will be lifting you up in prayer. I'm glad you've found our little corner of CF. I encourage you to continue posting in the Recovery forums. There are some wonderful, supportive members who post here quite regularly.

 

[BlackSabb]

No, depression has a way of stealing our joy. I know what a struggle even the simplest tasks can be when depressed. I will be lifting you up in prayer. I'm glad you've found our little corner of CF. I encourage you to continue posting in the Recovery forums. There are some wonderful, supportive members who post here quite regularly.

Hey thank you-I really appreciate your kindness. This is the reason why I posted this thread originally. I feel so melancholy about so many aspects of my life and this is just one more thing that threatens to make me feel like I'm some outsider-different from everyone else and worthy of nothing but contempt.

My own wife is so very understanding however of me and so is the opposite. So many times she tells me to put my feet up, relax, watch a movie, play some music, go out and buy a bottle of drink and enjoy. All I do these days is just work and on days off, I just either continue to do more work or just vegetate on the couch doing nothing. My wife tries to lighten things up for me whatever it is and so we have begun to grow apart as I continue to slide into melancholy whilst she continues to be bright and chirpy and encourages me to do the same.

I must be the only husband whose wife says to me to go out and buy a bottle of Scotch-I kid you not. Or tells me to listen to some music. Sometimes even when we've gone shopping, she grabs my arm and drags me into the hosiery department of a large store and insists I have a look with her for some tights for me. She has said that it's boring buying them for me on her own. And once she even went a bit nuts and bought a dark green and grey pair!

"You'll look medieval in these" she said with a big grin.... Yes, that's my wife. Always bright and cheerful. Turning everyday events into jolly experiences. And yes, this is me. Sombre, moody and melancholy.

 

[FaithPrevails]

You're quite welcome. Your wife sounds like a lovely person and a real blessing to you. Unconditional love/acceptance can be a hard trait to find in others, so it is such a God thing when we find a partner in life who has that trait.

 

[BlackSabb]

Hey thanks to you and everyone elses reply. I'm feeling a lot better now. I have come to an important realisation-that I don't have to take regard of everyones thoughts and feelings in every aspect of my life.

I re-read all the responses to my thread and one post really struck me. I read it before and didn't think anything of it, but it really hit me when I rediscovered it:

If the hose help, then wear them. If neither you nor your wife take issue with it, then don't worry about what other people might think.

I realised that I will have issues of comparison with other men for the rest of my life because of my past. But only so far as what I reveal to others. I suddenly realised that I don't have to share everything with everyone and in that context, all that matters is myself and/or anyone else involved.

I realised this because when I took a good long hard look at myself, I project the typical guy image quite well publicly. But there are other things I do that I wouldn't let others see. Nothing shameful or sinful, just maybe not conventional.

Sometimes on the weekend, there is nothing more I like to do than watch music television, drinking, eating, more drinking, more eating, to the wee hours of the morning. Most of the time I have a cat sleeping on my lap when doing so. Most other guys might be out at the pub or club drinking and eating with their mates. But I'll be doing the same thing at home with a cat on my lap instead.

I don't share that with others. So why share other things? I realise I don't have to. I also realise that I could just as easily be afraid of being cast as different or non conventional in other things. Even though I sometimes down an entire bottle of Scotch in one night, many guys would think of me as a "wuss" regardles because I did it with a cat on my lap in my own home in the company of my wife as she sat with me crotcheting.

Everytime I think about others I'm going to get disappointed. I might as well disappoint the right people and not the wrong people. So I've resolved to not care about what others think and more importantly-accept the fact that they will think negatively of me. And instead please those that matter to me.

So, if some nobody at work thinks less of me for any reason, so be it. If my wife thinks less of me for some reason, then I need to seriously take that into consideration. That's my position now.

Heck, I might even get a cute little Robin Hood style hat to match the green tights.....

 

[Assyrian]

If you need them, then that is a pretty good reason to get past being self conscious. As for what other people think? Yes I know that can get to you, but I agree with all the other posters - don't let it.

A bigger question is whether they would work or not. I think you are right and that they could constrict your blood flow making things worse. So... have you thought of long johns? Good enough for John Wayne Or buy trousers with a lining. It is the double layer of insulation you are looking for. Better still get your wonderful wife to line your trousers for you. Tackling things from another direction, omega 3 oils or cod liver oil can improve the circulation but talk to you doctor incase they interact with other meds you are on like blood thinners.. If you are sitting down or in bed the traditional way to warm you feet in my family is a hot water bottle behind the knees, though not against bare skin. It warms the blood flowing down through you legs.