Stumbling block in forgivness

[x141]

Emotion goes a long way in bringing us to the end of the image generated by flesh.

 

[Restoresmysoul]

Stumbling blocks come in many forms. The Lord wishes us to be untied in one mind and one voice as much as possible, and all things are to be done for the edification of others. Love and meekness are what matters most. Look at Paul, he did all things for the edification of others, his purpose was to promote peace, righteousness and joy in the spirit. This is what mattered most to him, and its what matters most to God. We can learn much by meditating on Pauls example. Why did paul say these words? He didn't want His knowledge to cause his weaker brethren to stumble, he was always thinking of others. Knowledge is useless if charity is not front and center. What is charity? Charity is a deep study, it is the act of putting others first, its not so easy, and the more knowledge we have the more charity we need as well..



I do not think Paul is referring anything here but food, actual meat. But seeing how some like to use everything as a metaphor or a symbol, then please consider this one-


1 Co 8:12 Thus, sinning against your brothers[e] and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ. 13 Therefore, if food makes my brother stumble, I will never eat meat, lest I make my brother stumble.

Romans 14:21 It is good neither to eat meat nor drink wine nor do anything by which your brother stumbles or is offended or is made weak.[f] 22 Do you have faith?[g] Have it to yourself before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.

 

[x141]

Stumbling blocks are a needful part of the process.

 

[Restoresmysoul]

Stumbling blocks "need" to be put away. Anyone who would suggest that stumbling blocks help people doesn't really understand Pauls doctrine, and doesn't really understand charity and love either. What good does knowledge do if it doesn't lead us on the greatest path which is love? Is love not the greatest? Is the servant not the greatest in the kingdom? Charity serves others but stumbling blocks only cause harm. Wisdom demands that we love each other and walk in meekness and charity, this is wisdom.

Matthew 18:7King James Version (KJV)

7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

 

[Restoresmysoul]

Its not just to help others, but its also to bring God glory. If we cause our brother to stumble it hurts him and doesn't bring God glory either.



Matthew 5:16New King James Version (NKJV)

16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven.

 

[x141]

I know without them I myself would never have known God to the depth I do now, I would have never learned to be thankful for all things, as Job had said, But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil?

Stumbling blocks, the scripture is full of them, Jesus being the chief of them, which in like manner it is what God became to Adam when his soul became separated from him, or separate to him (a garden not enclosed). In Adam’s words, the woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. Up until this time the devil had no place in him, which all of this is in reference to the process of our soul.

When we abide in the light (love your brother, love your enemy, love God, eye that is single, etc.) there is no occasion of stumbling in us, simply put, if we do stumble we are not abiding. Those who stumble, stumble in the darkness of their own mind (or soul that is kept) which puts us at odds, or enmity with the truth of being one with our Father. It is not about what someone else does or does not do, or what someone else says or does not say. It is about our relationship with our father as a son and the enclosing of our garden in relationship to this truth that we are.

Words create such paths in one form, and in the other more akin to the heavens opening in us and pouring out a blessing our soul cannot contain, which the difference between (in one form) is whether our soul rules over us, or we rule over our soul, whether she is a harlot, or whether she is a virgin in respect to thoughts as they relate to seed/seeds sown.

 

[Restoresmysoul]

I know without them I myself would never have known God to the depth I do now, I would have never learned to be thankful for all things, as Job had said, But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil?

You keep trying to paint me as a fool but its not i who keep missing the point, its you bro. I think we should praise the Lord in all circumstances, in both good and bad. However, this doesn't mean that we can justify putting stumbling blocks in front of others, that would be foolish. As the Lord has said- woe unto the man by which the offence comes!

 

[Restoresmysoul]

2 Co 10:12 For we dare not class ourselves or compare ourselves with those who commend themselves. But they, measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.

 

[x141]

Knowledge is a serpent, but all knowledge is no less yours then it is mine.

God does not put disparity between his children.

 

[Restoresmysoul]

Knowledge is not a serpent. Where do come up with this stuff? Peter tells us to add to our faith knowledge, so obviously its not a serpent. Knowledge without charity however is a stumbling block.



2 Peter 1:5New King James Version (NKJV)

Fruitful Growth in the Faith
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge,

 

[Restoresmysoul]

The tree of knowledge, of good and evil, was not the serpent, but the serpent was the devil and he lied about what God had said. So lies are a serpent, but not knowledge.

 

[FanthatSpark]

All,

Meat http://www.christianforums.com/t7808409/ .

Please go, read, stop & self reflect on what is gained and throw the rest to the wayside that strikes in negativity of personal beliefs .

 

[brinny]

"How to Forgive" ~Corrie Ten Boom

Corrie Ten Boom, "How to Forgive" - YouTube

 

[FanthatSpark]

Perception is everything

It is reflective in how God became an adversary to Adam, which made Adam an adversary to God, and therefore Adam his own adversary as something that was chosen (which Adam we are), but in the end found to be a devil that portrayed, yet chosen for this end, or ... needful for the process in becoming the son of God that we are (the first one in ignorance, the last one by understanding); a serpent must be picked up by it's tail).

It is the difference between the Word of God , and the testimony of Jesus Christ as something we possess, which in form are separated as a servant and a son are, though they speak to different aspects of the process as to what they portray, they speak to the same two that are the one truth we are.

In perceptions sake it comes to the foreground in ignorance of Spirit for the child indeed (like self was) and ignorance is sincere that it has no malice in its blindness of self in Spirit. It took time under a change of "perception" to let self go in pouring out to be filled, to later, being (as you eloquently put it) a pouring while being filled in a pureness only He can give to the vessel.

 

[FanthatSpark]

Brinn, brinn ,

Nice referral to Corrie. Take that further to these thoughts here in. For me, forgiveness of all "as the limited being I am" even Satan and let....GOD ... deal with that.

Dante's Inferno at the gates of hell, "Love Made Me"

 

[brinny]

Who gave you that assignment, amigo?

 

[Galilee63]

Hi Fanthatspark,

We can pray for the "Sins of The Fathers" and for all of the Holy Souls in Purgatory, back to Adam and Eve - however - the remainder needs to be handed over to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit for reasons within God's Holy Will.

Why would God The Most High have brought down Jesus Christ our Saviour to suffer the worst kinds of sufferings in order for people to be forgiven their sins through Jesus' Divine Mercy (for those of whom repent), to teach people to repent their sins turning to Jesus/God, and of course to "fulfil God The Most High's Holy Decrees and Holy Prophesies.

"All things visible and 'invisible'.

As God The Most High made clear to Esdra/Ezra, the human mind/being knows not what God our Heavenly Father knows and Decrees.

We can forgive the sinner yet not forgive the "sins" of which are satans and its domain, its evil legions, demons and evil spirits wandering through the earth to destroy and attempt to claim souls of which pass over to meet God in His judgement. As Christians we know this to be a fact.

satan is more than ego, pride, vanity, lust.

satan is the father of all lies, an entity/evil spirit, a murderous spirit and the opposite of God in His Love.

satan 'caused' Adam and Eve to sin ie to disobey God's Commandments and teachings of which 'caused' Jesus to suffer His agonies, Sorrows, Torments and Crucifixion.

I personally am not going to pray for satan at any stage now or eternally however I pray special prayers that Jesus gave to.

God knows satan's will and satan rejected God and His Holy Will right through to date and therefore God does not give satan mercy.

The creature dwells in Hell with no return.

satan's evil spirits, legions and demons are wandering around here tempting people in the committal of sins - the best we can do is Consecrate all hearts souls minds and bodies to Jesus Christ our Saviour's Sacred Heart and to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God's Immaculate Heart for Jesus/God to work through people's hearts, souls and minds.

God in His Holy Will, uses satan for 'some' specific tasks in relation to the benefit of souls eternally, however, we need to realise the fact that satan has rejected God and His forgiveness, causing all of the destruction of God's earth, many of His Children/people of whom God created in His Image, caused paedophilia, murders, wars, rapes, deceit, larceny, theft, all of the Seven deathly sins, right down to the lesser evils.

Nevertheless, I understand where you are coming from with the question Fanthatspark.

Satan does not want forgiveness from God; because satan rejected God The Most High.

Satan dwells within Hell and there is no turning back to God from Hell. Hell is for Eternity until Jesus Christ our Saviour appears here on earth and those in Jesus/Gods Holy Will, of whom dwell in Hell, and have not turned to Jesus Christ our Saviour during their soul journeys will in His Holy Will be destroyed eternally and that includes satan of course and its evil legions, demons/entities and evil spirits.

We are taught this in God The Most High's Old Testament by God and taught this fact by Jesus in His New Testament within Revelations with all things coming to pass and fulfilled within God's Holy Prophesies.

Satan recruits its evil spirits of whom wander through the world for the ruin of souls.

During the last days of the battle of Armegeddon which occurs soon, satan will pursue The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God (and the Church) and every other fact contained within God's Holy Decrees and Prophesies will be fulfilled.

Praying from our hearts for all souls here to be converted to Jesus/God is urgent and essential and in particular for all of our loved ones, families, friends, colleagues and their families too.

"Ask and ye shall receive". Trusting in Jesus Christ our Saviour, praying to Jesus and meditating on Jesus' bitter Passion, His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross in order for Jesus to open the heart wide open to Him, and to "Receive" Jesus speaking to our hearts (through the focussing on Jesus and His bitter Passion regularly).

Jesus said in His Divine Mercy holy Messages:

"Know this, My Daughter, that the prayer most pleasing to Me, is the Prayer for the 'conversion of sinners'. This Prayer is always heard and answered".

Jesus gave His Divine Mercy Chaplet to mankind to pray for the conversion of sinners. This way, Jesus is able to more powerfully through people here on earth, convert many more hearts and souls to Him more quickly. If people are unable to pray this Chaplet as a result of religious beliefs and their Faiths, I understand, however, if people could pray "The Our Fathers", the Paternoster or original Psalter with 150 x The Our Father's - for the conversion of sinners to Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary our Heavenly Mother - one not only has their prayers heard and answered by Jesus/God in His Holy Will, one is indeed Blessed within their souls "eternally" because Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary stated about The Holy Rosary and Psalter to Saint Dominic when appearing to Saint Dominic throughout his life and to the other Saints:

"Dear Dominic, do you know which Weapon The Blessed Trinity wishes to use to reform the World?"

"I want you to know that in this warfare, the battering Ram has always been the Angelic Psalter which is the foundation stone of The New Testament. Therefore, if you want to reach these hardened souls and win them over to God, preach My Psalter".

Jesus said to Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan De La Roche:

Blessed Alan began this great work in 1460 after a special warning from Our Lord, Who wished to spur him on to preach the Holy Rosary, spoke to him in the Sacred Host:

Jesus said:

"How can you crucify Me again so soon?" Jesus said. "What did You say, Lord?", asked Blessed Alan, horrified. "You crucified Me once before by your sins," answered Jesus, "and I would willingly be crucified again rather than have My Father offended by the sins you used to commit. You are crucifying Me again now because you have all the learning and understanding that you need to preach My Mother's Rosary, and you are not doing so. If you only did this you could teach many souls that right path and lead them away from sin - but you are not doing it and so you yourself are guilty of the sins that they commit."

This terrible reproach made Blessed Alan solemnly resolve to preach the Rosary unceasingly.

Our Lady too spoke to him one day to inspire him to preach the Holy Rosary more and more:

"You were a great sinner in your youth," she said, "but I obtained the grace of your conversion from my Son. Had such a thing been possible I would have liked to have gone through all kinds of suffering to save you because converted sinners are a glory to me. And I would have done this also to make you worthy of preaching my Rosary far and wide."

Saint Dominic appeared to Blessed Alan as well and told him of the great results of his ministry: he had preached the Holy Rosary unceasingly, his sermons had borne great fruit and many people had been converted during his missions. He said to Blessed Alan:

"See the wonderful results I have had through preaching the Holy Rosary! You and all those who love Our Lady ought to do the same so that, by means of this holy practice of the Rosary, you may draw all people to the real science of the virtues."

"All priests say a Hail Mary with the faithful before preaching, to ask for God's grace. They do this because of a revelation that Saint Dominic had from Our Lady. 'My son,' she said one day 'do not be surprised that your sermons fail to bear the results you had hoped for. You are trying to cultivate a piece of ground which has not had any rain. Now when Almighty God planned to renew the face of the earth He started by sending down rain from heaven - and this was the Angelic Salutation. In this way God made over the world.

'So when you give a sermon, urge people to say my Rosary, and in this way your words will bear much fruit for souls.'


Saint Louis De Montfort's book: The Secret of The Rosary with Saint Dominic, Blessed Alan De la Roche and other Saints' testimonies of Jesus and our Blessed Virgin Mary appearing to these priests during 1214, 1260 and other years.

www.rosary-center.org/secret.htm



Therefore, if we as Christians wish to see all evil eradicated and all souls saved by Jesus, we must pray from our hearts in complete trust in Jesus for these things to occur.

Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit within God's Holy Prophesies to be fulfilled are going into battle with satan and all of its evil when Jesus appears here on earth soon - with all of God's Holy Decrees and more contained within His Revelations occurring - sooner than we all think.

Jesus gave one of His 600 pages of His Divine Mercy Chaplet and Holy messages to mankind through Saint Faustina about the last days here on earth 'After' Jesus had delivered His Divine Mercy to mankind, of which was done over 40 years ago to Saint Faustina, and that He/Jesus would be appearing on Earth shortly thereafter of which directly reflects all of God The Most High's and Jesus Christ our Saviour's and His Disciples Revelations (600 pages of the Diaries recorded by Saint Sister Faustina).

holyspiritinteractive.net/features/divinemercy

divinemercy.com

(There are many links to read Jesus' Holy messages to mankind through Saint Faustina).

"Write this down, that before My Coming as Judge, I shall come as The King of Mercy. Before the Coming of that day of Justice, there will be a sign in The Heavens. All light will be extinguished in heaven and earth. There will appear in the sky the Sign of The Cross. From each of the Wounds on My Hands and Feet will shine forth a light that will for a brief time brighten the earth. This will be a short time before the last day".

The most powerful weapon against satan is "The Holy Rosary" as Jesus and our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God stated to Saint Dominic a priest of whom Jesus often appeared delivering God The Most High's Holy Rosary. Every negative comment about the Blessed Virgin Mary's Holy Rosary from people is through and by satan. Because, as Jesus and our Lady Mary pointed out to Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan De La Roche, the Holy Rosary is satans worst enemy, the most powerful (by God and The Blessed Virgin Mary) delivered to people here of which Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary hear and answer every Holy Rosary in God's Holy Will, and because people are focussing on Jesus Christ our Saviour Himself, His Holy Cross, His Agony in the Garden of Gethsemane suffered terribly, His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross and His Crucifixion, Resurrection and Ascension into Heaven conquering satan in order for souls to be taken into Jesus' Divine Mercy, to "Receive" Jesus' Divine Mercy, when souls are crossing over to Jesus and God The Most High with The Holy Spirit, at which time, satan is there with its evil legions, demons and evil spirits, trying to grab and claim souls in particular non-believers and believers of whom have not turned to Jesus in heartfelt genuine remorse and repentance of sins during our lives.

That is the reality!

There is no use sugar coating the fact most sadly.


Forgiving satan himself are not Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit's Commandments nor Teachings.

However, I pray Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit for satan to leave all souls/peoples hearts minds souls and bodies here on earth regularly through Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet at 3pm and The Holy Rosary. I then Consecrate all hearts souls minds and bodies here on earth to Jesus' Sacred Heart and to our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God's Holy Immaculate Heart now and forever...for everything is possible for us to pray from our hearts for Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit to answer in His Holy Will!

For the sick and dying to be taken into Jesus' Abyss of Divine Mercy at the hour of their deaths now and forever.

For all of the Holy Souls in Purgatory with alms of the spirit offered up including sacrifices to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit to empty Holy Purgatory through set Prayers that Jesus has given His priests/saints personally.

Love the sinner and hate the sin of which is satan's domain.

Consecrating one's heart to Jesus Christ our Saviour's "Sacred Heart" and Consecrating one's heart to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God's heart after Baptism in The Holy Spirit shows Jesus from our heart that we are His (among other reasons) and allows Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit to flow His Loving Holy Wisdom, Guidance and Enlightenment through each of us while blocking satan just that little bit more btw.

Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[FanthatSpark]

Very nice, sister 63 !

Took a while to look up references , pray and discern . Because much effort has went into that , I stand in awe of it as a, "thesis". That is said in upmost meekness sister. For me, it lacks solution to move forward in Spirit if one holds to non forgiveness of "anything", including Satan. Why? Because we are limited in being and there is no way around that...yet, for me. One either forgives or does not with no shades of gray in the arena of forgiveness . Thus, as time passed through this thread (check date in post 1) it came to me that I am seeking approval of "people" to do that which is required to allow a healthy Spiritual growth . Watch, as this thread tried to hold on to the adversary way of thinking in several different posts stating same thing in different concepts. For me, thinking in adversary format (God/Jesus/me against Satan/world/evil = adversary format) holds the Spirit back in the effort too... hate. What is suggested in "hate the sin not the sinner" still involves hate and can lead to un-forgiveness derived from that hate, following?

I am not Omni, so, in this vessels limitedness of being, I choose Joy, the lightest burden, and let my Father dispense of justice for I am a child who forgives all so no hate can attach itself in the thought process of this little ones mind. Been there done that even to action out of hate . All that just to say , I aint built to hold hate and love at the same time or love and hate which stem into, Forgive or Not? For me, that is reality sister and no grey areas in it for to add grey means lie to the Spirit correct?

How does one re-train the mind to #1. Forget all taught ways and really apply Proverbs 3:5. #2.Understand "all" people are subject to Satan, Rom 3:10 #3. Trust in people = preachers, teachers, moms, dads, grandmoms gdads, sons, daughters, friends, lovers (these are people we trust, correct?) Luke 14:26. For me, not worthy to be a disciple. That verse had me bent for a while there for Jesus preaches hate which conflicts with
1 John 4 :8,16 & 18. Comments?

 

[Restoresmysoul]

Peter tells us to beware of the adversary. We do have an adversary and his intentions are not good. We are not commanded to forgive the devil but instead to resist him. This forgiveness of the devil thing seems like a stumbling block topic to me, it just seems like something that would create debate rather than fellowship in the spirit. And as far as purgatory goes, this concept is hard to believe, it doesn't seem to line up with scripture. The thief on the cross was promised paradise that very day, he didnt seem to go into purgatory. I dont wish to be argumentative, its not my wish or my purpose here. I just feel the need to speak the truth as i see it.

Luke 23:42 Then he said to Jesus, “Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom.”

43 And Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

 

[Restoresmysoul]

The adversary loves to see us debate and come into disagreement and contention. We must beware of this and avoid things which cause unnecessary debate.



Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because[c] your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. 9 Resist him, steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same sufferings are experienced by your brotherhood in the world. 10 But may[d] the God of all grace, who called us[e] to His eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after you have suffered a while, perfect, establish, strengthen, and settle you. 11 To Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.