Solution to the creation/evolution debate...?

[FullMoon]

Science's process is visible to those familiar with it.
Lies are deliberately opaque.

Its "visible to those familiar with it" only because those people have been indoctrinated into that world view. It should be based on logic and reality, things anyone can relate to.

 

[Shemjaza]

What evidence was against it exactly? Could you elaborate. What were their findings?

Taking Genesis literally was initially a problem because there isn't evidence for a consistent global flood that would have destroyed and remade the surface of the Earth. The delicate sedimentary layers and fossil structures would not be left by a process of one gigantic flood over a single year.

This was obvious before modern dating techniques or evolution were even studied.

Its "visible to those familiar with it" only because those people have been indoctrinated into that world view. It should be based on logic and reality, things anyone can relate to.

That's a claim. If it's easy to demonstrate logical flaws in evolution or old Earth, it should be easy to present specific evidence and examples of them.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

What I mean is creation is a viewpoint that has been around for thousands of years (from the beginning of human history), why doesn't science simply test this to begin with, why search for an alternative explanation without first testing this. Seems to me that the scientists are happy with any alternative to creation.

OIC. In as much as creation can be tested, scientists looked for evidence of creation but didn't find any. But they found evidence that didn't match creation, so creation was falsified and other hyotheses were made to explain the unexpected observations.

Also it is clear that many lies are spread through the news, media etc. What makes you think that the scientific community is any different?

Comparing news & media with other fields of activity as far as lies are concerned is logically incoherent - news and media are where lies from all fields of activity, including science, are made public.

Of course, there are liars in science, as in all human endeavours, but the methodologies of science are designed to weed out errors (including lies) by peer review, replication, and so on. Science is designed to be self-correcting in this way, where many other areas of human endeavour are not. The major problems science has to deal with are not so much lies, but systematic errors due to poor science. These will be discovered eventually, but it takes time.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Its "visible to those familiar with it" only because those people have been indoctrinated into that world view. It should be based on logic and reality, things anyone can relate to.

It is based on logic and observation. Explanations are tested by checking their predictions and implications - if the explanation is correct, we should expect to see X and we should not expect to see Y. If we see Y the explanation is false. If we see X the explanation is supported.

 

[Astrid]

They can be trusted when they are logical, speak with common sense, when they speak of things that I can clearly see in reality; not this scientist said this so trust it thing. Logic and reality should be our basis, not what some scientists said.

Of course. And dinosaur bones are as real as it gets.
As anyone with some initiative can determine for themselves.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Well from where you are reasoning from- where only the natural toward body benefit is priority numero uno it doesn't... but for us who have placed faith in God and His Word it is eternal pricelessness!

What do you know about where I am reasoning from? Because thus far everything you've said about me is 100% wrong.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Please elaborate what thought process was erroneous?

I would love to, but alas, now the link seems to be busted again.

So perhaps you, who are intimately familiar with the process, could address my biggest question: why?

Assuming that dinosaurs do not exist, and that the entire paleontological community has been running a massive fraud for the last 200 years, what's their motivation?

 

[enoob57]

What do you know about where I am reasoning from?

by your categorization of self Agnostic...

 

[TLK Valentine]

by your categorization of self Agnostic...

And is a single word on an internet message board really all it takes to achieve understanding of another person, even to the point where you see no need to even ask them a question?

 

[enoob57]

And is a single word on an internet message board really all it takes to achieve understanding of another person, even to the point where you see no need to even ask them a question?

Yes and The Word 'IS' God!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Yes and The Word 'IS' God!

"Agnostic" is God?

I suspect you were more interested in making a funny than a point, but I'm going to ask for some clarification anyway...

 

[enoob57]

"Agnostic" is God?

I suspect you were more interested in making a funny than a point, but I'm going to ask for some clarification anyway...

Agnostic believes you cannot know God thus making His Word to us false... your position denies the purpose God has set forth in His Word
John 15:15 (KJV)
[15] Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Agnostic believes you cannot know God thus making His Word to us false... your position denies the purpose God has set forth in His Word
John 15:15 (KJV)
[15] Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

Sounds like you don't consider yourself God's "servant," but rather His "friend."

...perhaps even an equal?

 

[enoob57]

Sounds like you don't consider yourself God's "servant," but rather His "friend."

Jesus has called us all friend
What does it mean that Jesus is a friend of sinners? | GotQuestions.org

...perhaps even an equal?

How can that which began be equal to Him Who has no beginning?

 

[Yttrium]

Agnostic believes you cannot know God thus making His Word to us false... your position denies the purpose God has set forth in His Word

FYI, that's the "hard" agnostic. Hard agnostics believe that we can't know whether God exists or not. The vast majority of agnostics are "soft" agnostics. They don't have a belief regarding the existence of God. They're simply unsure of whether God exists or not.

I've had a harder time finding hard agnostics than finding geocentrists.

 

[Shemjaza]

FYI, that's the "hard" agnostic. Hard agnostics believe that we can't know whether God exists or not. The vast majority of agnostics are "soft" agnostics. They don't have a belief regarding the existence of God. They're simply unsure of whether God exists or not.

I've had a harder time finding hard agnostics than finding geocentrists.

Interesting is that we don't seem to see as many Geocentrists around here as we used to.

I think these days if they are that far into a super-literalist, conspiracy mindset they go all the way to Flat Earth.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Jesus has called us all friend
What does it mean that Jesus is a friend of sinners? | GotQuestions.org

"The fact that Jesus is a friend of sinners means that He is our friend and is waiting for us to acknowledge His presence and availability. God’s love for us is almost beyond imagining. When we consider Jesus’ Incarnation—His leaving heaven to be born as a helpless human infant in order to grow and experience life among us—we begin to get a glimmer of the depth of that love. When we add to that His sacrificial death on the cross, it is staggering."

Only problem is that Jesus wasn't nearly as "helpless" as human beings tend to be.

How can that which began be equal to Him Who has no beginning?

Then your Bible verse means you don't know God as well as you would like us to think...

 

[Yttrium]

I think these days if they are that far into a super-literalist, conspiracy mindset they go all the way to Flat Earth.

Well, I do know of a group of Catholic geocentrists. A couple of them used to argue against evolution (and much of physics) on another forum I used to visit. And one of those two visited here for a short time, but that was before I joined.

 

[enoob57]

Only problem is that Jesus wasn't nearly as "helpless" as human beings tend to be.

That is why the cross was necessary for The Son to pass through... He, Jesus, literally gave up all of Himself yet love still remained
Luke 23:34 (KJV)
[34] Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.
1 John 4:8 (KJV)
[8] He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
It was the cross that proved He was God.... not miracles, not earthy anything just the fact He could not be made to hate and when all was stripped from Him Love remained....

 

[enoob57]

FYI, that's the "hard" agnostic. Hard agnostics believe that we can't know whether God exists or not. The vast majority of agnostics are "soft" agnostics. They don't have a belief regarding the existence of God. They're simply unsure of whether God exists or not.

I've had a harder time finding hard agnostics than finding geocentrists.

soft or hard they have His Word and it testifies of The Who of God... do you think God will be tolerant for those who do not bother to look there?