Slavery, a Guide

[Clizby WampusCat]

Can you just read it again and move on?

You would like that.

Practiced slavery, did slavery, had slaves - ?? What are you seeing as the distinction here?

I never used those terms did I. I used "may have slaves" which the bible says, very different than practiced slavery, did slavery or had slaves.

Yes, it’s in the bible - that’s how we know about it. What do you imagine I’m avoiding? Are you trying to say there is some sort of difference between different ways of saying that in ancient Israel slavery was practiced/done/however you want to say it? Or that having some guidance about how to manage slaves is of some special significance?

This is getting funny and a little sad. You purposely will not use the word "may" which I am constantly referring to.

Is "You may have slaves" the same as "You had slaves" or "You practiced slavery" or "You did slavery"?

The answer is no, it is not.

 

[Tom 1]

He refuses to see what is plain to see. I get it, 3 years ago I would have refused to see it as well. To not see that the word "may" at minimum allows slavery is an indication of some sort of cognitive dissonance or avoidance tactic in his brain.

This is getting rather strange. At what point did you get the idea that I think the bible doesn’t allow/condone/insert your own similar word slavery? Whose posts have you been reading? Again, yes slavery is in the bible, the Jews had slaves, some Christians have slaves - is there some other dimension in which I am saying that didn’t happen and that the bible is anti-slavery?

 

[Tom 1]

I never used those terms did I. I used "may have slaves" which the bible says, very different than practiced slavery, did slavery or had slaves

Ok now I see what you are getting at. What do you think the difference is?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You’re not making any sense dude. You support modern slavery with your $, but God somehow should have stopped an ancient civilisation from having slaves. How? Tell me how that would have worked? At least have a go at it. Then you can move on to how God could have prevented war and a whole host of other things that are among the root causes of slavery. Just have a go, please, at a reality based answer.

You refuse to see distinction don't you? You can say I support it but I do not have the authority to allow or stop it. Our God has the authority to stop this kind of slavery. Why does it even exist if your god is moral?

 

[Tom 1]

You would like that.

I never used those terms did I. I used "may have slaves" which the bible says, very different than practiced slavery, did slavery or had slaves.

This is getting funny and a little sad. You purposely will not use the word "may" which I am constantly referring to.

Is "You may have slaves" the same as "You had slaves" or "You practiced slavery" or "You did slavery"?

The answer is no, it is not.

If you remember you responded to a post in which I pointed out to you the bible says people may have slaves, it wasn’t all that long ago. You’re repeating my own words back to me, and saying I won’t accept them - ?

 

[Tom 1]

Our God has the authority to stop this kind of slavery.

How? Do you think God should come down and stop lithium battery production, is that the kind of thing you mean, or something else?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Ok now I see what you are getting at. What do you think the difference is?

It should be obvious.

Definition of "may": have permission to, you may go now: be free to, a rug on which children may sprawl— C. E. Silberman—used nearly interchangeably with can

Had, did and practiced are not permissive words, they are descriptive. May is a permissive word. That is the difference.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

If you remember you responded to a post in which I pointed out to you the bible says people may have slaves, it wasn’t all that long ago. You’re repeating my own words back to me, and saying I won’t accept them - ?

Please answer my question.

Is "You may have slaves" the same as "You had slaves" or "You practiced slavery" or "You did slavery"?

 

[Tom 1]

You refuse to see distinction don't you? You can say I support it but I do not have the authority to allow or stop it. Our God has the authority to stop this kind of slavery. Why does it even exist if your god is moral?

What distinction? If people refused to buy goods made using child and slave labour, then those goods wouldn’t sell, and the companies involved would either have to change their practices or go into another business. You see - you can make choices that would contribute to the ending of child labour, you could make your stand, do something about it. However what you actually do is use that phone to make meaningless posts about your belief in your own moral superiority and other random stuff.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

How? Do you think God should come down and stop lithium battery production, is that the kind of thing you mean, or something else?

You want me to believe your God created everything by speaking but cannot stop slavery?

 

[cvanwey]

Please make some sense! Please. No more bizarre analogies or random stuff please. You can read earlier posts and respond to those if you like, point by point. If you haven’t got something reality based, actual things to say about actual real things, please spare me the fortune cookie stuff. Life is too short. Get out and enjoy the sunshine instead.

If you cannot make sense out of the basic given analogy, then I cannot help you.

 

[Tom 1]

It should be obvious.

Definition of "may": have permission to, you may go now: be free to, a rug on which children may sprawl— C. E. Silberman—used nearly interchangeably with can

Had, did and practiced are not permissive words, they are descriptive. May is a permissive word. That is the difference.

Sure, exactly as I pointed out to you in the earlier message you responded to - may = permit. There’s no need for such circumlocutions, yes the bible permits slavery - as I have repeatedly said - it’s right there in the text. It’s what people did, they did it, it was a permissible practice. Slavery developed along with the very first instances of humanity we know anything much about beyond what they looked like.

 

[Tom 1]

If you cannot make sense out of the basic given analogy, then I cannot help you.

Thank God for that.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

What distinction? If people refused to buy goods made using child and slave labour, then those goods wouldn’t sell, and the companies involved would either have to change their practices or go into another business. You see - you can make choices that would contribute to the ending of child labour, you could make your stand, do something about it. However what you actually do is use that phone to make meaningless posts about your belief in your own moral superiority and other random stuff.

Nope, I am on my computer. I hate using the phone for posts. Do you think that if I stopped buying cell phones slavery would stop? If so, then I would. However, they would just use slave and child labor for another product. I cannot stop it or give permission for it by myself as you pointed out. Tell me how me or even everyone stopped buying cell phones would stop child and slave labor forever. That would be a great humanist thing to do. I don't know how to do that. The world is waiting.

 

[Tom 1]

You want me to believe your God created everything by speaking but cannot stop slavery?

How? How would that work? How, for another example would God stop war?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Sure, exactly as I pointed out to you in the earlier message you responded to - may = permit. There’s no need for such circumlocutions, yes the bible permits slavery - as I have repeatedly said - it’s right there in the text. It’s what people did, they did it, it was a permissible practice. Slavery developed along with the very first instances of humanity we know anything much about beyond what they looked like.

Thank you. It is an immoral book.

 

[Tom 1]

Nope, I am on my computer. I hate using the phone for posts. Do you think that if I stopped buying cell phones slavery would stop? If so, then I would. However, they would just use slave and child labor for another product. I cannot stop it or give permission for it by myself as you pointed out. Tell me how me or even everyone stopped buying cell phones would stop child and slave labor forever. That would be a great humanist thing to do. I don't know how to do that. The world is waiting.

Sure, my mum is part of a group that informs people on how to buy ethically sourced phones. Just google ‘buy ethical’ and you’ll find all kinds of things you can do that make a difference.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

How? How would that work? How, for another example would God stop war?

I am beginning to think you are a troll. Is god not smart enough to figure that out? Maybe start killing people that are enslaving others and make it known that anyone who enslaves another will be killed on the spot.

I am guessing your response will be: "Dude stop making things up"

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Sure, my mum is part of a group that allows people to buy ethically sourced phones. Just google ‘but ethical’ and you’ll find all kinds of things you can do that make a difference.

Not an answer to my question. How does me buying ethically sourced phones stop child and forced slavery forever? How does it stop it if everyone buys ethically sourced phones?

 

[cvanwey]

Thank God for that.

You are, BTW, in affect, calling your own analogy bazaar I demonstrated why it fails. You care not to address it, or to demonstrate why my counter points are invalid. It's very telling indeed. But I'll give you a second chance. Post #187.