Should women be preachers in church?

[Paidiske]

Paul worked alongside, and commended, women with leadership roles which would have included what we would today think of as preaching. Such as Phoebe, a deacon; Junia, an apostle; multiple women who presided over worship gatherings in their homes; and so on. Any words which seem to deny that women can be gifted, called and authorised for such work, must be read alongside the clear NT evidence that they did such work in the earliest church, with the approval and support of the men (such as Paul).

I'm not sure why this thread is in this forum, but let me point out that it's not a debate forum, and the SOP includes: "Any discussions about Scripture and Christian theology should be done in a spirit of love and humility, exhibiting mutual respect and grace towards one another, with the goal of increasing spiritual insight and knowledge with the Holy Spirit's guidance. Discussions should not turn into a heated debate. Members who participate in this forum are not here to win an argument or prove a point, they are here to learn from one another and grow spiritually. We would like this forum to remain a safe place where Christian members from all denominations can learn more about being a disciple of Christ and following Him."

I would gently point out that a spirit of love, humility and mutual respect does not tell women in ministry that they have no business in doing what they do, or the like. Nor is that conducive to this forum being a safe place for all to participate.

 

[RileyG]

As James Brown once sang, "This is a man's world. But it would be nothing without a woman or a girl."

What does that have to do with the topic at hand? Women can do others things in Church other than lead in Word and Sacrament.

 

[timothyu]

Women can do others things in Church other than lead in Word and Sacrament.

You wouldn't have a church if it wasn't for a woman AND no man was needed LOL

 

[RileyG]

You wouldn't have a church if it wasn't for a woman AND no man was needed LOL

You're right! Both are needed!

 

[Oneofhope]

Caring and thinking of others comes more naturally to a woman. If that is what our religion had become about, they would have been all over it.

These are very interesting things to say. I must have read them 8 times or more. I struggle to put your two sentences together and then relate them to what I wrote. Can you expand a bit?

 

[Oneofhope]

I agree that the first woman was the witness to the resurrection, but NO WOMAN has any business being on the altar as a leader in word and Sacrament. Those roles are reserved for men alone.

Just curious . . . what would the fallout be, or let's say that punishment to fit the crime, if a woman were to serve in these ways? Is there a cost? Is something lost? Would the Saving Plan of God not be heard even if she were to speak it perfectly?

It's a true mystery.

 

[jacorian]

I see no problem with women as preachers & there are many across a number of religions. Anatomy should have nothing to do with it. Some women can just weave thru fantastic sermons.

 

[RileyG]

Just curious . . . what would the fallout be, or let's say that punishment to fit the crime, if a woman were to serve in these ways? Is there a cost? Is something lost? Would the Saving Plan of God not be heard even if she were to speak it perfectly?

It's a true mystery.

I’m not sure I’m following you. There is no crime.

 

[trophy33]

You wouldn't have a church if it wasn't for a woman AND no man was needed LOL

Church (meaning "called from the world", originally) cannot happen without a woman? How does that work, logically?

God can call whomever He wants, its not dependent on any gender.

Sure, the way it happened included women (like Mary, the mother of Jesus) and men (like Joseph or the apostles). But its just saying that it happened in the way it happened, its does not mean "it would not happen if it happened differently".

 

[timothyu]

cannot happen without a woman? How does that work, logically?

No Jesus, no church. Jesus needed a mother but not a human father. Told them huh.

 

[trophy33]

Jesus needed a mother but not a human father

Its just how it was the best to happen. But when we talk about "can/cannot", we are getting into the realm of God's omnipotence.

 

[timothyu]

Its just how it was the best to happen.

Still it knocked men off their self imposed pedestal.

 

[trophy33]

Still it knocked men off their self imposed pedestal.

I do not think that the natural fact that women are physically bearing and nurturing children is related to that in any way. Men knew it before, every man was also a child.

 

[trophy33]

I know plenty of caring and compassionate men. I disagree with this statement.

I think its more about a distribution curve.

There are many compassionate and caring men and there are many women who are cruel and without compassion. However, I think that the highest concentration of compassionate and caring people will be in the women's group, which is given by their history with taking care of children, i.e. about the weak ones.

On the other hand, men are more willing to give up their life and to be physically hurt for their loved ones. Which is, again, given by our history.

 

[timothyu]

I do not think that the natural fact that women are physically bearing and nurturing children is related to that in any way. Men knew it before, every man was also a child.

Just saying if men think women weren't/aren't good enough to teach it wouldn't hurt to remind them they played no part in the creation of what they teach about, Jesus wise. So before pulling rank they should remember they were late to this particular game.

 

[trophy33]

Just saying if men think women weren't/aren't good enough to teach it wouldn't hurt to remind them they played no part in the creation of what they teach about, Jesus wise. So before pulling rank they should remember they were late to this particular game.

I am not sure what you mean.

 

[Strong in Him]

So Paul was just blowing smoke when he said this?

1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

No. Paul is stressing that a bishop should have ONE wife, not several. People have read into the text "he says 'wife' therefore he has to be talking about a man".
Question is, are people as willing to insist on, and apply, the rest of the passage?

Now the overseer is to be above reproach, faithful to his wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. 4 He must manage his own family well and see that his children obey him, and he must do so in a manner worthy of full[a] respect. 5 (If anyone does not know how to manage his own family, how can he take care of God’s church?) 6 He must not be a recent convert, or he may become conceited and fall under the same judgment as the devil. 7 He must also have a good reputation with outsiders, so that he will not fall into disgrace and into the devil’s trap.

So if you really believe that these are qualifications, and qualities, for a modern day clergyman, all ordinands:
- have to have a wife (no single man can be ordained.)
- be able to offer hospitality (not his wife, he, himself)
- must not get drunk (maybe not even drink)
- must be able to teach
- must be respectable, even tempered, gentle and not quarrelsome.
- must have children.
- must be able to control his children so that they obey him.
- cannot be a recent convert. (How recent is 'recent? That's open to interpretation.)
- must have a good reputation with those outside the church.

In all the discussions/debates about this, many people pick on verse 3 and use it to "prove" that a woman cannot be ordained. Yet I have never heard anyone say, "you can't go for ordination because your teenage son rebelled/your daughters disobeyed your wishes." "We have to turn you down as a Minister/preacher; you're not married and you have a bad temper." If Catholics believed, and applied, these verses, their priests and bishops would be allowed to marry.
So was Paul "blowing smoke" when he said that a bishop had to have children and make sure that they obeyed him?

And the OP asked whether women preachers should be in church; not whether women should be ordained, or even preach at all.

 

[Strong in Him]

I agree that the first woman was the witness to the resurrection, but NO WOMAN has any business being on the altar as a leader in word and Sacrament. Those roles are reserved for men alone.

In the Catholic church, maybe.
Elsewhere, women preach and are ordained as called by God.

 

[Strong in Him]

I'm not sure why this thread is in this forum, but let me point out that it's not a debate forum,

Thank you; I hadn't noticed which forum this was in.
I'll withdraw now before I get too carried away.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

I hear that some say women are not suppose to preach. But looking at 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 KJV, the verses are talking to married men, and says let “Your” women.
34 “Let “your” women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
34 “And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

The reason for this relates to this verses, which explains the law Paul is referring to under a marriage covenant:
1 Corinthians 7:39 KJV
The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth…..
1 Corinthians 11:3 KJV
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

I don’t see scriptures saying an unmarried woman cannot preach. If a woman is not married, she has no man over her, therefore if she chooses to preach, there is no marriage covenant to break.

honestly, it's biblical for a woman to keep silent in church, but honestly if the pastor is speaking, even i as a guy hope i would keep silent as well. The pastor is speaking and therefor The Holy Spirit who is hopefully the one leading the pastor is also speaking.

We should be quick to listen, especially to the one who God has appointed as pastor.

That being said, there are a lot of things that modern christianity has done away with, like women should cover their heads, a man should not cover their heads. If we're gonna pick and choose what we follow...idk there's a lot that modern christianity does that i disagree with. i wish we strived to do what God wanted and stopped trying to just go our own way.

May Jesus's Will be our own will, and may Jesus have mercy when He returns