She begs an interesting question

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

I am opposed to the death penalty. After all, "he who is without sin should cast the first stone." However, to honor Romans 13, Christians should respect the laws of the land. Therefore, if anyone, regardless of immigration status, commits a crime worthy of the death penalty, public executions would send a clear message that would discourage others from such activities. Remember, Jesus was publicly tried and executed.

We discussed this in another thread. Romans 13 does not give the government a blank check to impose any law it deems necessary, nor does it compel Christians to obey every government law. Death Penalty is unbiblical and immoral. I am not suggesting Christian should vandalize property to protest against the death penalty, but neither should they support it.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

As a Christian I am all for the public execution of anyone who commits such violent crimes as rape and murder - whether they be citizens or not.

Justice is a sentiment I enjoy year-round.

And I noticed the headline did not mention that she proposed this for violent criminals - not just illegal aliens in general.

Misleading.

As a Christian, how do you practice "loving your enemy and praying for them" while witnessing the public execution of your enemy?

 

[Aryeh Jay]

As a Christian, how do you practice "loving your enemy and praying for them" while witnessing the public execution of your enemy?

You can say a prayer for them before the trigger is pulled.

 

[Hammster]

That's your only disagreement? You agree only immigrants should be getting the death penalty for those crimes?

I thought that was clear.

 

[Pommer]

As a Christian, how do you practice "loving your enemy and praying for them" while witnessing the public execution of your enemy?

This is an easy one, even a heathen (like me) can answer this…if I, myself, have committed crimes such as these, I would fully expect to die (as I would expect a fully committed Christian to “pray for me” while they support my elimination).

 

[Pommer]

I thought that was clear.

Do you then not support capital punishment for citizens, accused/convicted of the same crimes?

 

[Hammster]

As a Christian, how do you practice "loving your enemy and praying for them" while witnessing the public execution of your enemy?

Because justice isn’t thrown out the window in the new covenant.

 

[Hammster]

Do you then not support capital punishment for citizens, accused/convicted of the same crimes?

I do.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

Because justice isn’t thrown out the window in the new covenant.

Justice was reversed; the criminals were freed, and the innocent man took on all sins, paying with his own life on the cross.

“He himself bore our sins” in his body on the cross, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; “by his wounds you have been healed.”

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

This is an easy one, even a heathen (like me) can answer this…if I, myself, have committed crimes such as these, I would fully expect to die (as I would expect a fully committed Christian to “pray for me” while they support my elimination).

If you are not a Christian, I will not engage in a debate on this issue from a Christian perspective. However, for Christians who claim that their sins were atoned for by Jesus, the Son of God, yet believe that the death penalty is justified, I question the consistency of their theology.

 

[Pommer]

I do.

Everyone is worthy of death should they commit such crimes and go through all of the due process they‘re entitled to.
I admire your consistency.

 

[Pommer]

If you are not a Christian, I will not engage in a debate on this issue from a Christian perspective. However, for Christians who claim that their sins were atoned for by Jesus, the Son of God, yet believe that the death penalty is justified, I question the consistency of their theology.

My rather limited understanding of justice betwixt the God of the Bible and the people adhering to Christianity is that every human being is going to die [spiritual death, aka “hell”] unless they’re buddies with the Judge’s Son.

 

[jacorian]

If you are not a Christian, I will not engage in a debate on this issue from a Christian perspective. However, for Christians who claim that their sins were atoned for by Jesus, the Son of God, yet believe that the death penalty is justified, I question the consistency of their theology.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

My rather limited understanding of justice betwixt the God of the Bible and the people adhering to Christianity is that every human being is going to die [spiritual death, aka “hell”] unless they’re buddies with the Judge’s Son.

You summarized Christianity accurately in modern language.

 

[jacorian]

Yes it begs the question & this is a common & confusing topic. Which way is it? Frankly, we don't know. It differs from denomination to denomination. It kind of makes sense to me that when Christ said on the cross "It is finished." Then indeed it is finished. Because to have to come back & visit again & again every event in our lives would make it seem then that epic battle was not enough. He said to his fellow crucifixants, that they would be with him in paradise that day. Makes sense. Once & for all. That is the standard. Humans can never be perfect. We have been wobbling around for 2000 years & behavior never improves for the liking. So the standard was set back then. So then what does God do with the worst among us...all the dictators or epic murderers. Well we don't know the real answer; it's not ours for the knowing. Christ would ask, what do you care, it's not your burden. Mankind does not have a good track record so it makes sense that the bar is not set real high. Christ did it so we are taken care of by grace. However, when I pondered this issue, this is how I separate it out. Institutions of faith have never conquered evil for all time. It's a constant struggle. So evil exists for all time. There is always that epic battle. The reality--we lose good people, we lose the innocent. So where do they end up? Well if they are lost to the abyss, then there would be no point. Our faith would be in vain & we are then predestined. I think where God steps in, is he knows mankind is fallible. No it's not about going thru life with a guilt conscience every step. God I remember growing up how being late for Church was considered a sin. Not exactly health for one. Actually it can be observed in the chronicle of civilization. What do all the bad guys have in common? They are very successful in extinguishing faith & human beings & much mass destruction & dividing us. Their common attribute--these individuals, by their own volition, seek to usurp the power & omniscience of God & that is a rung on the ladder one cannot tackle. That is the ultimate sin & unforgiveable. God works thru people yes but those burdens are taken with humility. The arrogance of leaders thru-out time has been well-recorded. Those souls are whom Christ evaluates for hell. It makes sense that this is the bar that separates. We often grow up thinking that every sinner ends up in hell--the common thief, the assailant, the embezzler. If that were true, then most of us don't climb out. So there is a deeper truth inside. Remember the 2 criminals that died with Christ. But the leader is held to the higher burden & most leaders, given to folly, always stumble big time. It is a difficult issue because don't forget we have many faiths & perceptions around the world. Even the story of Judas, well the Bible is wholly silent on this. Was he elected to carry this chore out? Did he or did he not repent? Was he a tool of God? The Catechism of the Catholic Church says, his fate is known only but to God. It's that difficult an issue. Certainly one of curiosity. The likes of the Herods, Caesar, Pilate, the list goes on.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Do you then not support capital punishment for citizens, accused/convicted of the same crimes?

I fully support the same sentence for the same crime regardless of citizenship. I also support mandatory sentences for violent crimes

At the end of said sentence the illegal alien is deported to his home country.

 

[Zaha Torte]

I think that what I was pointing out was blazingly obvious.

You were trying to claim that all rapists would become murderers if the punishment for rape was the same as murder.

You were arguing that capital punishment is not a viable deterrent to heinous crimes like rape and murder.

I don't know of any data that supports that conclusion.

 

[Zaha Torte]

As a Christian, how do you practice "loving your enemy and praying for them" while witnessing the public execution of your enemy?

They aren't my enemy. Public executions are not forms of entertainment - but a means to deter future crime, serve justice and provide solace to the victims and their families.

Part of loving someone is your desire for them to repent of their sins and receive forgiveness from God - which in the cases of the most heinous of sins - would require justice to have its due.

It is also loving the victims of heinous crimes and their families to not only appropriately punish the perpetrator of the crime, but to do whatever possible to prevent more victims.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

They aren't my enemy. Public executions are not forms of entertainment - but a means to deter future crime, serve justice and provide solace to the victims and their families.

Part of loving someone is your desire for them to repent of their sins and receive forgiveness from God - which in the cases of the most heinous of sins - would require justice to have its due.

It is also loving the victims of heinous crimes and their families to not only appropriately punish the perpetrator of the crime, but to do whatever possible to prevent more victims.

Could you please provide any supporting verses from the New Testament for this? If you cannot support your statement with a Biblical verse, then it remains an opinion rather than Biblical.

 

[Zaha Torte]

Could you please provide any supporting verses from the New Testament for this? If you cannot support your statement with a Biblical verse, then it remains an opinion rather than Biblical.

The New Testament does not speak directly about capital punishment - either for or against - yet there is ample evidence in the Old Testament that God does support the practice for various offenses.

However - there are a couple examples from Paul that prove that at least he understood and taught that the faithful were to be subject to Man's laws and that Man had authority to punish offenders even to death.

"Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake." (Romans 13:1-5)

God has ordained the powers on Earth and the faithful should be subject to them and that these powers "beareth the sword" and act as a "revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil" - and the faithful should not only be subject for wrath, but also for "conscience sake".

The governance of Man has been ordained by God and they can punish evil-doers - even by use of the sword (death) - and it is done as a form of "revenge" or inflicting retribution or justice - and for the sake of the conscience of the people - to preserve order.

"Then said Paul, I stand at Cæsar’s judgment seat, where I ought to be judged: to the Jews have I done no wrong, as thou very well knowest.

For if I be an offender, or have committed any thing worthy of death, I refuse not to die: but if there be none of these things whereof these accuse me, no man may deliver me unto them. I appeal unto Cæsar." (Acts 25:10-11)

As a Roman citizen - Paul appealed to Caesar's judgment - yet he claimed that he was willing to die if he had committed any offense worthy of that punishment.

Paul understood that no Man was above the laws of the land and that there were crimes that could cause the offender to be worthy of death and that execution could be an appropriate punishment.

God has ordained Man's governments to execute judgment to preserve order and to bring justice upon the offenders and to assuage the conscience of the offended - and this could be accomplished by execution when appropriate.

I personally believe that one of the causes of the many plights we have in our society stems the fact that we are refusing more and more to execute righteous judgment and put to death those that deserve it.