Seperation of Church and State gone too far?

[Ringo84]

It is one thing to have separation of church and state. It is quite another to have universities that are funded through state and federal taxes but where lecturers stand before their classes and blatantly tell them that they will spend the entire quarter attacking religion, especially Christianity and Judaism.

I witnessed this in a philosophy class that was a required course for all students attending that university. The professor went on to say that his goal was to have at least 1/3 of the class become agnostics and another 1/3 become atheists as a direct result of his lectures. Then for the rest of the quarter, every lecture was aimed at an attempt to tear down religion, with special bile directed at Christianity and Judaism.

And why was he doing this? In order to promote his 'pet' philosophy, he first had to negate the moral directives contained in both these major religions. Then he taught a philosophy called 'hard determinism', in which ho one has any control over what they think, say and do, and therefore there is no such thing as good and evil.

Well, this professor is entitled to their opinion, but I do agree that indoctrination of any kind should be kept out of the classroom.

I'm not sure that this is a church/state issue as much as it's a "how the university system works" issue.
Ringo

 

[Texas Lynn]

No reputable historians even consider Barton a reputable historian. He is, as you rightly pointed out, an ideologue and propagandist - one who paints himself as an expert on this issue, but knows nothing about it.
Ringo

Barton is also a member of the Republican National Committee.

 

[Texas Lynn]

It is one thing to have separation of church and state. It is quite another to have universities that are funded through state and federal taxes but where lecturers stand before their classes and blatantly tell them that they will spend the entire quarter attacking religion, especially Christianity and Judaism.

I witnessed this in a philosophy class that was a required course for all students attending that university. The professor went on to say that his goal was to have at least 1/3 of the class become agnostics and another 1/3 become atheists as a direct result of his lectures. Then for the rest of the quarter, every lecture was aimed at an attempt to tear down religion, with special bile directed at Christianity and Judaism.

And why was he doing this? In order to promote his 'pet' philosophy, he first had to negate the moral directives contained in both these major religions. Then he taught a philosophy called 'hard determinism', in which ho one has any control over what they think, say and do, and therefore there is no such thing as good and evil.

This is as much inappopriate as would be a professor using his lectern to get people to affiliate with his religion were it something theistic.

I would have to say in most cases I suspect this professor would do very poorly in student evaluations and this would be taken into consideration as needed. Certainly tenure would be a factor but while administration may address a complaining student's needs without affecting the offending professor's status faculty politics in most circumstances do not accomodate that sort of dogmaticism.

 

[bliz]

The "separation of church and state" phrase which they invoked, and which has today become so familiar, was taken from an exchange of letters between President Thomas Jefferson and the Baptist Association of Danbury, Connecticut, shortly after Jefferson became President.http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=123

The Rev. Roger Williams used the phrase prior to Jefferson.

 

[Texas Lynn]

The Rev. Roger Williams used the phrase prior to Jefferson.

For those who don't know, Roger Williams was the Baptist Minister run out of Massachusetts by the Puritans who founded Rhode Island as a refuge for religious dissidents. From the beginning Rhode Island developed a vigorous tradition of freedom that we would do well to emulate today.

 

[champuru]

Barton is also a member of the Republican National Committee.

I love the way Barton tries to equate Democrats to the KKK
He doesnt even have a degree in any kind of history, he was just a science teacher (no doubt what kind of "science" he taught) that decided he was a historian one day. By that same measure I'm a historian because I had to research where this guy was wrong

 

[Ringo84]

Barton is also a member of the Republican National Committee.

That fits. His interests on this issue aren't historical, but agenda-driven.
Ringo

 

[Texas Lynn]

Barton is merely a religious right figure with no authority beyond a loud mouth.

 

[revanneosl]

His credential: a BA in Religious Education from.........

......wait for it!.......

......Oral Roberts! ("a 900 foot Jesus appeared to me and told me to build this medical center")