Mid-Trib Only scoffers(anyone can type in)

Hazrus

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Because you heard people says its a barcode doesn't make it a symbolic event... If you think this is a symbolic event than you simply do not believe and its as simple as that. Not to fret though there is a place for non believers like you ;)
Are you saying that if I don't believe in a physical mark, I will not be saved?
 
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John S

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The 'woman' of Revelation 12:1-16 escapes the GT.
They are those people who stand firm in their faith and refuse to agree, when the Anti-Christ makes a peace treaty with new Israel. Daniel 11:32
After the 1260 days of the GT, Jesus will Return and His angels will gather them back from their place of safety. Matthew 24:31
O.K. - I stand corrected.
MAYBE the 144,000 members of the One and Only True Church of Jesus Christ, will be Raptured - and not every Tom, Dick, and Harry.
 
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John S

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thank you for this discussions. It has been interesting. scoffers are indeed welcome, but remember, the whole point of this discussion is respectful discussion.

Lately, It pains me to see that there are too many falling away and people who start to disbelieve in the bible.
It will be very hard to disbelieve in the bible because of how many people have died believing in the scriptures and maintaining their faith in Jesus in the face of death. For example, I've read a book called Foxe book of martyrs. This book has countless short testimonies about people who were threatened to renounce their belief in Jesus, yet they refused, and they died in their belief. as for revelations, it is a very difficult book to understand, thats why we have this discussion to help each other understand better. I believe that the time is very near, but we are in the period of Matthew 24 where the world is going through birthing pain.

The most important thing for christians to do is to keep our eyes fixed on Jesus and stand strong with the armour of God.

P
What do you mean when you say that people are starting to disbelieve the Bible?
 
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keras

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O.K. - I stand corrected.
MAYBE the 144,000 members of the One and Only True Church of Jesus Christ, will be Raptured - and not every Tom, Dick, and Harry.
A little more correction: The 144K are selected from out of the great multitude of true Christian believers, gathered from the nations and settled into all of the holy Land. Revelation 7:9 & 5:9. They go out to the world in pairs to proclaim the coming Kingdom of Jesus. Isaiah 66:19 confirms this. Luke 10:1-10 gives the precursor. The angel flying over the earth, Revelation 14:6-7, is just a metaphor for how these missionaries will preach to all peoples.
 
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Ronald

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The Great Tribulation is near, possibly within two years. Why? I look at the key prophecies identifying the time of the end. Israel became a nation in 1948 and recaptured Jerusalem in 1967. The gathering of Israel back to their home is a key prophecy.
"For I will restore them to their own land which I gave to their fathers." Jer.16:15
"...Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side and bring them into their own land;" Ezek.37:21
"Gather yourselves together, yes, gather,
O nation without shame,
Before the decree takes effect -
The day passes like chaff -
Before the burning anger of the LORD comes upon you,
Before the day of the LORD'S anger comes upon you.
Seek the LORD ..." Zeph. 2:1-3
A generation is 70 years or so, says King David in Psalm 90:10. Add 70 years to 1948.
So, within this time period, "And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars ... nation will rise up against nation ... and there will be famines, pestilence and earthquakes in various places ... all these are the beginning of sorrows ... Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you and you will be hated by all nations for My names sake... many will betray one another and will hate one another ... many false prophets will rise up and deceive many... lawlessness will abound ... the love of many will grow cold ...[And then Jesus tells us specifically when He will return] ... "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached to all the nations, and then the end will come." Matt. 24:6-12, 14
The signs are here. And btw, the "Beast" with seven heads and ten horns is Islam and so the stage is being set in the Middle East. We are now witnessing Christians being persecuted throughout the Muslim world with the chopping off of heads -- this is his signature. "... Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands." Rev. 20:4
Apparently, in the old codex manuscripts, the mark of the beast was written down as 666 (Rev. 13:18), but when John wrote down the numbers, they were numerical values of letters in Arabic, not Greek and those three letters mean, "In the name of Allah" which is a mark that Muslims wear on their foreheads, arms or hands.
 
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keras

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Actually, we see from prophesies like Ezekiel 30:2-5 and Amos 1:1-15 plus many others, there won't be much left of the Islamic world after the Lord's Day of wrath.
The establishment of the State of Israel was the fulfilment of the 'budding of the fig tree', but not that of Isaiah 66:7-9, as the current Israel took 50 years to become a nation and the blessings of God to His people are not apparent in the Jews. The Day is yet to come when the Lord will remove all the 'evil neighbors' from His holy Land, including Judah, excepting for a remnant. Jeremiah 12:14, Isaiah 6:11-13
 
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Dave Watchman

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So my question for you. The bible survived 2 thousand years of destruction, contrary theology, different religions, wars, etc. When are we in this timeline according to the bible?

Hi Paul

I scour the net as well, especially the forums as that's where I think much of the new material can be found. The fact that "the bible survived 2 thousand years of destruction, contrary theology, different religions, wars, etc" is proof by itself that God wants us to understand where we are in it's chronology.

I think that the scoffer zone began during the 1st century but now they are following their own evil desires to a higher degree. I also think that the "falling away" has been underway and continuing but has now been enabled by technological gains to the point where the rebels have finally reached their limit. Just try to imagine life during the time that Jesus walked the earth and what those people would think about our modern inappropriate contentography and abortion industries that we have legalized and become accustomed to.

Medical technology and legal mandates have increased the numbers of annual abortions to levels that could never have been imagined in the last century. Laws governing the media industry have also enabled technological gains to spread inappropriate contentography at an unstoppable rate of speed. Now with the United States becoming the 21st nation legalizing sodomite marriage, it has the feel of living at the latter end of the kingdom of the rebels when they have reached their limit.

My view on the end times is very different than anyone else here. Similarly to Daniel 9, Revelation 12 contains one of the most misunderstood prophecies that spans about 1481 years. But it can make some uncomfortable to consider that the dragon has already become furious with the woman and has been preparing for the last 217 years to make war again on the rest of her offspring, on those who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus. We are here: - > "And he stood on the sand of the sea.

In the book of Revelation there are two very large prophetic time periods; 1260 years and 1000 years. These two are separated by a smaller prophetic time period of about 3.5 years. Including the intermissions that can be found separating these times, Revelation talks about approximately 3000 years from the time that Jesus was born until the start of our existence in the New Heavens and New Earth.

The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place.

The first prophetic time period in Revelation began in 538, just 443 years after it was written in 95. The 1260 years of Revelation 12 came to an end in 1798 when the beast received his mortal wound. We have been living in an intermission between two great periods of Christian persecution. We are 2/3s of the way through Revelation's story, living just prior to the events of the second coming and then the start of the thousand years of Revelation 20.

There are some who seem to think that the abomination that maketh desolate may have already been set up and is now currently standing where it ought not to be. If that's the case then the tribulation may have technically began with the countdown of the 1290 days from Daniel 12.

So I sort of think also that we may be like in the days again of John the Baptist. It's just that this time they're not asking him if he's Elijah the prophet anymore. They're asking him when is he going to build the third temple so that a 7 year tribulation can start..

"But the woman was given the two wings of the great eagle so that she might fly from the serpent into the wilderness,

And all this time the Eagle has landed.

ViewOfEarthFromMoon.JPG


Standing in the holy place.
 
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Paul K

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Today, there are many people who think that the bible is just a historical book, some even believe that its just a mythological book. I know one friend who believe in Jesus, but do not believe that the events written in the bible are true. He believe that its just symbolic and partly myth.

Yes, there are still a large percent of people who believe in Jesus, but many people are being led astray by science, and by humanities. (humanities are a belief that we are naturally good without God. Atheist belongs to this group, as do many other groups of people.)

Not only that, there are many new doctrines out there in the christian faith which confounds me. Some believe that Jesus already had His second coming back in 90 AD. Some believe that Noah's flood was a local event. I wonder do the 1st century christian ever face this type of infighting in their ranks? Do they face such variety in beliefs? What makes 1st century christians different than today?

P
 
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Paul K

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yes, they had trouble with the gnostics, not only that, they faced severe persecution from the romans, and where they were, they faced persecutions from the local folks. but what makes it different than now, is that they remained strong in their belief. Do people still stay strong in their stance in belief regardless of whats going on around them today in this age of knowledge?

P
 
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Paul K

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true. The bible do state that we should stay strong and steadfast in our faith until the end.

I am just wondering if I am the only one who notice things like this happening.
Also the reason why i set up this thread is to have some feedback, some support, some encouragement.

Isn't that what believers need the most in these time of troubles?

P
 
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keras

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Here are a few Bible verses to encourage those who are concerned about the future:

James 5:8 & 11 You must be patient for the coming of the Lord is near. See how Job stood firm through trials, then how the Lord blessed him in the end, for He is merciful and compassionate. [The next ‘coming’ – is the Lord’s Day of vengeance]

Ecclesiastes 8:5 One who is wise knows in his heart the right time and method for action.

Psalm 32:6-7 So let every faithful heart pray to You in the hour of anxiety, when great floods threaten, they shall not touch them. You are a hiding place from distress.

Psalm 12:5 Now I will arise, says the Lord – for the poor are plundered and the needy groan. I shall put them in a place of safety for which they long.

Jeremiah 51:50 You that escaped the sword, go, do not linger. Remember the Lord from afar and let Jerusalem come to your mind.

The best description of how the Lord will rescue His righteous people is:

Psalm 107:1-32 Let them give thanks, those who were redeemed by the Lord from the power of the enemy and gathered out of the lands from east, west, north and south.
Some lost their way in desert waste lands...they were hungry and thirsty...they cried to the Lord, He rescued them from their distress and led them to a city where they lived.
Some sat in the dark, prisoners, locked up because they had defied God’s commands. Their spirit was subdued by hard labour.... they cried to the Lord.. He saved them in their distress and brought them out of the dark.
Some were fools who took to rebellious ways, their punishment was revulsion to food.They nearly died, so they cried to the Lord and He saved them from their distress
Others there are at sea in ships; they see what marvellous things the Lord has done. At His command, storm winds rose and tossed them to and fro, in peril... they cried to the Lord... the storm abated and He guided them into a safe harbor.
Psalm 107:35-42 The desert He changes into lakes and in the arid land he makes springs of water. There He gives the hungry a home, they build themselves a town to live in, and they sow fields and plant vineyards which yield a good harvest.
He blesses them and their numbers grow, their herds and flocks increase.
Tyrants lose their strength and are brought low, He brings princes into contempt, they are banished into the desert. But the poor person, He lifts clear of his troubles and gives them prosperity. The upright see it and are glad, while evildoers are reduced to silence.

Psalm 107:43 Whoever is wise, let them lay these things to heart and ponder the loving deeds of the Lord.

Isaiah 46:4 Till you grow old – I am the Lord, and when white hairs come, I shall carry you still. I have made you, I shall uphold you. I shall carry you away to safety.

Psalm 23:4 Even though I walk through a valley of deepest darkness, I will fear no harm, for You are with me.

Psalm 91:14-16 Because your love holds fast to Me, I will deliver you. When you call, I shall answer, I will rescue you in a time of trouble and show My salvation.

Reference: REB, (some verses abridged)
 
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