Science vs. Christian

[Erik Nelson]

Jesus can add to what we receive from Moses because He is the Word of God. Also He is the Son of God so He has that authority.

Were the New Testament authors wrong to quote from the Septuagint over the masoretic?

 

[joshua 1 9]

Septuagint over the masoretic

Jesus said: "That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." The church is built on the foundation of the disciples. We would not have the teachings of Jesus if it were not for them.

 

[nolidad]

Of course we can trust the teaching of Jesus. The Hasidim only follow the teachings of Moses. So they only talk about what Moses & the Prophets tells us about the Messiah (Mashiah). That in and of itself has a lot of value to see the second coming from their perspective. Which for them is actually the first coming. They do not accept Jesus as the Lamb of God they only accept Him as the Lion of Judah. When the church is raptured out of the world they will again become God's witness here in this world. The age of Grace will have come to an end and for 7 years we will be under the law. When the sacrifices on the temple mount begins again.

The World will not be under the Mosaic Law again during the tribulation period . The sacrifices will begin again - but that in no means says God accepts those sacrifices.

Jesus fulfilled the Mosaic Law and thus ended it! People during the 70th week of Daniel are saved by grace through faith in the death burial and physical resurrection of Jesus!

 

[nolidad]

Jesus said: "That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." The church is built on the foundation of the disciples. We would not have the teachings of Jesus if it were not for them.

the church is built upon the rock that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of the living God!

 

[nolidad]

gatherers until genesis 3:19, then vegetarian farmers, yes

Adam tended to the garden of Eden. So he was a farmer.

Gen. 2: 15 And the Lord God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.

 

[Yekcidmij]

One of Ussher's mistakes is that he used the chronology of the MT without considering the different chronologies in the Septuagint (LXX) and Samaritan Pentateuch (SP). Not to mention the non-canonical Jewish works that had even different chronologies, such as the book of Jubilees.

This leaves too many unanswered questions about he nature of biblical chronologies to take Ussher seriously.

Here are another few of those questions.

(1) In the MT, it appears Methuselah may have died in the flood as the year of the flood is the same year as his death.

(2) In Genesis, do we really get the impression that Noah was alive during the time of Abraham? In the MT, he is - check the math. And do we have the impression that Adam was alive just prior to Noah's birth? In the MT he dies about 126 years before Noah is born and would have been alive during the time of Noah's father.

(3) Where is "Canain" son of Arphaxad? He's mentioned in Jesus' line in Luke 3.

Of course, the LXX isn't without questions as well, such as why Methuselah survives the flood and where does the extra name of "Canain" come from?

Nor is the SP without the same sorts of questions such as why Jared, Methuselah and Lamech all appear to have died by the flood (all 3 die in the year AM 1307, the year of the SP's flood). And do we have the impression that Adam was alive during Noah's time? In the SP he is (check it).

And all have the issue of parallel names between Cain and Seth's lines in Gen 4-5. And why is Naamah an Ammonite name - did Ammonites survive the flood?

 

[The Barbarian]

And all have the issue of parallel names between Cain and Seth's lines in Gen 4-5. And why is Naamah an Ammonite name - did Ammonites survive the flood?

They appear to have died out at the end of the Cretaceous, but their descendants are alive today:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/Nautilus_Palau.JPG

 

[Erik Nelson]

Jesus said: "That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." The church is built on the foundation of the disciples. We would not have the teachings of Jesus if it were not for them.

absolutely and they heavily favored the LXX over the Masoretic text

 

[Erik Nelson]

(2) In Genesis, do we really get the impression that Noah was alive during the time of Abraham? In the MT, he is - check the math. And do we have the impression that Adam was alive just prior to Noah's birth? In the MT he dies about 126 years before Noah is born and would have been alive during the time of Noah's father.

(3) Where is "Canain" son of Arphaxad? He's mentioned in Jesus' line in Luke 3.

Of course, the LXX isn't without questions as well, such as why Methuselah survives the flood and where does the extra name of "Canain" come from?

Nor is the SP without the same sorts of questions such as why Jared, Methuselah and Lamech all appear to have died by the flood (all 3 die in the year AM 1307, the year of the SP's flood). And do we have the impression that Adam was alive during Noah's time? In the SP he is (check it).

And all have the issue of parallel names between Cain and Seth's lines in Gen 4-5. And why is Naamah an Ammonite name - did Ammonites survive the flood?

View attachment 260648

That is on purpose in order to enable. The Identification. Of. Melchizedek. As Abraham. Accordingly, Abraham received the true priesthood of Melchizedek and passed it on to his descendants the Levites. which invalidates the claims of Jesus Christ to be the true priesthood order of Melchizedek over and against the priests of the temple.

Think it is in this video or one by the same author.

 

[Yekcidmij]

That is on purpose in order to enable. The Identification. Of. Melchizedek. As Abraham. Accordingly, Abraham received the true priesthood of Melchizedek and passed it on to his descendants the Levites. which invalidates the claims of Jesus Christ to be the true priesthood order of Melchizedek over and against the priests of the temple.

I'm not sure I follow your point.

 

[Erik Nelson]

I'm not sure I follow your point.

the M chronology explicitly undermines JC claims to be the true melchizedek priesthood over the Levites and Aaronites

major difference

 

[joshua 1 9]

absolutely and they heavily favored the LXX over the Masoretic text

As a general rule I look at what Moses tells us and take it from there. Also we can study the Hebrew letters and that gives us an even deeper understanding of the Torah.

Words do get changed though. Paul tells us: "As it is written: “There is no one righteous, not even one." (Romans 3:10) He was quoting Psalm 14:1 "There is no one who does good." Paul changed the word good to right. I wondered about this and I had a vision where Paul explained to me what David was talking about and what he was saying in Romans. For me it is as if Paul and David are not even talking about the same thing. Even though Paul is quoting what we received from David. Still their attitude is the same. For David we are called to be good in the eyes of God. For Paul we are to be righteous before God. Even though people do not always understand Paul.

2Peter3:16 " Paul also wrote you with the wisdom God gave him. 16 He writes this way in all his letters, speaking in them about such matters. Some parts of his letters are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction."

 

[joshua 1 9]

the M chronology explicitly undermines JC claims to be the true melchizedek priesthood over the Levites and Aaronites

major difference

The Mormons talk about the Melchizedek Priesthood as a higher calling compared to the Leviticus Priesthood. They take this pretty serious. At least the men do. These are the people that devote two years of their life to doing missionary work. Usually between high school and college. I invite them to the house to talk about this, but then my wife gets tired of it and does not invite them back.

 

[joshua 1 9]

nd do we have the impression that Adam was alive just prior to Noah's birth?

Noah's father was alive for a brief time when Adam was still alive. So he could have known Adam. But Noah and Adam were not alive at the same time.

 

[joshua 1 9]

why is Naamah an Ammonite name - did Ammonites survive the flood?

Naamah is the name of a city and given to name people that are from that city. Only 8 people survived the flood. Noah & his wife, their three sons and their three daughter in laws. The flood took place between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. Abraham was the first person to cross over the river. This is the meaning of the word Hebrew. The Arab Continental plate is 1500 by 1500 miles and everyone "Jew" or Muslim is descended from Abraham. This is the land given to Abraham and his descendants. This will become the New Jerusalem when Jesus returns.

This was a city attributed to the descendants of Cain but was given to the Tribe of Judah.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Abraham received the true priesthood of Melchizedek and passed it on to his descendants the Levites.

Apostolic succession is still an issue today in more then just the catholic church. Methodists and Lutherans believe they have Apostolic succession. Paul did not seem to think this was an issue: "12 What I mean is this: Individuals among you are saying, “I follow Paul,” “I follow Apollos,” “I follow Cephas,” or “I follow Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?"

 

[Yekcidmij]

Naamah is the name of a city and given to name people that are from that city.

Naamah is an Ammonite name.

1 Ki 14:21 / 1 Ki 14:31 ...His mother’s name was Naamah the Ammonite....

Naamah is also the same name as the sister of Tubal-Cain, whose descendants supposedly died in the flood.

 

[Yekcidmij]

Noah's father was alive for a brief time when Adam was still alive.

I just don't have that impression from reading the text. I think it's just a bald assertion that Adam knew Lamech.

So he could have known Adam. But Noah and Adam were not alive at the same time.

...at least in the MT.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Jesus fulfilled the Mosaic Law and thus ended it!

You need to read your Bible. "For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth shall pass away, not even one iota, nor one stroke of a letter, shall pass away from the law, until everything should happen." Matthew 15:8. There are around 300,000 letters in the Torah and those letters are made up of around 600,000 pen strokes. So Jesus goes beyond the letter of the law to each and every pen stroke.

 

[joshua 1 9]

I just don't have that impression from reading the text.

I do. In fact the genealogies are very east to follow from Adam to Abraham. ANY grade school child could handle that. After Abraham then the genealogies become more complicated.