Satan is history ?

[seekingtruth]

Thanks for the welcome, guys. Why does preterism make some people so uncomfortable? I don't get that at all.

There is way too much Flip Wilsonism around today IMO. "the devil made me do it" for those of you too young to remember Flip Wilson.

 

[parousia70]

Originally posted by seekingtruth


There is way too much Flip Wilsonism around today IMO. "the devil made me do it" for those of you too young to remember Flip Wilson.

Wasn't it actually "Geraldine" who used to say that?

 

[Hoonbaba]

Originally posted by seekingtruth
Thanks for the welcome, guys. Why does preterism make some people so uncomfortable? I don't get that at all.

There is way too much Flip Wilsonism around today IMO. "the devil made me do it" for those of you too young to remember Flip Wilson.

Hello again seekingtruth,

It seems as if it's 'too much' for many. If you were told, all your life, that your hope is Jesus's 2nd coming, and then suddenly people start saying it happened in the past, it easily discourages people. After I started reading the Bible myself, preterism started to make sense out of all the confusion. Of course we, preterists, do not have the same hope as non-preterists, since our hope is heaven, not some physical disappearance of Christians.

But anyway, I think full preterism is seriously just too much for people to handle. If anything partial preterism is understandable in orthodoxy, so now I just share partial preterism with others, unless people want to know about full preterism.

God bless!

-Jason

 

[RKF]

You know there is something wrong when you split even yourself: Preterest, half and full
The Bible says that a house divided against itself can't stand! hmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!

 

[parousia70]

Originally posted by RKF
You know there is something wrong when you split even yourself: Preterest, half and full
The Bible says that a house divided against itself can't stand! hmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!

Wouldn't you know! I took you off ignore just in time to see you finnaly post something of substance (sort of). It must be my lucky day!

Lets see, who's view has more divisions within?
Futurism :
Pre mil
post mil
amil,
pre trib
post trib
mid trib

Preterism :
Full
Partial

But wait!!! Partial preterism is actually another form of futurism since all partial preterists adhere to the belief in a future to us 2nd coming....lets do the math again:

Futurism :
Pre mil
post mil
amil,
pre trib
post trib
mid trib
Partial preterist futurism

Preterism :
Full







Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm indeed!

 

[Hishandmaiden]

Well, to each his own views.
But as I said earlier, I am a futurist, and thus, I hold futuristic view. Although I love to read all your views, I will say that I think futurist view is the correct view.
No offence meant.

 

[GW]

Originally posted by rpggal
Well, to each his own views.
But as I said earlier, I am a futurist, and thus, I hold futuristic view. Although I love to read all your views, I will say that I think futurist view is the correct view.
No offence meant.

Hi rpggal:

No offense taken.

Now, Jesus did address Matthew 24/Luke 21/Mark 13 to his apostles. Grammatically and contextually he was speaking to them about things that THEY were to see, according to Jesus. After Jesus walked them through the list he finishes by stating:

Matthew 24:33-34
So, YOU too [the apostles], when YOU see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door. Truly I say TO YOU [that] this generation will not pass away until all these things take place

Jesus prohesied that He would return in their generation and that his apostles would see all those signs promised. Christ's apostles are the "YOU" mentioned in nearly half the verses in Matt 24. We can trace Jesus' words here all the way back towards the beginning of his discourse where he said:

Matt 23:35-36
upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.


Jesus is not a false prophet. Jesus said clearly that it would be in his generation. Jesus taught WHEN he was bound to return, and all his apostles also taught a return of Chirst in the glory of the Father in their own lifetimes. They boldly declared that THEY were the last days generation (Heb 1:1-2; Acts 2:15-17; 1 Peter 1:20; 1 Cor 10:11; James 5:3; Heb 9:26).

We preterists simply believe them that they got it right and could not prophesy falsely.

 

[seekingtruth]

Hi RPG,

My whole family is seriously into Anime. My daughter designs and sells costumes to fans for conventions. She owns her own website. The work she does is pretty impressive.

Anyway, it's ok to disagree.

One question. Do you believe the Kingdom of God is also in the future? Are we waiting for it or did Christ come to establish it? He said it was "at hand", "near" and "at the door". He said some standing there would see it come. Did they?

Another question. Is the Kingdom of God the Millenial Reign of Christ? Are they the same?

These things are worth pondering and studying. I believe Jesus' teachings on the Kingdom are central to our faith.

It's nice to see your picture. That is very cool.

 

[seekingtruth]

Hey Spongebob aka Parousia70,

Wow. I'm impressed you remember Geraldine. I thought you were a young college guy. Do they show those old shows anywhere as re-runs? We get Andy Griffith, Lucy and a few others, but I've not seen many comedians re-run. I remember the Smothers Brothers too.

(Sorry for getting a little off topic. I'll stop now.)

 

[seekingtruth]

Good post, GW,

It is right there in the scripture. You have to stretch the meaning of generation to mean race or some such nonsense in order to say He didn't mean what He said. Then you have the problem of the other passage where He said "some of you standing here". No way that could mean some future generation.

 

[RKF]

I am not in any of those list, but if you were to list Bible believer, then you got me!

I am a christian not some title that the world has made up.
If it's in the Bible then I believe it!

I don't take info from other books that are not in the Bible to help explain the Bible,

I don't adhere to teachings from any one that doesn't fit the Bibles criteria of a christian

I could list names, but that would offend some, ok I'll name one, Benny Hinn

I don't like the way the preterest have destroyed this and other forums by not allowing others to have conversations without telling us NO that happened in 70ad etc.......

I don't mean to be rude but I am very adamant in my beliefs and I have studied the Bible for 15 or so years
and this is the first time that I have come across your views(preterism)

If they are to be believed, then how do you explain the coming one world government and the Jews trying to build the third temple, In fact the state of the whole world ?

 

[GW]

Originally posted by seekingtruth
Good post, GW,

It is right there in the scripture. You have to stretch the meaning of generation to mean race or some such nonsense in order to say He didn't mean what He said. Then you have the problem of the other passage where He said "some of you standing here". No way that could mean some future generation.

Exactly, seekingtruth. Jesus is no false prophet, and neither are the apostles. They knew exactly which generation was the last days generation -- their own.

If they erred then Christianity is based on false prophets. As it has been rightly said:


"If Jesus returned within His generation, then the Futurist view is a lie.
If Jesus didn?t return within His generation, then Christianity is a lie."

 

[Catchup]

Universal Creeds and Calvinistic Confessions

The Nicene Creed says this about the final judgment by Jesus Christ:


He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He shall come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end.


The Apostles Creed says this:


He ascended into Heaven, and is seated at the right hand of the God the Father Almighty. From there he will come again to judge the living and the dead.


The Athanasian Creed says this:


He ascended into heaven, is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty, and from there he will come to judge the living and the dead. At his coming all people will rise again with their own bodies to answer for their personal deeds. Those who have done good will enter eternal life, but those who have done evil will go into everlasting fire.


It adds this warning: "This is the true Christian Faith. Whoever does not faithfully and firmly believe this cannot be saved."

In these formulations, God's final corporate judgment of both the resurrected living and the resurrected dead is said to take place in the future. It cannot have been an event in A.D. 70. This eschatological affirmation is denied by all heretical preterists.

This is the official eschatology of the Christian church. It has been so from the beginning, when the New Testament's texts were written. This view extended through the first three centuries of the church until the earliest creeds were formulated. The men who formulated the judicial statements that have defined the Christian faith institutionally had no doubt about what the New Testament teaches regarding the last days. The church has been clear for almost two millennia that anyone who denies these views is a heretic. Therefore he who denies this view of the future and who remains voluntarily as a member of the church is a subversive. He remains in the institutional church in order to undermine the Christian faith and steal God's church, as surely as Arius and his followers were subversives who were trying to capture the church for the devil.

LOVE

 

[GW]

Catchup,

Are you Roman Catholic?

If not, I should remind you that you are outside of their creeds too on many, many points and therefore are likely to be damned since this statment also applies to ALL non-catholics who do not keep creedal ("Catholic") orthodoxy:

"This is the true Christian Faith. Whoever does not faithfully and firmly believe this cannot be saved."


BTW, the Catholics who wrote those creeds you cited did NOT believe in a literal 1000 years or a rapture as you do. They DID, however, believe the great tribulation was past (AD 66-70) and went on to officially regard any who hold a LITERAL 1000-years reign as a heretic against Christ and the Church. This happened at the council of Ephesus at 431AD.

You are a heretic according to creedal orthodoxy and are likely to be damned (according to the creeds).

Are you a Catholic? You might want to become one fast if you are as concerned about damnation via the creeds as you seem.